[Low Fidelity]

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Did you know that the Adobe suite of software is essentially the same on both OS X and Windows?

yes, but windows and OS X are considerably different.

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Did you know that Windows supports directx?

yes, but the real question is: DirectX or OpenGL?

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Did you know that there are many proprietary applications written for Windows?

yes, just as there are many proprietary applications written for OS X. Linux is gaining ground!

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Did you know that the thing that OS X does best (multi-threaded/SMP threaded apps), Linux does much, much better (faster, more efficient)?

Absolutely. The more drivers and applications are released for linux, the more linux will gain in populatiry and the more popularity linux gains, the more drivers and applications are released...

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Did you know you can legally build your own computer, and put Windows on it? (Unlike OS X, the license doesn't allow that, OS X can only legally be run on a Mac. And considering Apple doesn't use any proprietary hardware anymore, one can just go out and get every part in, oh, say a Mac Pro, and have just as stable a computer, for less, and probably in a nice looking case?)

yes. When OS X license allows installation directly onto an industry standard architecture i'll be the first in line to buy a 5 pack of licenses. All my cases sit behind my monitors anyway, aesthetics aren't a deciding factor unless its really ugly, gawdy or my 13 year says Cool.

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[My mantra is every OS sucks. But people that bash one OS are complete idiots. Apple and Nintendo are just as bad as Microsoft and Sony.]

I'm pointing out that Windows sucks out of the box AND its popularity makes it suck worse. It is bloated with sloppy code and its universal populatiry make it a hacker/crackers dream for maximum amount of targets for the least amount of work.

One side is like your car. How about whoever builds it but it doesn't run efficiently (if at all) unless you pay MORE on a monthly subscription to keep it tuned up. Then there's the issue of maybe you can't drive another manufacturer's car on certain roads because of licensing agreements.

And finally, malicious code can be picked up that shuts down

Now if apple wanted $350 for an ipod, then wanted $20 a month to keep it running (not counting the whole fair use argument) then yeah, i'd get a bit chaffed over it.

but it doesn't. It makes a large capacity music player that draws some concessions to keep the price lower that arguably is the most stable and nicest looking units you can listen to. it also makes smaller, more portable/compact units for a greater mass appeal to those who just want a few gigs of storage.

They continually improve their product. You can strip off the OS and load free Firmware and you don't even need to use itunes if you don't want to.

Personally, I don't see what there is to hate about it.

Unless you don't drive a ford because of the Edsel.

 

[Milk and Coffee]

@ozz: didn't get the point dude (especially the second part of your posting) ... maybe because of my just average english

 

[INGRAMLI]

I own an iPod.
I hate the fact that the post DAC stage is no good. And the noise is too high.
I hate the fact that Apple switched to Cirrus instead of Wolfson, which was no good to the (subjective)SQ in the latest iPod.
I hate the fact that the battery is not user replaceable(at least it is not "supposed" to be replaced by user).
I hate the fact that Apple charge a prohibitive price for repairs after the warranty period of 2 yrs(i got it extended).
I hate the fact that the ipods do not have a durable housing(except several models).
I hate the fact that i need to go iMod to get a really great line-out.
I hate the fact that the playback time for lossless/wav is too short.
and more.....................

Back to the reality. Guess what?

You can't find an DAP with the storage capacity that the latest iPod has since 5th gen.
You can't find a brand that has repair centres that cover a wider part of world than Apple does.
You can't find a controling device that is better than the click-wheel of iPod(it is subjective though).
You can't find a HDD based DAP that has a longer playback time than the latest iPod.
You can't find a DAP that use top-of-the-line DACs of any major brand, Sony, Bose, Kenwood, Toshiba, iRiver....none of them use a AD1955, or PCM1792, or WM8740, or even CS4398. None of them ever appear on DAP.
You can't find a DAP that has got nearly as much variety of accessories as iPod has.
You can't find a brand that provides a wider variety of TV programmes/Podcast than the iPod+iTunes have.

I do not like Apple much. And i always hope there is something that can do better.But, up to this moment, i don't really see there is any "TRUE ALTERNATIVE" that can replace the job that iPod does.
Let's face it. Life is a bitch, and so does iPod.

 

[markopolo]

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Originally Posted by INGRAMLI /img/forum/go_quote.gif I own an iPod. I hate the fact that the post DAC stage is no good. And the noise is too high. I hate the fact that Apple switched to Cirrus instead of Wolfson, which was no good to the (subjective)SQ in the latest iPod. I hate the fact that the battery is not user replaceable(at least it is not "supposed" to be replaced by user). I hate the fact that Apple charge a prohibitive price for repairs after the warranty period of 2 yrs(i got it extended). I hate the fact that the ipods do not have a durable housing(except several models). I hate the fact that i need to go iMod to get a really great line-out. I hate the fact that the playback time for lossless/wav is too short. and more..................... Back to the reality. Guess what? You can't find an DAP with the storage capacity that the latest iPod has since 5th gen. You can't find a brand that has repair centres that cover a wider part of world than Apple does. You can't find a controling device that is better than the click-wheel of iPod(it is sujective though). You can't find a HDD based DAP that has a longer playback time than the latest iPod. You can't a DAP that use top-of-the-line DACs of any major brand, Sony, Bose, Kenwood, Toshiba, iRiver....none of them use a AD1955, or PCM1792, or WM8740, or even CS4398. None of them ever appear on DAP. You can't find a DAP that has got nearly as much variety of accessories as iPod has. You can't find a brand that provides a wider variety of TV programmes/Podcast than the iPod+iTunes have. I do not like Apple much. And i always hope there is something that can do better.But, up to this moment, i don't really see there is any "TRUE ALTERNATIVE" that can replace the job that iPod does. Let's face it. Life is a bitch, and so does iPod.

Amen, brother. You nailed it.

 

[luckypictures]

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Originally Posted by Disiskurt /img/forum/go_quote.gif Care to show me an 80GB MP3 player for any cheaper than the iPod? The earlier gen iPods used to be royal rip-offs, but over the last two years they've become reasonably priced and is now one of the only high capacity hard drive players in production in the US. The Zune is currently a gimmicky alternative with somewhat better sound quality and terrible battery life. Show me this superior competition this "Bose of mp3 players" is unjustly outselling.

Terrible battery life, really? I mean, I've managed to watch 3 movies from beginning to end before it died, and I've gotten pretty damn good play time from music. I'd say about 12 hours, playing around intermittently, viewing photos, et cetera. Is that considered terrible nowadays? I don't know.

I thought the 5.5gen ipod was about the same. Which places the Zune at equivalent. And remember, the Zune didn't just come out in the last month.

Ps - Original guy, wait two weeks, buy a new Zune, join the Dark Side.

 

[zip22]

3 movies? you must have a super zune or watch very short movies. its rated for 4 hours, cnet got 3.6. also of note is that they got 13.2 hours audio for the zune and 14.7 hours from the old ipod video. the new ipod blows the zune away, but you already knew that.

 

[sno1man]

this post just rehashes all of the things that have said by all of the fanboys from all sides ad nauseum.

Apple makes some great and some not so great products
Creative makes some great and some not so great products
Sony makes some great and some not so great products
Microsoft makes some great and some not so great products
Samsung makes some great and some not so great products

you get the point. What is interesting is specific comparisons btewen competing products.

For instance my zune (though i rarely use it) definitely sounds different then my new classic. Even I cant say that either is better just different. I do perfer the screen on the zune for video, but prefer the interface on the ipod

 

[OverlordXenu]

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Originally Posted by Low Fidelity /img/forum/go_quote.gif yes, but windows and OS X are considerably different. yes, but the real question is: DirectX or OpenGL? yes, just as there are many proprietary applications written for OS X. Linux is gaining ground! Absolutely. The more drivers and applications are released for linux, the more linux will gain in populatiry and the more popularity linux gains, the more drivers and applications are released... yes. When OS X license allows installation directly onto an industry standard architecture i'll be the first in line to buy a 5 pack of licenses. All my cases sit behind my monitors anyway, aesthetics aren't a deciding factor unless its really ugly, gawdy or my 13 year says Cool. I'm pointing out that Windows sucks out of the box AND its popularity makes it suck worse. It is bloated with sloppy code and its universal populatiry make it a hacker/crackers dream for maximum amount of targets for the least amount of work. One side is like your car. How about whoever builds it but it doesn't run efficiently (if at all) unless you pay MORE on a monthly subscription to keep it tuned up. Then there's the issue of maybe you can't drive another manufacturer's car on certain roads because of licensing agreements. And finally, malicious code can be picked up that shuts down

Oh, ok, so you aren't a fanboy. Yes, I agree. Do you know what I meant by multi/smp threaded apps? I mean apps like CAD, that can use more than 2 cores.

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Now if apple wanted $350 for an ipod, then wanted $20 a month to keep it running (not counting the whole fair use argument) then yeah, i'd get a bit chaffed over it. but it doesn't. It makes a large capacity music player that draws some concessions to keep the price lower that arguably is the most stable and nicest looking units you can listen to. it also makes smaller, more portable/compact units for a greater mass appeal to those who just want a few gigs of storage. They continually improve their product. You can strip off the OS and load free Firmware and you don't even need to use itunes if you don't want to. Personally, I don't see what there is to hate about it. Unless you don't drive a ford because of the Edsel.

I don't see MS charging $20 a month for support.

Also, you can't rockbox the new ipods, yet, at least.

 

[appophylite]

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Originally Posted by Low Fidelity /img/forum/go_quote.gif cnet reviews the archos here. Too bad its geared more for video than audio.

That doesn't mean that its bad for music; the Archos 60X line has rather good sound quality, even straight out of the headphone jack. Granted it's rather larger than the iPod, but you get a better screen for video viewing, and its still fairly pocketable.

My sister has a 3G iPod, 1G iPod Mini and 1G iPod shuffle, all of which I had to set up for her. I had to say that I did not care much for the hassle I had to go through setting up the 3G for the first time (although I think that the newer iPods are easier to set up). I much preferred the approach Archos takes where you can run it through Windows Media, or, if you are like me and don't want the hassle of dealing with media software, just straight up run as a UMD and drag-and-drop the music and videos straight onto it.

 

[digitalcat]

Congratulations, you are now officially a member of team Frivolous Title.

 

[Low Fidelity]

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Do you know what I meant by multi/smp threaded apps? I mean apps like CAD, that can use more than 2 cores.

technically, we're talking about Symmetric multiprocessing. Now you've left the field of at home "casual computing" and really gotten into the hard number crunching side of life. And I think there lies a very clear, distinct difference. That line separates the "hobbyist" from the "entrepreneur."

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I don't see MS charging $20 a month for support.

You're so right. I exaggerated. Microsoft charges $50 a year to cover 3 computers. Thats very far from the $240 I threw around, but my point still stands.

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That doesn't mean that its bad for music; the Archos 60X line has rather good sound quality, even straight out of the headphone jack. Granted it's rather larger than the iPod, but you get a better screen for video viewing, and its still fairly pocketable. My sister has a 3G iPod, 1G iPod Mini and 1G iPod shuffle, all of which I had to set up for her. I had to say that I did not care much for the hassle I had to go through setting up the 3G for the first time (although I think that the newer iPods are easier to set up). I much preferred the approach Archos takes where you can run it through Windows Media, or, if you are like me and don't want the hassle of dealing with media software, just straight up run as a UMD and drag-and-drop the music and videos straight onto it.

Again, we're talking about products that are generations old and have been redesigned.

I wish I could drag and drop music into my ipod and boom, its good to go. There are a lot of shortcomings the ipod carries with it and there are a lot of things I wish I could change about it, but I can't. Rockbox isn't a viable solution IMO, even for the two 5gs I have (my wife's 30g and my 80g).

But for what I use it for, I haven't found a better product...yet.

Thanks for the points and the feedback.

 

[Low Fidelity]

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Congratulations, you are now officially a member of team Frivolous Title.

Yay me!

Cheers and beers all around!

 

[ozz]

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Originally Posted by Milk and Coffee /img/forum/go_quote.gif @ozz: didn't get the point dude (especially the second part of your posting) ... maybe because of my just average english

it was intended for those who hate the i-pod due to popularity almost
the most ignorant thing i have heard.

 

[OverlordXenu]

Low Fidelity, well, I wouldn't call someone who works with Photoshop, illustrator, fireworks, and whatnot heavily for design/web design a casual user, which is was I was trying to get at.

Mainly, I'm trying to say that OS X is no more special than Windows, nor Linux. I just really, really, really, REALLY hate fanboys. They think their brand is the best, and that they can do no wrong. That is pretty much the only thing I don't like about Apple...The fanboys! (I once met a fanboy who honestly thought OS X was a better server OS than a good Linux distro[is that the correct spelling?], for basic stuff like a webserver.)

And yet, one of my close friends absolutely adores Apple, but somehow, he isn't a fanboy. He uses Apple's products, because he likes them. He doesn't use them because he thinks they are the be all and end all, that nothing else can top them.

I suppose that's the distinction between consumer and fanboy.

 

[ozz]

i own both a dell and a mac they both have good and bad points
have not tried linux but between the 2 i have i find myself using
osx and mac more and more each day but i am glad there are
more than one os because it makes them strive harder each year
for your paycheck and mine.