[kayser]

Hi everyone!
I've been reading head-fi for quite a long period of time and felt no use in registering. But now I face several problems in choosing a DAP, so need some help

At the moment I'm using an iPhone 3g as a DAP (and also as a phone) + LOD + FiiO E5 + Westone 3 with custom tips. Not completely satisfied with the SQ though. So, I'm thinking of an RSA Mustang as an amp. But I can't decide on the DAP.
It's not very convenient to use a phone as a DAP, so I'd like to sell my iPhone and buy a new DAP with line-out. I personally like the SQ of my iPhone. Moreover, I'm not an "itunes hater" and i have all my music in ALAC. So want to buy an iPod. Is there any point to change iPhone 3g on an iPod? Wich iPod has the best SQ from the line-out? Which one is the best to use with a Mustang and Westone 3? Maybe I should take a look at Sony/Sandisk/Cowon?
Please, need help! This choosing problem drives me crazy!

BTW, sorry for my English. I leave in Moscow, Russia, so English is not my native language

 

[GreatDane]

Welcome to Head-Fi. Your English typing skill is better than some native speaking members.

I only have a 1G touch which I don't think is as good as your iPhone, SQ wise...not sure.

If you want to stick with an Apple product and need more storage then I see no reason not to buy an iPod...120GB Classic or you might find a used or refurb 160 GB Classic. Even the older 5.5G 80GB is great since it can use Rockbox firmware which would offer a nice EQ and tons of useful features not found with the Apple firmware.

The Mustang is a great amp from all that I've read. I'm hoping to have a Mustang soon myself.

I don't have experience with the Westone 3 but I believe that most IEMs benefit from a nice amp, preferably a mid to high-end amp and using a line out from the DAP also.

If you don't need more storage space for your music and you're happy with the iPhone as a phone(who wouldn't be), then I recommend trying the amp upgrade first. I'm not sure about the availability of line out use for the 3G iPhone.

Also, there isn't a big enough difference in SQ between the 5G and 6G iPods to worry about...IMO,IME. Since you like iTunes as I do it makes better sense to continue using it.

 

[kayser]

Thanks for reply

Besides iPod, I've started thinking of M-Audio Microtrack II recently. What do you think?

 

[GreatDane]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kayser /img/forum/go_quote.gif Thanks for reply Besides iPod, I've started thinking of M-Audio Microtrack II recently. What do you think?

I wondered about using one of those type devices and started a thread some time ago.

That M-Audio is around $300. I decided against buying one of those toys after considering what you can and can't do with them.

 

[qusp]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kayser /img/forum/go_quote.gif Thanks for reply Besides iPod, I've started thinking of M-Audio Microtrack II recently. What do you think?

I think buying something where they've spent a lot of time and taken a lot of memory with features you may not even use and dont have any bearing on output is questionable. not much talk of the microtrack around here although the expandability is attractive. I would worry about a clunky interface and too complicated menus, possibly not ongoing support as well. get a 5.5G ipood and upgrade the HD to a 120 or even 240gb drive. IMO they sound better via line out than the new classics

 

[GreatDane]

The Korg looks pretty sweet IMO though.

 

[kayser]

I had a chance to appreciate the SQ of the Microtrack and it's definitely better than the SQ of my iPhone 3g. BTW, the menu is very simple. You move from one folder to another using a kind of jog-deal and the menu-button to move back. You can use Mp3s and WAVs with no problems. But the Microtrack works only for about 5 hours and is rather bulky.
Though only today I've read a review from a guy who purchased the Korg like a week ago. He says the Korg is far better than the Microtrack if using an amp (he uses RSA Predator). But the Microtrack wins if you're not going to use any amp, as the Microtrack's HP-out is better. The Korg works for 2 hours but that guy has modified it and now he has a Korg 32gb CF flash-mode that works for 5 hours

So, his conclusion - the Korg is worth its price but only if modified and with a good amp.

 

[qusp]

the korg would sound fantastic; i've used korg synths and recording gear for many years; they sound bloody brilliant. but 5hrs AFTER MOD thats ridiculous for a dap and I expect thats with a fresh new battery, probably goes down to 3-4 after a year or so

 

[kayser]

qusp, I guess you are right. Considring the fact that the battery is 2000 mAh, 5 hours is not much. But the sound...

BTW, is there any difference in SQ via LO between 5g and 5.5g iPods? I've read about better SQ of 5/5.5g iPods, but I have also read about the hiss. Moreover, not everyone thinks that the Classic is worse than the Video. And another question: will the sonud be much better with the Mustang? 'Cause with FiiO E5 I can't say there is a huge difference.

 

[qusp]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kayser /img/forum/go_quote.gif qusp, I guess you are right. Considring the fact that the battery is 2000 mAh, 5 hours is not much. But the sound...

sure, but its a portable player, I actually like to be able to say....use my ipod for a flight, or long bus trip. not an option with this, you would have to be constantly putting it to sleep or turning it off more likely, because you wouldnt want to waste those precious few minutes while it goes to sleep.



Quote:

BTW, is there any difference in SQ via LO between 5g and 5.5g iPods? I've read about better SQ of 5/5.5g iPods, but I have also read about the hiss.

no difference in sound quality whatsoever; whoever said that must be imagining things. the circuitry is identical only difference is the 5.5G has a brighter screen and the 80gb version of the 5.5 has more onboard memory on the logic board. trust me they are interchangeable I spend quite a bit of time tinkering with them (DIYMODDING) and they sound the same. the hiss is not from lineout, its from the HP out with some sensitive HP's. ipods produce no noticeable hiss from the lineout IMO. and with a modded lineout they sound brilliant; IMO the best sounding analogue output dap by a decent margin especially with the right caps and amp.


Quote:

Moreover, not everyone thinks that the Classic is worse than the Video. And another question: will the sonud be much better with the Mustang? 'Cause with FiiO E5 I can't say there is a huge difference.

Of course they dont, not everyone thinks or hears the same; the classic has a lower noise-floor and slightly more bass-slam, but to me doesnt sound near as natural or have as good imaging and soundstage as the 5-5.5G and its wolfston DAC. and yeah, if you want more space; get a larger HD; 240gb will be available next month. I would get a pico or other amp than mustang, but then i'm not a big RSA amp fan; only one I like is the original SR71. the fiio only helps to up the volume really IMO and does seem to synergize well with some phones, but not really the worlds best amp. you will get much better results with a nice amp . what HP's are you using??

OH and of course another major drawcard of 5-5.5G is that it can be DIYMODDED, to bring it to another level alltogether

 

[kayser]

I'm using Westone 3 with custom tips. And I was attracted by the Mustang because of the lithium ion battery, the size and the fact that it's not DAC (I simply don't need it). I have also read about excellent SQ and good compatibility with W3. Why do you think Pico would be better?
As to the space, I think 30gb will be enough for me if I use lossless (not WAV). And I'm pretty much sure that I'll never IMOD or DIYMOD the iPod

 

[GreatDane]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kayser /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'm using Westone 3 with custom tips. And I was attracted by the Mustang because of the lithium ion battery, the size and the fact that it's not DAC (I simply don't need it). I have also read about excellent SQ and good compatibility with W3. Why do you think Pico would be better? As to the space, I think 30gb will be enough for me if I use lossless (not WAV). And I'm pretty much sure that I'll never IMOD or DIYMOD the iPod

You can buy the non-DAC version of Pico and it's less expensive...it also has Li-ion and is pretty darn small too. I can't comment on how the 2 amps compare SQ wise because I don't own a Mustang...yet.

 

[qusp]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kayser /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'm using Westone 3 with custom tips. And I was attracted by the Mustang because of the lithium ion battery, the size and the fact that it's not DAC (I simply don't need it). I have also read about excellent SQ and good compatibility with W3. Why do you think Pico would be better? As to the space, I think 30gb will be enough for me if I use lossless (not WAV). And I'm pretty much sure that I'll never IMOD or DIYMOD the iPod

you say that now

30gb is bugger all lossless.

like I said, not a big fan of RSA amps, for me their errrmmm euphonic SQ is unappealing. and as greatdane said; the pico comes in amp only like mine (actually for less money than mustang, is quite small too and also has lithion battery. the W3 already has a bit of a bass 'hump' and I dont think it needs any more bass. pico is still a little warm in the midrange, but only a touch, the highs are to die for and the bass is very clean and extended, but not lacking in slam. HA himself prefers pico with W3 and he has arguably the biggest collection of portable amps. I think the only reason I would pick up a mustang is if I didnt have lisa III and wanted a portable to drive fullsize HP's. because it has 3 gain switch positions. but since I have lisa well who cares

 

[kayser]

Omg. I was quite sure about the amp, I should say

Has anybody else compared the Pico with the Mustang? I have also Sennheiser HD 580. Will the Pico be enough to drive them?

 

[GreatDane]

I often use my Pico to drive my HD 650 and it does a very good job.

I don't recall too many "official" reviews that directly compare the Pico to Mustang. Head-Fi member Skylab has reviewed many portable amps(and desktop amps too).

From his massive portable-amp-roundup thread, here are his Pico and Mustang reviews:

Pico


I received a loaner of the Headamp Pico from a friend of mine. There was so much interest in this amp, I really wanted to get a chance to listen to one. And I’m not sure of I am glad I did – it’s so good, I now want to buy one! But I need another portable amp like I need a hole in my head.

I listened to the Pico for several hours straight, by itself, and then directly compared it to the iQube and the Meier Move. The Pico had been broken in prior to my receiving it.

Build Quality: A+: What a beauty! Glossy finished metal case, mine in a sort of rust-copper color. By far the prettiest portable headphone amp I have ever seen. Also small and sturdy. TOTALLY quiet operation. Zero turn-on tick. Truly impressive to look at, and it’s the kind of thing that you just WANT when you see it.

Treble: A: clean, delicate, smooth, grain-free, extended and transparent. Perhaps just ever so slightly less top end extension than the LISA or the iQube, but its treble is a DELIGHT. It sounds RIGHT. Never even a HINT of aggressiveness.

Midrange: A+: All I can say here is WOW. The best midrange of any portable headphone amp I have ever heard. I am listening to it now, and just describing it gives me goose-bumps. THIS is tube-like lushness with no opaqueness at all, Yeah, it’s just warm of neutral, but who cares? I could listen to this midrange for the rest of my life and be very happy with it. NICE. If you care about vocal reproduction, especially female vocals, THIS is the portable headphone amp for you. Listening to Kate Havnevik and Imogen Heap on the Pico was an unbelievable treat.

Bass: A: Tuneful, punchy bass. Certainly plenty deep enough. There are amps with slightly more powerful bass, but not by a lot, and the bass quality is excellent. The bass on Tristania’s “World of Glass” was very punchy, but not quite as deep as I get from the iQube.

Neutrality: A: Hmmmm…what to say here. I know the Pico isn’t strictly tonally neutral, but it doesn’t sound colored – it’s just slightly warm/lush. But again, not in a way some amps are that make them sound colored – the Pico sounds like its playing music correctly, so it’s hard to fault its presentation.
Soundstaging: A: The soundstage was VERY deep, and very well defined, but it wasn't the WORLD's widest. That said, the Pico has excellent imaging capabilities – ever so slightly better than the iQube or Meier Move (which I was able to directly compare it to).

Transparency: A: Again, the magic of the Pico is the fact that it’s slightly lush sounding, but still remains highly transparent. This is no easy trick, and many lesser amps have tried this and failed. The Pico pulls it off, and extremely well. Very impressive to me.

What a time we are in – SO many world class portable headphone amps, it’s crazy. The Pico is a huge winner, though. As an FYI, I reviewed the AMP ONLY version, so please don’t ask me how the DAC sounds.I confess I have not been very active reading about the launch of this amp, and I am not sure what the exact production situation with the amp is, in terms of its being readily available. I do know that it sounds fantastic, and combined with its world-class aesthetic design, make it an amp worth seeking out!

P-51 Mustang



I received a loaner of the new Mustang P-51 portable headphone amp from Ray Samuels Audio. The impossibly small Mustang is quite full featured – lithium Ion battery built in, 3 gain settings. Smaller even that the Tomahawk. Same styling as other RSA amps, which is to say a very attractive anodized metal case. The Mustang, according to Ray, can deliver more than 2 times the amount of current that a Tomahawk can. Pretty impressive.

Headphones used for this review were the Audio Technica AT-ESW9, Kenwood K1000, and the Sennheiser PXC-350.

Build Quality: A+: Attractive metal case, properly sized metal knob, very sturdy connectors. Doesn’t get any better.

Treble: A: Amazingly smooth and musical, and yet highly detailed. Maybe not quite as extended as the iQube, but if not, very close. Slightly more extended than the Meier 2Move. The unusual instrumentation on Joanna Newsome’s “Cosmia” was very well rendered.

Midrange: A++: OK, here it comes – the best mids of any portable headphone amp EVER. Yes, this includes the iQube, 2Move, and any of Ray’s other amps. The mids on the Mustang have to be heard to be believed. I was SHOCKED. So pretty, so lush and liquid, and yet so neutral and transparent. Joanna Newsome’s harp and voice on “Cosmia” were so good I truly got shivers and goosebumps. The Mustang’s mids are nothing short of THRILLING.

Bass: A+: Full, tight, tuneful, punchy, deep bass. RSA amps all have great bass, and this one is no exception. No bloat, but lots of meat. Really nice. Just about the perfect combination of fullness, power, and control.

Neutrality: A+: Is it just a touch warm? Probably. Does this make it sound colored? NO WAY. It sounds completely natural – maybe to a level I haven’t quite experienced.

Soundstaging: A: The soundstage was deep, wide, and very well defined. It isn’t quite as good iQube in this regard, but this still will not be seen as a shortcoming.

Transparency: A+: It’s amazingly transparent – it has a jaw-droppingly open, clear, are grain-free sound. It really excels here. Music just naturally flows out of the Mustang, in a liquid, natural way.

WOW. The Mustang is a real achievement in terms of portable headphone amps, in absolute terms, let alone for one that is so small. In fact it is hard for me to accept how such a small little headphone amp can sound so very good. But it sounds EXCELLENT. In my opinion, it is the best sounding RSA portable amp I have reviewed (I have not reviewed the SR71A Blackbird, but all the others).

The Mustang takes its place at the very top of the pyramid in the world of portable headphone amps. It’s terrific, and I cannot recommend it highly enough. For the price, at this level of quality, it’s even a bargain. It was so good, it actually required a bit of re-ranking at the top of my list.