[Pierre Lambion]

Looks like the ipod will be usable with windows, thanks to a third party software. You still need a firexire port of course.

Check out: http://www.mediafour.com/products/xpod/

P.

 

[chych]

Oh oh... are those the Apple lawyers I hear in the background, just waiting for this little piece of software to surface?

 

[Neruda]

Woohoo! Wooohoohooohoooo! Wheee! Yippeee! haahaahaa!

 

[Russ Arcuri]

A few comments.

1. Apple would be nuts to sue anyone who came out with software that easily increases their potential market for the iPod by 20X. More likely, (and I'm no business expert, so take this with a grain of salt) they would purchase the software if it was good or ignore it if it wasn't.

2. If I was exclusively a Windows user, I would probably wait until Apple released iTunes for Windows rather than going with the xPod software. iTunes 2 is easily the best software out there for any platform when it comes to ripping, mixing, organizing, and burning music. I don't mean from a technical perspective, in which case it's probably debateable; I mean from a user interface perspective. iTunes rules for that reason, and its tight integration with the iPod is even more reason to wait for Apple's solution than to jump on the first third-party solution that comes along.

3. Apple would be nuts not to come out with a Windows flavor of iTunes for use with the iPod. As I pointed out in #1, it would open up the potential market for iPods to 20X the current market.

Russ "The Peripatetic Audiophile"

 

[chych]

1. Dude. Apple would be nuts not to sue about this... if they buy it, which is highly unlikely, they will never release it. Most likely they already have a version of iTunes or something to transfer to the iPod on windows, and they don't WANT to release it. Apple created the iPod not to sell iPods, but to sell Macs.

2. Same reason as above. iTunes, which is free, exists for Macs and to sell Macs. They will never release a Windows version. Never going to happen, ever.

3. Same reasons as above.

 

[Russ Arcuri]

chych -- I know that's what some people think -- that the purpose of the iPod is to make Windows users defect -- but that's just not the case. Apple execs have already hinted that a Windows version may be coming -- which they would NEVER do if they wanted people to buy Macs just to use the iPod.

Note that there ARE people out there who will buy a $799 iMac just to use the iPod. But there aren't many who would do that, and Apple knows it.

Besides, Apple has no legal grounds for suing the xPod people. If they did then they would sue all those linux distributors that sell Mac distros. The software would simply provide connectivity between a device that Apple sells and computers which aren't currently supported. Nothing to sue over. (Yes, I know you can sue anyone for anything, but as I said above, the only thing xPod software could do to Apple is increase their iPod sales. People may think Apple is lawsuit happy, but they're not stupid.)

Russ "The Peripatetic Audiophile"

 

[Neruda]

Quote:

Originally posted by chych Apple created the iPod not to sell iPods, but to sell Macs.

I don't think that's true at all. Very few people would be willing to buy a new computer and get used to new software simply because of a portable device. Have you seen anyone here say that they'll buy a mac simply to use the I-Pod? I haven't. And I certainly won't.

 

[Pierre Lambion]

And many in the computer industry expect the internet an dportable appliances to develop into a market much larger than personal computer ...

So the Ipod could be more important for Apple than Mac hardware.

P.

 

[coolvij]

oh come on, now, chych............the iPod couldn't possibly convince anyone to get a new computer............

 

[Russ Arcuri]

>> ....the iPod couldn't possibly convince anyone to get a new computer...

Sure it could. But it would have to be the right kind of person... Someone with plenty of disposable income.

It couls also be the hypothetical "straw" that breaks the camel's back... i.e., someone who's been thinking about getting a Mac for whatever reason, and now the fact that the iPod works (currently) only with Macs is the clincher.

But such a market is small, and Apple knows that.

Anyone have any idea what the single most profitable device in Sony's history is? Hints:

It's not something from their home stereo/AV receiver line.

It's not a camcorder.

Or a VCR.

It's not a headphone.

It's not a speaker.

It's not the venerable Sony Walkman -- which they sold millions of in the 1980s, and revolutionized personal audio.

It's not the Sony discman.

It's not any of their cool tiny laptop computers.

It's not any of their Trinitron televisions, easily the best television tube sold for the entire 17 years that their patent was in effect from the 1970s -- 1990s.

It's not a CD -- No, not even the Titanic soundtrack, which sold a bajillion copies in 1997 and 1998 and is the biggest-selling classical music CD of all time.

Have you guessed yet?

spoiler space
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It's the Playstation. They've made more money off the Playstation than any other single device they've ever sold. The point of this story is to show that a company shouldn't assume that only their core markets are/will be profitable. Remember that when the Playstation originally came out, it was kind of a side market for Sony. They were selling music, musical equipment, and video gear as their core markets. Game consoles didn't really mean much to them, and when the Playstation was first introduced, it was expected to lose out to the Sega and Nintendo consoles introduced at the same time.

That's a lesson for Apple (and for chych, I guess

). They could end up making far more money on the iPod than on any of their computers, so limiting the market for the iPod to Macs only would be crazy.

Russ "The Peripatetic Audiophile"

 

[coolvij]

Hmm.....then again........windows users are smart enough to go MiniDisc......so, Apple wouldn't gain much by allowing the iPod to be used with Windoze.

(i'm just kidding...........)

 

[MacDEF]

Actually, Apple has only *vaguely* hinted at releasing a Windows version -- "when we get around to it" is the direct quote.

But more importantly, Apple created the iPod to increase interest in the Mac platform. Not to dominate the MP3 market. Not necessarily to sell more Macs (although that's a good consequence). But to promote the Mac as the center of their "digital hub" concept. From a business point of view, they would be crazy to release a Windows version in the near future.

 

[Russ Arcuri]

Quote:

Originally posted by MacDEF Actually, Apple has only *vaguely* hinted at releasing a Windows version -- "when we get around to it" is the direct quote.

Right -- which they would not have done if they truly saw the iPod as something that will get lots of people to switch to Macs. One device alone will sway a few people -- definitely not enough to justify limiting the iPod's market to 1/20 of its potential.

Quote:

But more importantly, Apple created the iPod to increase interest in the Mac platform. Not to dominate the MP3 market. Not necessarily to sell more Macs (although that's a good consequence). But to promote the Mac as the center of their "digital hub" concept. From a business point of view, they would be crazy to release a Windows version in the near future.

No, business is about money, and Apple knows it. From a business perspective, they would be crazy NOT to release a Windows version eventually. I never said a Windows version was coming tomorrow.

The iPod (along with iMovie) go a LONG way towards convincing many people that Macs aren't simply toys. I put together a 10 minute video (culled from 35 minutes of footage) while on vacation a couple months ago using my wife's iBook. Very professional quality, with beautiful titles, smooth transitions, and a good soundtrack (pats self on back). Two relatives (and long-time Windows bigots) who saw me working on it were both astounded and impressed by what I was able to do so quickly on a (quote) "freakin' laptop."

Now, no one's saying you can't edit digital video on Windows boxes, and clearly there are lots of mp3 players out there. But there's a difference between promoting a concept -- Apple's digital hub -- and making money. As I hoped my Sony example above would demonstrate, Apple should be releasing a Windows 'version' of the iPod before the excitement dies down too much. Either that or Steve Jobs is a brain-dead zombie walking around in a three piece suit.

Russ "The Peripatetic Audiophile"

 

[MacDEF]

Quote:

No, business is about money, and Apple knows it. From a business perspective, they would be crazy NOT to release a Windows version eventually.

Sorry, Russ, but I have to disagree. I think they may release one in the future, once they have the production capacity in place, but it's not imperative, nor would they be crazy not to do it.

For years people have gone with Windows computers because of all the things they "couldn't" (perceived or real) get with or do on a Mac. It's good business for Apple to introduce things that you "can't" get on Windows -- or that you can do/get much better with/on a Mac.

Business is "about money" at the company level, but not necessarily at the product level.

 

[Russ Arcuri]

Quote:

Originally posted by MacDEF Business is "about money" at the company level, but not necessarily at the product level.

Forgive me, but that's about as naive a perspective as you could possibly have on this. Business is about money, period. There's no such thing as "company level" vs. "product level." The products exist to be sold; whatever secondary effect they have (promoting a digital hub concept or whatever) is secondary.

Quote:

It's good business for Apple to introduce things that you "can't" get on Windows -- or that you can do/get much better with/on a Mac.

Look, for the fourteen years from 1984 until sometime around 1998, the Mac was so superior to a DOS/Windows box both technologically and from the human interface perspective, it's almost funny. To use your own words -- Macs have ALWAYS been great examples of "things that you can't get on Windows, or that you can do/get much better with/on a Mac." The strategy doesn't work. Apple's market share from the mid-1980s to now has gone from around 12-15% (depending on who you ask) to 5% -- all the while providing vastly superior software and somewhat superior hardware.

Even since 1998, Macs have been superior in many ways to Windows boxes, though the difference isn't as glaring as it once was. You want to know how to get more Macs into people's homes and offices? Don't make the iPod platform specific -- make a version of iTunes for Windows and sell a million of them to Windows users. Let them see for themselves how great their engineering and software design teams are. Then maybe when the Windows user who's loving his iPod for a year or two puts together the money for a new computer purchase, he'll consider a Mac.

I realize that we're not going to agree on this. I guess we'll just have to let time tell the story...

Russ "The Peripatetic Audiophile"