[Raez]

I don't mean to incite any argument here whatsoever, as I have no opinion on the matter, but a great curiosity about it. Honestly, I don't intend to incite any discussion, just a quick question.

I know there is much discourse about the effects of cables and burn in on the sound of a headphone here, and so I ask you this...

Why don't we just quick bickering about it and have a Frequency Response Test like headphone.com does for all their cans? Or does that work a different way? (sorry, noob here!) If that can be done, and the machine recognizes no difference, we can definitively say there is no change...right?

Again, I have no hidden agenda here, I'm just curious.

 

[clarinetman]

Well, I think the argument here is more what sounds good (psychologically or otherwise) to the listener, not to a machine... Although, personally I believe expensive re-cable is all just smoke and mirrors. I do however believe in burn-in, the logic behind that actually makes sense to me.

 

[Raez]

Quote:

Originally Posted by clarinetman /img/forum/go_quote.gif Well, I think the argument here is more what sounds good (psychologically or otherwise) to the listener, not to a machine... Although, personally I believe expensive re-cable is all just smoke and mirrors. I do however believe in burn-in, the logic behind that actually makes sense to me.

With the utmost respect I'd ask that we not turn this into a discussion about burn-in/cabling, because I'd really rather it not get moved to the sound science section.

Again, all I am asking is why somebody doesn't run them through one of those machines? If it showed any sort of variation from the standard cable/un-burned in, it would prove that there is an actual change (doesn't matter if the machine says it's good or bad, as that is subjective. doesn't really matter what the change is as long as there is change, IMO), and the other way around.

 

[Justice Strike]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raez /img/forum/go_quote.gif With the utmost respect I'd ask that we not turn this into a discussion about burn-in/cabling, because I'd really rather it not get moved to the sound science section. Again, all I am asking is why somebody doesn't run them through one of those machines? If it showed any sort of variation from the standard cable/un-burned in, it would prove that there is an actual change (doesn't matter if the machine says it's good or bad, as that is subjective. doesn't really matter what the change is as long as there is change, IMO), and the other way around.

the correct answer is either:

people are too lazy to do that.

or

people are afraid of what they might find out.

 

[Raez]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justice Strike /img/forum/go_quote.gif the correct answer is either: people are too lazy to do that. or people are afraid of what they might find out.

Hold on now. Did I actually just turn over a rock that could actually give a definitive answer as to rather or not cables change HPs...?

 

[Justice Strike]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raez /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hold on now. Did I actually just turn over a rock that could actually give a definitive answer as to rather or not cables change HPs...?

no... not really, it's known all along. People just like the torture that is called discussion without any facts.

 

[Drubbing]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justice Strike /img/forum/go_quote.gif the correct answer is either: people are too lazy to do that. or people are afraid of what they might find out.

If it were able to measure anything worth measuring, it'd already have been done.

FR is only a guide to a phones sound bias, it doesn't reveal exactly how a phone sounds.

As for cables. When you consider some cables can cost up to 10X more than the phones, and the most optimistic listeners says it can make 5-10% difference (that's not always the same as 'improvement'), then that's a pretty poor return on investment.

 

[Justice Strike]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drubbing /img/forum/go_quote.gif If it were able to measure anything worth measuring, it'd already have been done. FR is only a guide to a phones sound bias, it doesn't reveal exactly how a phone sounds. As for cables. When you consider some cables can cost up to 10X more than the phones, and the most optimistic listeners says it can make 5-10% difference (that's not always the same as 'improvement'), then that's a pretty poor return on investment.

if sound signature changes then you can measure that change. Either by frequency response or using waterfall graphs. People are just too lazy to do so or have to little understanding of what to measure.

 

[Raez]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justice Strike /img/forum/go_quote.gif if sound signature changes then you can measure that change. Either by frequency response or using waterfall graphs. People are just too lazy to do so or have to little understanding of what to measure.

That, or the people that have them likely have a stake in the cable-selling market...

 

[Yikes]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raez /img/forum/go_quote.gif That, or the people that have them likely have a stake in the cable-selling market...

So let's get this straight you believe that everyone who owns aftermarket cables or has had their Headphones re-cabled with aftermarket cables is likely to have a "Stake" in the cable selling market?

You are obviously delusional.

There are maybe twenty member who attempts to make money by selling cables or by re-cabling headphones, whereas there are at least many hundreds of members who have had their headphones re-cabled (Happily so). Then there are the thousands of members who have aftermarket cabling and believe that said cabling has improved their systems.

You can disagree as to if the re-cabling or cables makes a difference, but claiming that all, or most, or even many have monetary motivations is blatantly untrue.

 

[Drubbing]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justice Strike /img/forum/go_quote.gif if sound signature changes then you can measure that change. Either by frequency response or using waterfall graphs. People are just too lazy to do so or have to little understanding of what to measure.

Manufacturers do. So do places like headroom, they use FR graphs as a 'sales aid'. Yet none of them bother to do post burn ins...

 

[Ninkul]

Cables - Too much contraversy.
Burn in - You can test this yourself.

With cables, just stay away from cheapies. Just get decent cables that go well asthetically with your equipment 0=). Once you start having spare cash to fling around on cables then make a plunge and do some testing

 

[Raez]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yikes /img/forum/go_quote.gif So let's get this straight you believe that everyone who owns aftermarket cables or has had their Headphones re-cabled with aftermarket cables is likely to have a "Stake" in the cable selling market? You are obviously delusional. There are maybe twenty member who attempts to make money by selling cables or by re-cabling headphones, whereas there are at least many hundreds of members who have had their headphones re-cabled (Happily so). Then there are the thousands of members who have aftermarket cabling and believe that said cabling has improved their systems. You can disagree as to if the re-cabling or cables makes a difference, but claiming that all, or most, or even many have monetary motivations is blatantly untrue.

Whoa there! Buddy, I'd suggest you tame your anger before you respond with a derogatory, and completely irrelevant post like that.

If you read my post (assuming you're capable of doing that), you would realize that I was referring to the fact that people that would have machines capable of doing FR graphs etc would likely be people in the headphone/audio industry. (Ex. Head-Room)

Now if you read my ORIGINAL post, which I think it's very clear that you did not, you would see that I have no opinion on the matter, and am just curious. When I said in my last post that it is likely that people with a "stake in the headphone industry" would be the majority of the people that would own said machines, I was simply stating my thought, which I imagine is correct.

Again, I don't really know what in the hell you were talking about in your last post, as I NEVER commented on people that owned high-end cables being part of the industry.

 

[swmtnbiker]

Again? Seriously?

 

[estreeter]

Raez, you started this thread knowing full well what the end result would be. Where I come from, thats called trolling - justify it with whatever sanctimonious ******** you want, but its trolling, pure and simple. If you want to run frequency tests or submit two pairs of phones to a lab for testing, be my guest : until you have something offer the debate, I'd suggest you stick to things you actually know something about. If you want 'derogtory', keep pushing buttons Mr Flamebait.