[milesandcoltrane]

Being on the hunt for a new IEM solution I decided to audition a sampling of the current crop of high end universals.

Here are my very very brief impressions (Didn't have much time with them so here goes):

Pls take note: All IEMs have been burned in for more than 50-100 hours at least. Probably more, not sure on the exact figure. They were audition sets at a popular audio store.

Senn IE8:

These were off the bat instantly boomy, excessively bassy and uncontrolled.
Bass was exceptional on certain tracks but this was probably just 10% of the time. Other than that the bass was uncontrolled bloomy and not too tight. The mids and highs were very drowned out on this one. I was really hoping to like this, being a self-confessed (a long time ago at least) bass head and Senn HD600 fan, but these really really disappointed me. I see what people say about having little isolation with these. They felt the least secure among this bunch.

Westone 3:

These were quite similar to the Senn IE8. Bloomy, uncontrolled bass. Mids were equally veiled. Trebles were a bit more apparent but only very slightly. Also greatly disappointed by these. Having liked the UM2 a long time ago and being quite fond of my little UM1 I must say I was going in expecting a great deal.

Westone UM3X:

Finally something that presented a clearer picture. These had adequate servings of bass, mids and trebles. No specific part of the spectrum was overemphasized. Probably the most natural and realistic sounding of the bunch here. Downsides: A tad polite sounding. And personally didn't feel that these were that much of a jump from my UM1. Maybe its cuz their similar in sound signature so as not make differences that obvious.

UE TF10:

Given all the hype they've been getting around here I was really curious. Imagined initially that I wouldn't like the sound but the minute I put them on and turned the music I was knocked off my feet. Its been a while since I've had a wow moment in head-fi but these gave it to me. Bass was adequate in amount. They went quite deep as well, not IE8 deep but good enough. Trebles were forward in a pleasant manner. Had no issues with sibilance. Downsides: Mids were just a smidgen recessed but otherwise still quite rich. On a more serious note however, on some tracks trebles sounded a tad fake or unnatural. I find this problem with most IEMs I've tried just that since things were so good here this deficiency was just more apparent. Also fit was a bit iffy and the seal was not as good as the Westones.

Bottom line: I might be springing for either the stock UE TF 10 or remolding them into customs via Unique Melody and adding a driver. Though on a side note I auditioned the HD 600 (again) via the Maverick Audio D1 DAC and Amp combo and it completely blew away the IEMs. In all fairness we can't compare IEMs to full sized cans and a home amp but I'm just saying =)

 

[KLS]

Nice write-ups! By the way of the four I own IE8 and TF10.

I think you should give more burn-in time for IE8. It changes in time, in fact quite dramatically to my ears. Mids do get better (clearer), treble improves too but not in a drastic way.

As for TF10, I actually like to pair it up with my Corda 3Move. It brings vocal a big step forward making them really lively. Of all the IEMs I own (CK10, IE8, TF10, SF5 vi2, etc...) I like the 'swimming sensation' TF10 gives me, as a matter of fact I only have such feeling with the SF5 vi2 and TF10.

EDIT: IE8's bass tightens too after some loooong burn-in. I actually find myself turning the bass notch to the max! Just call me a basshead or whatever.

 

[rawrster]

swimming sensation? not a clue what that means and dont think i get any such feeling with my tf10

 

[milesandcoltrane]

KLS: yeah that's what I read about the IE8 time and time again. With my audition the problem was I was not able to determine exactly how much burn in was on them. Even though the burn in would improve the clarity I doubt they would be as detailed as say the tf10. I've been a basshead for as long as I remember but I'd rather get my bass fix from full sized cans or better still full range speakers with or without a good sub. I work as an emcee n I've always had the best bass experience at e events I front in clubs. The engineers I work with are brilliant! But I can't seem to get the same luck bass wise with IEMs.

I'm also curious about the swimming sensation that u describe. Do u mean the sensation of being surrounded by sound or as if ur 'swimming' in music?

I also like what u said about the Corda 3move helping to bring the mids onto the fore. I hope adding a driver n going for a custom remold might do the same thing. We'll see how things pan out

 

[KLS]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rawrster /img/forum/go_quote.gif swimming sensation? not a clue what that means and dont think i get any such feeling with my tf10

Sorry, I think I should had put it this way:

Quote:

Originally Posted by shigzeo /img/forum/go_quote.gif i have not yet heard the ie8 (but soon will), but can comment on many many armature phones. most have smaller stages, but a well-produced one will have very very precise placement within that stage that can sometimes feel like you are swimming in a 3D experience. for some reason, the armatures do a better job of making you think you are listening to very good closed headphones whilst the dynamics may be closer to a very good 2,1 speaker system. the best armature i have heard by a long long shot has been the ck10 from audio technica

Original post:
http://www.head-fi.org/forums/5744486-post14.html

 

[KLS]

Quote:

Originally Posted by milesandcoltrane /img/forum/go_quote.gif KLS: yeah that's what I read about the IE8 time and time again. With my audition the problem was I was not able to determine exactly how much burn in was on them. Even though the burn in would improve the clarity I doubt they would be as detailed as say the tf10. I've been a basshead for as long as I remember but I'd rather get my bass fix from full sized cans or better still full range speakers with or without a good sub. I work as an emcee n I've always had the best bass experience at e events I front in clubs. The engineers I work with are brilliant! But I can't seem to get the same luck bass wise with IEMs. I'm also curious about the swimming sensation that u describe. Do u mean the sensation of being surrounded by sound or as if ur 'swimming' in music? I also like what u said about the Corda 3move helping to bring the mids onto the fore. I hope adding a driver n going for a custom remold might do the same thing. We'll see how things pan out

I would say that IE8's clarity is a tad inferior to TF10 (iponderous might chime in

), but it improves over time. I don't know much about speakers, but FWIR some people in Head-Fi say that IE8 has a sub-wooferish bass.

You can get information on remolding the TF10 in Head-Fi too (try the search engine). I find most of the owners remolding their TF10s are happy with them. Though some reports say remolding/adding a mid driver seems to be changing the sound signature, so it is better to research first before you decide on the remolding.

As for amp, I find that Corda 3Move does bring the mids upfront. Like for my case, Corda 3Move + CK10 overempasized the mids, which overlap to other frequencies, while Corda 3Move + TF10 makes mids sound more engaging and lively (more forward).

 

[rawrster]

ohh..that makes more sense then

I forgot but someone got the TF10 with an additional mid driver and it changed the sound signature not in a good way.

 

[milesandcoltrane]

Oh I wasn't aware about the apparent problems with adding an extra mid driver and screwing up the sound. I'll go read up on them then.

By the way I've been wondering how does the Shure E530 compare with these based on my impressions stated above? I'll go use the search engine but for a Cliff Notes edition here please do chime in =)

 

[Rip N' Burn]

I have a TF10 with an additional mid driver and they changed for the better. There is more of a midrange emphasis which the TF10 lacked. The original TF10 has a recessed midrange and the additional mid driver makes up for the shortcoming. The TF10 with addional mid driver is however very bassy...

 

[KLS]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rip N' Burn /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have a TF10 with an additional mid driver and they changed for the better. There is more of a midrange emphasis which the TF10 lacked. The original TF10 has a recessed midrange and the additional mid driver makes up for the shortcoming. The TF10 with addional mid driver is however very bassy...

Does the sound become muddy/less refined? Or bassy in the way of giving good punchy bass?

 

[milesandcoltrane]

Rip N' Burn: I'm as eager as KLS to find out what character this extra bass takes on? Is it still as deep as the stock TF10 (or even better, does it go deeper?), does it remain disciplined and stay where it should or does it bleed into the mids in an ugly mess resulting in an ungainly mid-bass hump? Are the highs/trebles/detail lost or maintained?

Many thanks in advance buddy!

 

[Rip N' Burn]

The bass remains tight and controlled but the I notice a substantial increase in quantity and impact. The midrange and highs remain clear and don't get interfered with. The highs are the same as the TF10. To be honest, I felt that there already was a midbass hump with the TF10 just not as prominent as the W3 or IE8. The bass presentation is now somewhat similar to the W3 and IE8. I wonder if this is how UE11 is supposed to sound like since the additional mid driver remold upgrade uses 4 drivers, 3 way crossover, and 2 sound bores. I found a frequency response graph of the TF10. It is in red:

 

[mvw2]

Haha, that's an interesting graph. Although Headroom does controlled testing, I found the SE530 to be nothing like that pic with my own frequency response testing. Then again, they show the ER4S like that too, and that doesn't have the low frequency response even close to what it shows. I also don't know where you got the TF10, because I've never seen it in the list.

A couple of notes on the review. First thanks for putting it up. Second, getting solid holistic impressions of hardware is extremely hard to do from short demos. It generally takes a LOT of time and a lot of songs, frequency tests, etc. to get a solid idea of capabilities and lots of A/B, A/C, B/C comparing to get a solid understanding of the differences between each. A short demo, even a full day short, just isn't enough. You do get an initial impression, and these initial impressions give you hints in the earphone's behavior, but a lot of the perception is based off the sound signature you were used to, your expectations, and the limits of the songs you used. You typically end up missing a lot. Initial impressions are great for referencing what other people will experience immediately, but everyone will experience it differently depending on what they came from.

For the IE8, it likes wattage. It has a low ohm load and high initial sensitivity, but it is very happy soaking up gobs of power if you've got it. It can help a bit with the sloppiness and control.

The Westone UM3X was also noticeably improved using an amp. I would think the W3 is also, especially since it's more bass geared. There is a sizable gain to the control and separation of information once properly amped.

The Triple.Fi 10 doesn't really care about wattage, very easy to drive.

The IE8's sound signature is one that grows on you. Anyone starting out with it will find the bass to be overwhelming. However, our ears and mind like to automatically balance everything out. After a while listening, the mind balances out the IE8, and you hear a much more even presentation. Then you just start enjoying the huge sound stage and the great bass extension.

I'm a big fan of the UM3X. I too consider them very well balanced. I haven't tried the UM1 or UM2, so I don't know how it compares. I have not tried the W3 either. Typically more drivers means a flatter, more extended frequency response. If the UM1 and UM3X use the same driver for the midrange for example, they would sound very similar to each other. The UM1 would push the bass and treble as much as possible through x-over and filter settings, but the UM3X will do it better with more drivers covering the spread more efficiently. This may be why they come across very similar. Better might be in the little details. I can't say I'd ever call the UM3X tame in any way. It's the most in your face and most dynamic of the bunch.

I do find the Triple.Fi 10 to be one of the better balanced and most refined sounding earphones out there. It is largely correct and just good sounding playing most everything. I prefer something like the UM3X to it, but that's a matter of personal preference.

 

[Rip N' Burn]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mvw2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Haha, that's an interesting graph. Although Headroom does controlled testing, I found the SE530 to be nothing like that pic with my own frequency response testing. Then again, they show the ER4S like that too, and that doesn't have the low frequency response even close to what it shows. I also don't know where you got the TF10, because I've never seen it in the list.

FR graphs really don't tell the whole story. I have the IE8 and Monster Turbine Pro Gold and from the FR graphs, they are almost identical. When I listen to them, the offer very different presentations. HeadRoom apparently took the TF10 off the list a while ago and the graph that I found was from a posting here at head-fi a while back.

 

[KLS]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mvw2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif The IE8's sound signature is one that grows on you. Anyone starting out with it will find the bass to be overwhelming. However, our ears and mind like to automatically balance everything out. After a while listening, the mind balances out the IE8, and you hear a much more even presentation. Then you just start enjoying the huge sound stage and the great bass extension.

Agree. However I find that not my mind nor ears have used to the sound signature of IE8 (or like you say balance everything out), it is in fact the bass does thighten up, no more interfering the mids after burn-in (a very long one though, I would say at least 200hrs). I am using my pair of IE8 for half a year, if my memory serves me right out of the box IE8 to me was like a phones that response only to lower frequencies, everything sounded so muddy to me that I was regretting my purchase. And now, even side-by-side ABing IE8 to TF10, IE8 doesn't sound muddy anymore, though TF10 still has better clarity.