Ibasso 1 bit Discrete portable DAC with Resistors Array D16

Sep 6, 2024 at 11:38 AM Post #736 of 1,648
So once again iBasso is pairing a dedicated headphone amp with a DAC/amp all-in-one. And once again I'm more interested in the all-in-one. I wonder what the output level is and how it will compare in sound quality with the dedicated amp. Looking forward to the release and the reviews. :)
 
Sep 7, 2024 at 3:40 AM Post #737 of 1,648
It appears there might be DX340 MAX eventually.

1725694759981.png
1725694809656.png
 
Last edited:
Sep 7, 2024 at 12:00 PM Post #738 of 1,648
Geez, edge edge screen.
 
Sep 8, 2024 at 11:26 AM Post #740 of 1,648
On the first date when I just broke open my D16 and listened to it, I was surprised by it performances, the liquidity and viscosity of it musical flows VS my 320Max. I couldn't stop thinking about the reason why it should have been this way.



Allow me to share it with what I thought it was



1/ We have an in house developed products VS a off the shelves products. The differences is stark! The In house products are developed so that every each of it footprints will match the criteria required for specific circumstances VS any off the shelves, which were generic and with multiple features that the DAP/DAC developers have to meet in order for it to perform. Just think about you cooling your own steaks the way you want VS a quick meal portion dropped at your door and all you need to do is to choose a way to heat it up. They are very different and needless to say, your will always be better for your taste.



In this way, Ibasso was able to extract and flex their own developments of their references and standard on what they think is the most suitable for their flagship devices. Just like foods, it is all subjective. The chefs enjoyed his dishes but doesn't mean all of us are.



Now, let's put subjectivities aside, the D16 was an in house developed products. So it power supplied to it pulse wave modulator and the algorithms with the Fourier values from hardware and so on are all satisfying Ibasso criteria



2/ If we took that D16 as stated having 16 elements, then thinking about ROHM chips with 6 elements each while sporting 4X in ultimate mode....we do have 24 elements inside the 320Max. Therefore, the elements are not just yet the decisive factor.



Then what can it be ?



I could not stop thinking about any reasons that could make senses of it. To then finally I think I have came up with a plausible untested reason.



It is the Fir filters together with the discrete built of the D16.



The discrete built is actually the FIR analog filter itself, while the DSP is being done by DSP chip. Other IC such as ROHM has it own algorithm to tackle the digital filter stages. It could have been a processing unit or it could have been a waffle silicon based arrays. The pros of the IC chip is that it tolerances for all transistors/capacitors/resistors on silicon is very very tight of which is 0.0004% or so. The pros of the discrete array from D16 is that it is progressive and continous because capacitors have 10-20% tolerances, the same thing for resistors, which is 0.5% I think ?



So why is the IC chip pro a con of it ? Well, because under digital processing techniques, we can only assume a certain values and not absolute value, it comes from quantization errors and so on. Everything is a close assumption. This is one of the reason why everything will effect the end performances...assumptions on top of assumptions...under some circumstances can completely altering the nature of some things. This is when oversampling are coming into play.



Some people prefer NOS because it has the liquidity of analog quality, not precisely, but similarly, though it has higher floor noises .



From this camp, we have some that enjoy OS because it has lower floor noises and yielding better fidelity, but lacking the liquidity of it analog counterpart...because aggressive filtering and trimming away errors, you inevitably altering the end result to be more sterile....this is what we know as digital signature ? Possibly ?



So then, when we learned to accept that. What makes D16 FIR discrete arrays to be this special ?



Take a look at this slide from IBassoScreenshot_20240908_111050_Chrome.jpg



We see that it stated each DAC can be summed up into an output. We have 32 delays, by 16 elements. That means each sampling cycle is oversampled by a factor of 2x. The errors once being summed up this way will cancel itself out, similarly to how a balanced signals not only is more powerful but also in itself is a anti-interferences signals. This was the original reason why balanced signals were created for pro equipments.



So then, the errors of the discrete capacitors and resistors are being negated out. But why does it has such analog quality ? Because of it own architecture that has it own errors to become it strength. This is the reason why I recommend people not to swap out the orange capacitors or the opamps on the buffering stages in the D16. Doing so will completely change the performances, better or worse ? Unless you also have lab equipment to measures, and even so, I would refrain from doing it because you are ruining ibasso performances



So what is it errors that become it strengths ? The capacitors capability to hold charge and discharge is of a longer timing in tempo than the silicon based capacitors. While the silicon one is more precise, it is also too quickly discharged that the whole circuit needs to be moving in a faster tempo manner and or drawing more power...at this stage it already has negated most of the errors....



But!!! A huge But!!! What is the nature of musicality ? Yes, a rhythmically distortions...so distortion is an errors, and errors will cancel it own errors ... resulting in a more sterile signatures.





Let's stop for a moment here. Does that mean Either topology will finally be imparting it own signature onto the final signals ?



Yes!!! You got it!!! The reasons why each DAC has it own signatures from brands to brands. It is just the nature of it being an IC, it results in a more sterile signals where as utilizing discrete components, it additional errors will self cancel out reserving the best of both worlds...a lower floor noises while retaining the original errors from the musical distortions of the original signals.





From all of this together, it makes senses that PCM sounds better with the signature of Ibasso on D16 than DSD files...which were already decoded by another DAC and leaves not much rooms for the D16 to process it.
 
Sep 8, 2024 at 11:32 AM Post #741 of 1,648
Do notes that, each capacitors are absolutely essentials in the design of the DAC itself this way. There are different kinds with different characteristics.

AudioGD utilize electrolytic
Others devices such as Cayin and miniaturized dangles are using SMD ceramic...some are using PML...etc...etc.

But the most musical one would be polystyrene or oils kind. I am unsure of which kinds D16 is using....probably won't be discussed by Ibasso ? But it isn't Mica or electrolytic. All of these are just from accumulative experiences from a tinkerer like myself over endless experiences and learning curves....or course it is untested.

But when it comes down to this, sizes matters 😅
 
Sep 12, 2024 at 11:48 AM Post #743 of 1,648
Friends, maybe someone knows how to understand that the d16 is fully charged? The blue light should be off?

It shows on the screen that it is already fully charged (according to the battery bars), but it seems to be charging after that too
Yes, it blinks when low and blue when charging and no light when fully charged. That has been my observation.
 
Sep 13, 2024 at 8:28 AM Post #745 of 1,648
Friends, does anyone know why I can’t play dsd256 and higher through any connection from ibasso320max as a source to d16?
according official iBasso 320 Max manual you can output no higher than DSD256 through USB only and you can do a DSD through coaxial as well...if you still cant get it through i guess you d better address this issue to iBasso customer support directly
Screenshot 2024-09-13 at 15.10.38.png
 
Sep 13, 2024 at 9:18 AM Post #746 of 1,648
according official iBasso 320 Max manual you can output no higher than DSD256 through USB only and you can do a DSD through coaxial as well...if you still cant get it through i guess you d better address this issue to iBasso customer support directly
D16 takes in DSD512 over usb c and DOP256 coax.

Sometimes the 320M needs a fresh restart to switch modes, because itself is an all in one player. Just plugged it in and turned on D16 then restart the 320Max. The 320M best be using Mango player in android to do it
 
Last edited:
Sep 13, 2024 at 10:17 AM Post #747 of 1,648
D16 takes in DSD512 over usb c and DOP256 coax.

Sometimes the 320M needs a fresh restart to switch modes, because itself is an all in one player. Just plugged it in and turned on D16 then restart the 320Max. The 320M best be using Mango player in android to do it
Coreect . thing is 320 Max Can't output more than DSD256
 
Sep 17, 2024 at 9:17 AM Post #749 of 1,648
has anyone heard of an ibasso d16 taipan source? does this already serve all inears including the totl category?
Yes, it can be used as an endgame. TOTL material.
 
Sep 18, 2024 at 9:39 PM Post #750 of 1,648
Yes, it can be used as an endgame. TOTL material.
thinking of buying an ibasso d16 taipan for a fir audio xenon 6 IEM. what do you think about this?

Could you show xe6 what it's really capable of?

what iem/headphones do you use?



D16 has a 3.5mm input on the back. is it only optics and coax or can it also be used as a 3.5mm analog input? Would it not work at all, would the device make no sound?
 
Last edited:

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top