[Ckaz]

thanks for that advice!

Well, I am located in Canada, but I don't currently have the money for my setup. I'm close, but not quite there. It might be a month or so before I can actually purchase my audio setup, I just like to do my research before I buy, and I am pretty new to audio equipment, so I need a considerable amount of time for research.

As for a DIY sub, it has been something I have considered, but I can't operate tools beyond a screwdriver lol. It is something i'll look into, but I also want to make sure I am getting a sub that suites my speakers. Would it be harder or easier to ensure that through DIY sub?

And I will consider going with a Rookit 5's. I just need to make sure I have enough power coming from these speakers, in terms of volume. Paired with an Auzentech Forte soundcard, do you think I'll be able to power these speakers to high volumes?

 

[OICWUTUDIDTHAR]

should be you will have to use an RCA to 3.5mm jack converter for the forte though. I think you will be only able to used unbalanced and not balanced input.

 

[Operandi]

There really isn't such a thing as a sub that suites your speakers, just varying degrees of performance and to a certain extent taste. One of the nice advantages of DIY is that you get to design and build exactly what you want, within budget of course. If you want clean, tight bass that will be most easily accomplished with a sealed sub which has the added benefit of being the easiest to build/design and also taking up the least amount of space.

As far as tools all you need to do is cut a round cutout for the driver and square cutout for the plate amp. It doesn't have to be a perfect cutout so a jig saw would work fine. If want to skip that PE also sells some boxes precut, here is the 1.0 cuF for a 10" driver, not as nice looking maple enclosure though.

In terms of volume yeah the Rokits will get plenty loud. Keep in mind you will be using them nearfield so louder than you ever need them to I'm sure.

 

[Ckaz]

I am now considering getting passive speakers (I might have the name wrong, those are the ones that require an amp, correct?) because there are so many more oppurtunities for so many more budgets.
Well, if I get all used equipment I should be able to find a receiver for $200, and then I could probably find a used set of wharfedale Diamond 10.1's for around $250..?

All that would be left is the sub, and this DIY sub is seeming like a project I really want to undertake

Quote:

If you want clean, tight bass

How did you guess? That is exactly how I like my bass. Clean, tight, but it still needs to have more than a distinguishable presence.
So, I am setting a $300 dollar budget here. What parts do I need (including the wood for making a cabinet) to make a sub woofer, of my specified needs, in my specified budget? I live in Canada, so where is a good place to get these parts?
Could you recommend some basic guides?

 

[Operandi]

Passive is the correct term. Yeah its a good option and is a bit more flexible. Rather than a receiver I would look at a power amp or a integrated amp (amp + pre-amp), the quality will be much better and the price about the same. I'll be using an Adcom GFA-535 II which my custom DIY monitors, I think I payed about $150.00 for it used. Adcom make really great entry level audiophile amps (much better than any receiver), NAD is also a good name to look into if you would rather have an integrated amp.

For the sub it depends on if you can cut your own holes (at the very least). Just as an example something like the Dayton SA240 watt plate amp (currently on sale) Dayton RSS210HF-4 8" Reference HF Dayton 1.0 cuF SWC Maple Subwoofer Cabinet comes to just under $350 and would make a great reference level music sub. If you want to cheap out the can get a black vinyl for $30 less but the veneer is worth it in my opinion, they are really very nice looking cabinets.

Keep in mind I didn't model that config yet but should give you a good idea of what you would need. If you like I can model it in software for you but you might want to posting in the PE forums too.

 

[Ckaz]

Ok, well do you think you could do me a favor and look over some of the questions I posted in a different forum? I'll just provide you the link, and you can answer them here. It is a lot easier than re-writing all of it.
I want to build a sub, but I am TOTAL beginner. Please help! - Home Theater Forum - Home Theater Systems - HomeTheaterShack

 

[Operandi]

Alright I checked your thread, I'll try address a couple of your main questions.

$300 will be able build a pretty impressive sub, might want to go a bit more if you can. What you can build sort of hinges on if you are going to build your cabinet or not. If you are going to use one of the prebuilt cabinets you have to pick a driver that will work in that cabinet and around your budget. If you decided to have someone help you build your own (which is what I did) then you have a lot more options in terms of driver and enclosure size and type.

A good subwoofer properly setup will disappear into the room and blend seamlessly with the speakers (it should not be "boomy"). Subwoofers are judged by their frequency extension (how low they can play) and distortion (how clean they sound). Drivers like the Dayton Reference don't start showing up in subwoofers until you start spending serious money.

For music you really don't have to be concerned with any response under 30HZ so you should be fine with a 8" or even a good 6.5" sub. There is no simple spec number for distortion when it comes to loudspeaker drivers since there are too many variables to be simply represented by a single number.

Alright some terms....

An ohm is electrical resistance, the lower the number the less the resistance. Most subs will be 4ohm (regular speakers are typically 8ohm or sometimes 6ohm), less ohms usually means more watts (power) but the amp has to be able to supply the current so you are usually talking sub woofer specific amps like the plate amp I linked to above.

dBA doesn't really change in relation to subwoofers. One new term you might hear is F for fundamental in terms of HZ. A F3 of 30HZ means the subwoofer can play down to 30HZ only 3dBA down from the rest of the response.

How low and loud exactly the sub will play depends on the driver and cabinet size and type. A big cabinet will always play lower than a small one, and a ported cabient will always play lower, and usually louder than a sealed. Whatever you deiced to build though will most likely be complete overkill though and I'm sure you won't be disappointed.

I would say the next thing you should do is deiced whether you want to build a cabinet or buy one, from there I (and others) can make more specific recommendations.

Also I would suggest you take a look at the Parts Express and HTGuide and maybe post a thread there at some point, I'm active on both of those forums.

 

[Ckaz]

I am going to go with a pre-made cabinet.

For the parts, I know I need a subwoofer, a plate amp (do I need this?), and a cabinet (do they usually come with feet?). Otherwise, what other parts do I need to make a complete subwoofer? Please remember I am a total novice, so anything you think may be obvious, it probably isn't to me.

For the subwoofer, I might go with this Parts-Express.com:*Dayton QT210-4 8" Quatro Subwoofer 4 Ohm | subwoofer qt210-4 8" subwoofer dayton quattro dayton subwoofer dayton 8" woofer DayAudSub11408
And for the plate amp, I might go with this Parts-Express.com:*Bash 300W Digital Subwoofer Amplifier | subwoofer amplifier subwoofer amp sub amplifier sub amp plate amp bash
Btw, are there any other sites you would recommend for buying my parts? They need to be able to ship to Canada.

Now, I will definitely be going with an 8" sub. Other than that, seeing as though I don't know what other parts I am supposed to get when buying a subwoofer, I am not sure on size specs. If the sub size is enough to go on, could you please recommend me a few cabinets? They have to be black in color.

Also, thanks for the term definitions!

So, to recap, right now I would like you to confirm that I do need a plate amp, subwoofer, and cabinet. I would also like you to tell me exactly which other parts I need, little or small, I want to know what parts go into building a subwoofer. I would like you to review the plate amp and subwoofer I chose, and recommend me a few cabinets. Lastly, I would like you to recommend me a few sites that ship to Canada, as Parts Express didn't seem to have to big of a selection.

P.S. The parts you recommended seem good. What is the difference between the subwoofer you chose, and the one I chose? They are both made by Daton..
Also, it seems fitting to get an amp that has enough power to handle the sub's max, right? So if I am getting a sub with an average of 280 watts, but a peak or max of 500watts, shouldn't I ensure I get an amp that can handle up to 500 watts?
I can do basic mods if need be, such as drilling holes, but as I said above, I would like to save myself the work and the additional learning curve by just getting pre made cabinet. The cabinet you recommended seems nice, but with cabinets, do I have to paint them myself? Because I would prefer a black cabinet.
Also, do you know of any step by step guides for building a sub? Because once I get all the parts figured out, I still need to know where to insert them, and how to connect them to make a working subwoofer.

I know I am asking a lot, so any help you can provide is appreciated!

 

[SilverBlade]

I personally am using a pair of KRK Rokit-Powered 5 G2 speakers. Most of my music is mp3 ranging from 128 - 320. Everything I play sounds amazing on these speakers.

 

[Operandi]

Ok, well you said in the Home Theater Shack thread that you had a friend that is good with with wood working so I thought maybe you had the capacity to build your own enclosure. That will give you more flexibility and save you money but it's not a deal killer either way.

As far as what you will NEED....

1. An enclosure for the driver (subwoofer) to go in. The driver and enclosure have to be thought out as the enclosure controls the response of the driver (subwoofer).

2. A driver (subwoofer). Not much to say here really other than some drivers like bigger boxes then others so you"ll have to pick accordingly.

3. A power source / amplifier. In this case a plate amp makes the most sense since its the cheapest way to go and they designed specifically for subwoofers.

4. Some gasket tape or caulking to go around the cutout for the driver (subwoofer) and plate amp so the enclosure doesn't leak air when you want to create small earth quakes.

5. You'll need something to secure the driver (subwoofer) and plate amp to the enclosure. I really like the hex head screws from Madisound as they look much nicer than regular screws. Use the #10 for the driver (subwoofer) and the #6 for the plate amp.

As far as materials thats really all you need, you'll need some tools though. You'll need something to cut the hole for the driver (subwoofer), a plunge router with a circle jig is great for this (as your wood working friend). A jig saw can work too, you won't get as pretty as a circle but it shouldn't really matter since the frame of the driver (subwoofer) will cover it up anyway. That should be about it for the basic requirements.

Ok so you are in Canada... Honestly I'm not sure Parts Express ships to Canada, I think they do but you might want to call and check. As far as selection Parts Express probably has the biggest selection, The SWC cabinets are available in 1.0cuF size (part #302-836), 2.0cuF (302-840), and 3.0 cuF (302-844). Most people build their own cabinets though so if Parts Express doesn't ship to Canada you might have to rethink your strategy.

The driver (subwoofer) I picked (Dayton Reference)is much better than the Quatro line. That BASH plate amp you selected is actually very nice though, I think it is a bit more expensive than the one I picked. And, just because a driver (subwoofer) can handle 300 watts RMS doesn't mean you have to feed it that much. More watts just means you'll be able to run the sub louder, and regardless it will be plenty loud.

 

[a_recording]

I'm sad that no one has mentioned the Australian-made Aktimate Mini's in this thread! I guess they are less well known.

They are right in your budget, and I've read that they are better than the Audioengine A5's (hearsay I know.. I've never heard a direct comparison.) They have outputs for any subwoofer project you might be cooking up, and I can tell you that they are fantastic.

If you have a big room or want something even better, they just came out with the Aktimate Maxi's with support for streaming audio/ internet radio etc. But the Mini's are still more than enough for desktop listening, and sound amazingly dynamic.

 

[Logos]

From what I gather, that $700-750 you are seemingly stretching your budget on could be better spent by going active. If you find a pair of the wharfedale's used, you are still powering them with a used $200 receiver/amp and creating more costs with shipping for your subwoofer parts. What you are leaving out of the equation here is that you are not really doing anything to upgrade your source, which will remain the Auzentech Forte. That still means Forte>Receiver>Sub/Speakers. You can maximize the Quality of the components for the money and make it Forte>Active Sub>Active Speakers

If you are not planning on using seperates(CD player, Turntable) as your sources, and mainly having a computer based setup for $600-$750 you will be far better off showing up at your local music store, buying some active monitors and a sub for your price range and walking out. This will save you time and money.

Also, I own a pair of KRK Rokit 8's. The LAST thing on my mind has been to get a sub. These things are so damned loud, and the bass is so freaking crazy on just the speakers themselves, it really shakes the entire of my HOUSE with ease. My music tastes are similar to yours, I listen to Hip-Hop, Electro, Electronica, Techno, House, Jazz, Downtempo, etc. and the KRK's are amazing with everything, but the catch is I use a Focusrite Saffire as my source. Your Forte sounds like it would be just as good.

To sum up: if you really want to go for the 5's, then you probably will need the sub. Try the 8's and see if you even need the sub and return them if you don't. The sub is actually a beast and overkill for a lot of situations anyway. The only limiter now is my source which I am taking care of, but I recommend you head down to your local music shop, see if you have a Long & McQuade near you, and see if they can cut you a deal, doesn't hurt to ask. You will also have the benefit of actually hearing and trying them out.

 

[Operandi]

He's looking for desktop "computer speaker" replacements; that means nearfield and you can't use speaker with an 8" woofer nearfield. You need close center to center spacing (CC) of the woofer and tweeter for nearfield speaker otherwise you end up hearing the tweeter and woofer separately rather than a whole speaker. That necessitates the need for small woofer, 5" - 6.5" max.

Going with active speakers defiantly simplifies things and is probably a bit cheaper but going with passive speakers and an amplifier gives you more flexibility.

Aside from blowing a way a full range speaker in terms of bass output going with a 2.1 setup will also have the advantage of high passing the speakers which relives them from the bass duties giving them far more SPL output (much more volume) and cleaning up the mid bass region. Also speaking generally a 5 - 6" mid/woofer should sound much cleaner in the upper mid range than a big 8" woofer.

 

[Logos]

The KRK Rokit/VXT line is all designed for nearfield. The speakers that he was talking about do have a 5" woofer (KRK RP5), and are designed for desktop use, and to be paired with the matching KRK 10s subwoofer.

If he is looking for a desktop computer speaker replacement, that is still what I would recommend. Living in Canada, it is a lot more difficult to order everything from the US without paying duties, taxes and large shipping costs. My argument is that going DIY, he will be forced to order at least some of those materials from the US and increase his costs. That's why I am recommending that particular line and active, because they are easy to access here.

There is no doubt what you are saying is true, and it goes without saying. But pure bass output is not always important, and stereo can still sound very good. What I meant to say is, although a subwoofer would be nice, i'm not sitting here everyday going "man, I really need to clean up that mid bass". Most of these recordings aren't even the best quality to begin with. Especially with Hip Hop! And ultimately, his source is still a computer soundcard, which isn't going to really reveal all of those frequency ranges super accurately.

 

[wgb113]

Ckaz,

If you decide to pack it in and ditch the DIY I'd recommend finding a pair of Dynaudio BM5A's. They're active studio monitors with a 50W amp going to each driver. They've got balanced connections, a small footprint, and feature adjustments to the lows/mids/highs depending on your room and their placement.

Bill