[Maniac]

As I had gotten a Rio Karma since a while back, and it had been used on and off for quite a while. It was not until recently that I had finally got something that had the potenical of replacing it. What's that? Well, it is a PDA phone from HTC by the name of Touch Pro.

Touch Pro vs. Rio Karma, the Karma seems to be a bit lighter according to my hand.

Before anyone asked any questions, I've already drawn up a few of what I think would be the popularly asked questions.

#1 Q: Why didn't you get iPhone? iPhone 3G?
A: No VGA resolution display, no physical keyboard, no auto-focus (this comes in surprisingly handy for taking mugshots of your friend for the contact manager), I'm just not really interested in iPhones, and iPhone was never officially released in Taiwan, so support and stuff will be rather painful if I did encounter any problems.

#2 Q: Does that 3.5 adapter shown in the photo come with the phone?
A: No, I got that after market while I was shopping for a car mount for this phone, I choose this type of single "chunk" design instead of a line out cable is because most of the cable type I saw here are using some rather lousy cabling. If I had to suffer the low quality cables, then I will want to make it as short as possible. It won't break as fast as the cable type if nothing else.

#3 Q: I got some XYZ cables and ZYX connectors, can I open it up and replace the innards of the adapter?
A: No, the whole thing is injection molded, it is not only hard to open stuff like that up, but impossible to put it back together.


Okay, so much for FAQs, on with the tests.


Test environment:
Album: Paradiso, Bassa Nova/Jazz type music, Karma playing FLAC files while Touch Pro playing WMA Lossless files, all self ripped and compressed.
Earphones: Etymotic ER-4P + original black foam plugs.
Power: Using internal battery power, at least 80% or more change remaining.


I have only had it run for a little while, what I have noticed is as follows:

1. Karma sounds more soothing and more colorful than Touch Pro, tho Touch Pro's been getting better as I let it play continuously for over an hour, it is still a bit thin sounding and not as full.

1. Karma's can be turned up more without turning the whole music experience into a pain in the ear. Like above, after a full hour of run-in, Touch pro is getting better as it gets slowly burned in.

1. Touch Pro crackle and pops from time to time, to me it sounded like the playback software's multi-tasking priority is not high enough. I've sent a note on that to HTC's tech support. Hopefully they can do something about it with their next firmware release.

1. As almost all Karma users already know, Karma will crash from time to time with HDD running constantly. This is one of the reason that my Karma was not in constant use. It gets kinda annoying.

What I found surprising is:

1. Touch Pro actually sounded better than I had been expecting, but hopefully it can sound even better as I burn it in.

1. My Karma still works fine after so long, the HDD still works!

What I plan to do:
I just got my Touch Pro for a little over a week, and only started playing music on it for like an hour. I'll just let it run some more before doing more comparison, if running it for an hour can smooth it out so much, then I can't wait to hear it at the 200 and 500 hour mark...

Maybe I'll just hook up my AKG240DF on it for the fun of it.... hehe....

 

[dazzer1975]

I have yet to listen to music from my touch pro (not a pda phone, it is far more than that) but your findings sound kinda mixed. I am not sure I would necessarily think of mine as a media player, but I admit it would be cool if caught short somewhere and fancying listening to some music to just bust out the phone.

However, at the end of the day, it is a ppc and not an audio device per se. Although it wouldn't surprise if it had some good audio hardware in there as the rest of the specs speak for themselves.

 

[walkingman]

Are you using Windows Media Player or HTC's own music player? Personally I don't bother with either as both are pretty sub-par. Do try Pocket Player or Pocket Tunes and report back.

 

[shigzeo]

nothing beats the karma. it is the single greatest player ever to come out of any company despite its bass roll off and so so stereo image. it is a legend and will remain that way even after many other players who trump it in every way are on the market for many years.

it shall never die no matter what the truth about sq is.

 

[Maniac]

Quote:

Originally Posted by walkingman /img/forum/go_quote.gif Are you using Windows Media Player or HTC's own music player? Personally I don't bother with either as both are pretty sub-par. Do try Pocket Player or Pocket Tunes and report back.

I'm using the HTC's own music player, I was kinda hoping that it would be usable since it can be accessed much more easily than having to run another program. But I'll try the player you mentioned and see how it goes.

 

[Maniac]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dazzer1975 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have yet to listen to music from my touch pro (not a pda phone, it is far more than that) but your findings sound kinda mixed. I am not sure I would necessarily think of mine as a media player, but I admit it would be cool if caught short somewhere and fancying listening to some music to just bust out the phone. However, at the end of the day, it is a ppc and not an audio device per se. Although it wouldn't surprise if it had some good audio hardware in there as the rest of the specs speak for themselves.

Well, my finding is indeed mixed, but that is to be expected for something that just been playing music for an hour or so. I kinda think that even HTC didn't tried to play WMA lossless while they were doing internal beta testing of this device. However, I feel that it still have some potential, and might prove useful when you really don't want to carry more than your phone and your wallet when you go out. (Well, I ride a scooter here in Taipei, and I really hate putting too much stuff into my pocket...) Of course, there's still room for a PSP when I'm on a long trip, there just isn't a light portable device that can beat it at games... (NDS fans no offenses, I know you don't like PSP, but I just prefer a one piece device that is easy to handle, and PSP fits my hand far better than a boxy design.)

Now that reminds me of someone who claimed Linux PDA is far superior to(or did he say it was on par with, can't remember exactly) Sony's PSP, and then proceed to show me a few pics of some horizontally scrolling games (Raiden/1943 like games), tilted/angled Advanture games that looks a bit like Ultima 7 and then a few other games that looked like it came from 10~15 years ago's PC gaming industry. That was one hell of a funny guy, almost choked myself laughing.


Anyways, back to the phone. I find the phone is quite usable when I'm away from my computer, as it does ALMOST everything I want it to do. However, one down side is that it doesn't seem to retrieve Gmail's "tagged and archived" mails. (I let filter do that so I can better sort my mail for different purposes.)

 

[Maniac]

Quote:

Originally Posted by shigzeo /img/forum/go_quote.gif nothing beats the karma. it is the single greatest player ever to come out of any company despite its bass roll off and so so stereo image. it is a legend and will remain that way even after many other players who trump it in every way are on the market for many years. it shall never die no matter what the truth about sq is.

I think my Touch Pro agree with you totally, check the photo in my first post... My Touch Pro started stabbing Karma before I even took it out of the box, with the Karma fleeing and dodging all over the place. That's why you see there are a lot of knife and scrape marks on my mat and on the Karma's plastic/rubber. Nice of the phone to spare Karma's pretty face tho.

 

[Maniac]

I've just tried pocket player, and it seems that it did help a little in the department of click and and pops, but it seems that it still could happen, not sure why, I'll try a few more tunes later...

I guess I'll give Pocket Player a try next, but since the prototype DA-152 is next to me... I did the regrettable thing, by plugging my ER-4P on it... Now the phone sounds like cactus got stuck in my ears in comparison... Ah well, but this thing weights almost 20 times more than my phone and needs AC power and a computer... Guess I'm back to my phone when I'm not home...

 

[Maniac]

After these couple day of use, the sound quality improved remarkably, Piano and string instruments' mid and low freq now solid with suitable amount of mass and refinement. The originally thin sound is now getting suitably thick.

As for the crackle and pops. I've contacted HTC's online support and hopefully they can get down to the source of this. From their response, they seem to be quite willing to help. I have also tested further regarding this problem. It appears that the problem is more magnified if you have the music file fragmented across the microSD card, if it is not as fragmented, the crackle and pop does not appear as often.

So far I'm listening to the tunes on the phone as I type, it's not bad...

 

[faichiu]

you can replace karma's hard disk to compact flash.

 

[nsx_23]

Rio Karma = iRiver H320. Just one of those players that are top quality, and still continue to beat much newer opposition.

 

[Maniac]

I know Karma's HDD can be replaced with CF card, I saw some people did it. But for me, I prefer something a little thinner, a little sleeker and less prone to crashes. Believe it or not, I've head MANY problems with WM 5 system (Asus A730 PDA), but not one problem that's system related on Touch Pro, no crashes, no reboots other than ones required by software install or other tests that I was doing.

Maybe because the Touch Flo 3D shell was bypassing the problematic part of the WM 6.1, or maybe WM 6.1 for some reason unknown to the world is getting more stable.

Yes Karma have battery life many times of Touch Pro, and sound quality is likely to remain better even after Touch Pro had ran in. However, touch pro got better interface, thanks to the touch screen. It allow me not to carry an additional source, and it is far easier to pocket touch pro than the chunky Karma.

I think at the current rate, I'll be letting Karma slowly fade away from now on...

 

[kessomatt]

Wow. I just got my touch pro a few days ago. I didnt even expect this thing to sound remotely good. I plugged my dt770's in just for laughs, but I wasnt laughing when I heard it. This thing is LOUD. Must have a good amp in it. The HTC media player is a bit clunky, so I am probably going to put pocket tunes on. I didnt notice the crackling. Thats probably due to a newer rom on the sprint device.

 

[johnston21]

I'm using PocketMusic 5.1 on my Touch Pro. Also used PocketMusic previously on my PPC-6700.

It sounds great (as does TCPMP for Music Vids), but I still travel (weekly) with my Sony A829 (for now).

Just now starting to alternate each week with either the 530's or Triple'Fi's, leaving one set @ home.

...it's all good.