[spronkey]

Alright folks, I'm strongly considering purchasing either some HD600s or some Alessandro MS1s. I'm a bit of a basshead and I've read conflicting opinions about the bass on the MS1s and would just like to quantify their sound vs. reference points I know.

I have a pair of 280 Pros, and they are somewhat bass-shy. I want cans with substantially more bass than the 280 Pros! Not muffled, overpowering bass like I've heard on the Senn HD595s, but bass enough to do justice to deep vocals and even a bit of drum and bass (Pendulum, Goldie etc). AKG K701s seem to have reasonable bass response (although a little on the weak side).

How do the MS1s (and HD600s I guess - never heard them side by side with MY gear) compare in this regard?

Secondly, Grado-built cans have a good reputation for 'punchiness' - I've never heard a Grado other than the iGrado (not a huge fan - too muddy in the treble and lacked bass). How punchy are the MS-1s compared to the 280 Pros? I found the HD600s to have quite a bit of bass power, but on Rage Against the Machine's 'Take the power back' (which I guess is my reference track for 'punchiness' - my speakers are brilliant at punching the kick drum with great deadening after each slam), it just didn't quite 'hit' me..

No retailers stock any Grados down here anymore! One blamed their strange international policies and high prices from distributors. Alessandro to the rescue?

 

[moogoob]

I can't speak for Allesandros, but if you CAN get your hands on some Grados the 225s might be what you're looking for. The 60s/80s, while punchier bass-wise than the HD280pros are still, by my tastes at least, just below what I consider a proper bass level.

 

[Kernmac]

Hi Spronkey,
Alessandro MS1s are a great well balanced fon. They are fairly dynamic, have a good range and are just plain fun. Bang for your buck there is little that will come close. They are punchy enough from the bass, reasonable impact, certainly not muddy or boomy. However, I would say that they are still a little shy in the bass impact department. I wouldn't describe them as deep, or powerful in their bass. Having said all that, they are lively, exciting, and for my money have the ability to evoke emotion in lots of music. They are great for rock, and do well with most genres however trance, house and bass centric, isn't their strong point. Don't get me wrong, they still do it well but you won't get that "venue/nigt club" sub woofer thump. Beware buying the MS1, your wallet will run away and buy an MS2 as soon as you turn your back, especialy if you are looking for a bit more of a bass kick and a bit more musicality across the spectrum. MS2i now there's a can.

 

[spronkey]

I'm currently considering SR-80s, MS-1s and SR-225s - I just want a taste of the Grado sound really, to see if I like it. Does anyone have experience with The Jazz Loft (The Jazz Loft)? They appear to offer free shipping on Grado worldwide! Edit: scrap that, Alan from Jazz Loft came back and said they can't ship outside the US!

However, at the same time, because they are so hard to get, I don't really want to buy the SR-60s or MS1s if they are rather lacking in low-end just in case I really take to the Grado sound and find myself wanting more bass!

The MS2i.. are they harsher than the MS1 or SR-225? They have the metal enclosures which puts me off them slightly. Then again, for the same price as the MS2i, I could buy a pair of HD600s...

 

[Kernmac]

Thats the 60 million dollar dilema. Get the entry level model, like the sound, move up the ladder. You look back and think, "wish I had just started at the top and saved all that money". However purchase the flagship model and decide the sound isn't for you then-"why did I waste that much money?" Having said that, I am one that believes the headphone journey is the reason for being a headfier not the destination. A lot like life really.

Are the MS2i harsher than the MS1 or sr-225? Well I've never heard the 225s but i can state with authority (at least by my ears) the MS2i is sonically superior to the brilliant MS1 in all respects. They are not harsh, not by my ears they arn't. Will they have the bass kick you are looking for? I don't know. They have bass impact and I think they do a good job of it, but they are no bass monster. My quick impressions of the MS2i over the MS1 are below, hope it helps. By the way, "metal enclosures puts me off slightly" - The Metal Alessandros are a work of art, machined metal and the smell of a Leather headband , you're kidding me, their beautiful. And to all that think they're too weighty, get a neck. Sure they're no good for travel or head banging, but too heavy?
MS1s were my first real headphone. Listening to them for the first time in comparison to other fons I have owned, was like chalk and cheese. These fons bought the music alive, they involved me, and put emotion into my listening experience. Go team Alesandro.

The question became, if I go up the headphone path (MS2i) how much better are they or does the science of diminishing returns mean I spend a lot of money, on little improvement; particularly because my sources are basic. (Zen Nano plus and Samsung Z5F-both amped through Porta Corda III and Sony Walkman)

MS2i Fatboy-Settled on reverse bowls (for now)

First impression –wow. Same sound signature as my MS1 but more body and extension.

The MS2 is an aggressive headphone, forward, fast, and with plenty of PraT.
The bass is strong and punchy, with more extension than the MS1 and more impact, but certainly not a bassy phone and in no way dark. At the other end of the sound spectrum, highs are extended, but not what I would call dominant, not overly bright or sibilant. The midrange is clear, crisp and with good separation. Not too forward or recessed, there is no emphasis on any particular frequency so I find them well balanced and enjoyable at any volume, but particularly when playing rock loud. I feel the MS2 is more detailed and balanced tonally than the MS1 (which is a great fon in itself and must rank as one of the best bangs for your buck out there) it is a very musical headphone, fun, and involving. They are built like they sound, refined and solid. There is something about crafted aluminum and stitched leather.

I don’t find the extra weight an issue (these are still not heavy phones) and in general I find supraaural comfortable. These are great fons, not fatiguing in any way for my money, very musical, very involving, emotion stirring and enjoyable. Worth the extra money over the MS1? Probably not for your average human, but for a headfier-definitely.

 

[nickchen]

My vote for the MS1, especially if you are situated outside the US. I personally wouldn't say that the SR225 sounds better, it just has less highs.

Don't worry too much about the bass of the MS1. It still has that famous Grado midbass hump that makes more "audiophile" contender sound sterile in comparison. And the MS1 is heavily modifyable (click on the MS1000 link in my sig).

Hands away from the MS2i. Very limited genre bandwidth, listening fatigue and awful comfort due to weight. Sold mine after a year of little usage. Only for clinical metal- and rockheads IMO.

 

[22906]

I have both MS1 and HD580, and can say the MS1 has an emphasis in the upper bass, and lacks extension in the low frequencies. I find the bass response in the HD580 to be far more realistic because of its very good extension and reasonable impact. I think you'll like the HD580 better if you're looking for a headphone with 'solid' bass.

PS. I think the reason you might not feel the impact the HD600 can offer (assuming its similar to the HD580) is amplification. I can't overstate the importance of a powerful and precise amplifier with the HD580. You NEED a desktop amp like a PPA or CKKIII or something to even begin to see the HD580's potential, and one of the most noticeable improvements is the amount of bass over portable/low-powered amps.

 

[BrookR1]

The MS-1s were designed to be more neutral than the Grados, so by definition they will be less punchy than the Grados. They were designed to be analytical and these cans really emphasize the highs and mids. I think you'll find the bass lacking. The SR-80s are definitely punchier, and if you find you need more bass, you can do the bass-head tape mod. They place more emphasis on highs than the iGrados (if you have the old version of the iGrados, there's a mod you can do to open these up...if you have the new version, you're stuck).

I'm listening to the HD-600s right now. These have a sound that is more laid back and liquid but have less punch than the Grados. The soundstage is nicer, though. The bass extends without being obnoxious. I was never a fan of the HD-280s. Compared to the 280s, I find the 600s to be more forward and engaging. But nothing grabs you by the hair like the SR-80s.

 

[guttorm]

I've owned both and from my recollection the ms1s had a livelier bass response. the 280s, although good, were closer to being what I would describe as honky.

 

[spronkey]

Heh, honky. THat's definitely what I'm beginning to hear from the 280 Pros (they're probably around 200-300 hours of use now). Very unrealistic and coloured midrange, but only when compared to the rest of the sonic signature. They would fit in just fine with my SHP895s, but with the lightweight bass of the 280 Pros they just don't work.

My amplification at the moment is the head amp on my Logitech Z560THX speakers (not great, but has a decent amount of power output. Was considering modifying it with some BB op-amps but never got around to it), and the headphone out on a NAD C320BEE. I listened to the HD600s from a Denon integrated amp, so probably average but not amazing headphone output with high output impedence (if anything like the NAD).

I might have a go with SR-80s if I can - the good thing is if I find someone willing to ship to NZ I can always sell them over here for basically what I paid for them (local distributors sell SR80s for, get this, $195 USD!).

I might also have a go with MS-1s at the same time... oh, my poor wallet.

 

[nickchen]

A SR80 and a MS1 together would be a bit redundant, just like 2 different brands of unsalted butter from the supermarket.

 

[Aruna]

IMO, HD280 do better in instrument separation and dynamic, but MS1 is well neutral & balance for any type of music.

 

[bobkin]

I think the MS1000 mod looks awesome. And easy too! That's it decided for me i think!

 

[nickchen]

You're welcome!

 

[mr56k]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobkin /img/forum/go_quote.gif I think the MS1000 mod looks awesome. And easy too! That's it decided for me i think!

Let us no what you think once you get them. I own both the SR60's and the MS1's. I like both but my MS-1's are one of my favorite headphones. I listen to a lot of rock and they sound great with all of it "imo". They don't have that boomy bass but have more of a tight controlled bass. Also at a $100 its a great deal. Good Luck!

Ryan