[redshifter]

dark angel-
being a beethoven expert i have to correct you on the 3rd symphony. it was originally dedicated to napolean, but when he crowned himself emperor of france, beethoven removed napoleon's name from the dedication. beethoven scratched out napoleon's name so firmly he ripped through 3 pages of his score. i think the dedication stands now as "to the memory of a great man".

for heroic music do try beethoven's 3rd symphony, i find the karl bohm version with the vienna philharmonic (from the 1970s i think) especially moving in the slow movement, when in the midst of the funeral march a lone french horn soars over the violins. i've never heard another version that captures that feeling of heroism better than that moment in that specific recording--in the midst of despair it is like an eagle soaring through a shaft of sunlight in a storm-torn sky. also, beethoven's 5th, 7th, and 9th symphonies are very heroic, and deal with triumph over fate.

wagner has written some amazing heroic music, try something from his ring cycle. the orchestral music that goerge szell recorded is especially good, and the funeral music and rhine journey stand out. i got to see the ring cycle and by the time gotterdammerung was over there were tears running down my face. i get goosebumps just thinking about it.

there are others but for me there is no music like beethoven's. it cuts me to the core every time. no matter how i'm feeling his music always leaves me smiling and happy. no other composer reaches me the way he does, from his smallest bagatelle to his largest symphony. he is the definition of "heroic". the best beethoven interpreters are:
karl bohm (cond.--introspective and expansive--slower tempos)
herbert von karajan (cond.--energy and polish--faster tempos)
w. furtwangler (cond.--spiritual and expansive)
alfred brendel (piano--powerful and undiluted--i believe he plays much like beethoven must have)
i know there are many others but these are my favorites.

 

[XXhalberstramXX]

I see a lot of Prokofiev here, but y'all seem to have forgotten what has to be one of the most heroic of all Prokofiev pieces:

Alexander Nevsky : This was composed to be film music for the movie with the same title by Sergei Eisenstein. It's unabashedlly propagandistic, but wonderful none the less. Listen to the music and then rent the movie, it's a great experience. Makes you want to move to Russia and kill Germans. almost.

Apparantly the san fransisco symphony did something where they proformed the peice while showing the movie. must have made for a great show.

I personally think that Bruckner's last two symphonies (8&9) are very heroic sounding. the Horenstein recordings are reccomended for this peice.

 

[stuartr]

Yeah, I would agree that Alexander Nevsky is very heroic music. A good movie too. Much of mainstream Soviet music is very heroic, but almost all of it is extremely banal. I would not say that Shostakovich suffers from this however, but neither would I say his music is heroic. Not even the 5th or 7th symphonies. They are more pseudo-heroic. If you listen carefully to a recording of the symphony played strictly from the score, the irony present in the work is readily heard. Bernstein is notorious for not presenting this side of the piece, while Russians such as Mravinsky or Shostakovich's son Maxim present it much more clearly. The tension lies partly in its odd orchestration, where Shostakovich assigns instruments parts that are at the very tip of their range, extends themes far past their comfort point (in the finale, the strings have to play 252 impossibly high A notes in a row!) and basically brutalizes the orchestra with the music. The result is a very grand, but very disturbing symphony. There is some very interesting background to the composition and its performance, and anyone intersted in it should let me know, and I could say some more, or direct people where they could read more about it.
Anyway, just because I think it is more tragic than heroic, don't let that stop you from listening to it, as it is an incredible work.

 

[Wes]

Shostakovich's eleventh symphony is another good one in the heroic vein. Hard to say whether much irony is involved in this one, though. I take it at face value as a celebration of the ideals and the martyrs of the early stages of the Russian revolution. Either way, certainly heroic. Maybe more broad than subtle, but very engaging no matter how you take it.

Best recording of it that I know is James de Priest with the Helsinki Philharmonic on Delos, stunningly recording with a huge dynamic range.

stuartr: Saw your piece on the Shostakovich eight quartet, and I'm impressed. Since you've done so much research on Shostakovich, I'm wondering whether you think "Testimony" is legitimate, forged, or something in between.

 

[stuartr]

Wes -- I have not researched the 11th, so I cannot really comment on it. But from what I have read of your posts, you seem to be very knowledgeable, so I imagine you are right. I too think Shostakovich had strong sympathy for real socialists, not exploiters of the people. As for Testimony, in my thesis I talked a bit about it. I think for the most part it is true, but it is not something that you want to use for concrete evidence. Galina Shostakovich characterized it as rife with "kitchen talk", and Rostropovich felt that it was basically true, but for the most part a a collection of "anekdoty". I tend to agree with them. The overall attitude is true, but individual things may be exagerrations or half-truths. Shostakovich was not an idol of truthfulness, so it makes it difficult to use it as proof of anything. It was somewhat of a dilemma for me in writing my thesis. I basically tried to argue my point without resorting to it, even though I feel as though it is legitimate.
Thanks for reading my junk on the 8th. It is nice to have someone other than my advisors read it after putting so much work into it.
Stu

 

[durang]

'Ein Heldenleben' translates as "A Hero's Life" (I think).

It's one of Richard Strauss' tone poems.

I think it sounds very heroic but I think it's supposed to be based on the composer's life.

Durang

 

[tooler]

Thanks. I'll check these out. There seem to be a lot of military and political themes. Is there anything more general -- like inspiriation in human beings?

 

[wChen]

If it hasn't already been mentioned, fanfare for the common man (Copeland) might be considered heroic.

 

[DarkAngel]

Quote:

Originally posted by tooler Thanks. I'll check these out. There seem to be a lot of military and political themes. Is there anything more general -- like inspiriation in human beings?

That sound pretty deep/philosophical/religious maybe what you are really looking for is MAHLER......or perhaps Bruckner. These tend to be very long monumental symphonies that deal with mans mortality and his relation with the creator.........don't ask me to explain further. For simple heroic go with marches.

Inspiration is a very general term, and different from heroic which implies someone who helps/saves others by overcoming some diffcult obstacle successfully.