[carlosgp]

I am trying to decide my next "toy". It would be a pair of RS-1s (with flats) or the new Denon D5000, both in the "bass" side of the balance, I think

.

But let's talk about grados... I use my HF-1 with flats and I love it. I love the bass, and although I realize is a little too bloated, I like its volume. I never liked them with bowls, too bright and thin sounding for my actual tastes. With flats are a different beast. Smooth in the highs, roaring guitars and a strong foundation. So I am thinking about a pair of RS-1s and I will use them with flats too. What can I expect from them, taking the HF1+flats as reference?

I will use them as my main headphones for rock (from classic 70' rock to death metal) with a Singlepower MPX3 Slam.

 

[analog'd]

flats were all there were (john had the bowls made years later) when i got my rs1 100 years ago (ok more like 10 or 11). and i have never warmed up to bowls. i switch but always return to the flats with my current grado, the ps-1.

anywho, people are gonna answer very specifically about mids highs and lows better than i can. but i can tell you that if you like the HF-1's (which i've heard a lot as i got my daughter and stepson each a pair) you will just love the rs1's. they are simply "more" and "better" of the sonic signature which you are enjoying. they are more refined across the board. the mids are just crasy beautiful. they are fantastic with all kinds of music but it is not a rumour that their major mojo is for all things rock n roll.

the ps1's are even "more" of the same, and i love them big time. but if i hadn't lucked into a pair when i could sorta afford them, a pair of rs1's is what they would be prying out of my hands when it all comes to an end, and i'd still have a huge smile on my face from all that grado goodness. you are gonna love them.

 

[lmilhan]

Love my RS-1s with Flats for Solid State amplification, Bowls for Tube Amplification.

PS-1s with Flats are just toooooo much Bass for me, be it Solid State or Tube amplification. They are already Bass monsters with Bowls! To my ears, the Bass I get from the PS-1s with Flats just overpowers everything else.

If you enjoy your HF-1s with Flats in your current rig, it is highly likely that you will love the RS-1s with flats in your current rig.

 

[Arainach]

Flats are kind of fun, but I find the bass too much on the RS-1. Also, the Treble "sparkle" and Soundstage disappear, and there's not nearly as much detail as there is with Bowls. I say get both and figure out which ones you like better. I use my Flats for Gaming and my Bowls for actual music.

 

[carlosgp]

Thank you for your answers. I knew I was going to receive positive opinions, but you never know. I have not seen many people who use HF-1s with flats...

 

[lator]

I recently aquired a pair of RS-1 and I have only the flats at my disposal right now. The bass is very heavy but it works wonders for Jazz, Blues and Classical music. For Classic Rock it is great as well like The Doors albums. For heavier stuff the bass is simply too much though making them sound average at best. Nevertheless my reference headphones for Jazz and Classical atm.

 

[carlosgp]

Lator, what you say is precisely what I am looking for

. I want the RS-1 to be a bass heavy headphone, impactful and refined at the same time. I suppose PS1s would be perfect, but it is too much money for me

.
Classic rock is my main goal for these cans, and anyway I like my metal bassy. I do not share the "fast sound" theory for metal, that in many headphones it translates in bright sound. Of course fast is good, but I need a strong bass too for reproducing the "wall of sound" presentation of live metal concerts. If I had to choose, I would prefer a little more full bodied than fast.
And you have a MPX3 Slam, so I suppose your setup is very similar to mine. I am almost decided

.

 

[wolfen68]

I have to disagree a little with everyone....based on your "wall of sound" comment:

If you are listening to HF-1's with flats, I think you have the potential to be (at least initially) disappointed by RS-1's with or without flats. They are more refined and are the better headphone....but won't offer that same "blanket of fullness" you've grown accustomed to. Over time you may appreciate the RS-1 qualities, but you may think it sounds thin at first.

I have nothing against RS-1's, but the way you're using your HF-1's (and liking them) is an extreme that the RS-1's won't match (unless maybe you had a warm tube amp with the flats).

One headphone I'd be curious for you to try is a woodied HF-1. They have substantially more bass and bowls are almost 'required' to tone these down.

If you tried one with flats

 

[carlosgp]

Hi wolfen, your comments are very interesting. Reading about RS-1s and HF-1s, I have thought the same many times. I listened the RS-1s some time ago and I remember them thin and refined, but I listened to them with bowls. All grados seem thin to me with bowls

. I remember the sweet highs too, and the fast and tight bass, much better than the rest of grados I auditioned the same day -- basically the entire grado line pre-GS1000.
Anyway, the bass of the HF1s with flats is a little bloated and muddied. Fun, but surely it can be tuned down a bit

. I think I will have to try the RS-1s and decide for myself...
I am not going to sell my HF-1s, so I can always "headphile" them and compare. Sounds like a plan

 

[lator]

I think RS-1 bass is a bit muddy with flats but then again I come from a totally different phones than you. Other very good thing with RS-1 is that they never ever sound harsh. Modern overly hot and compressed records sound actually ok with them which is a great feature as my W5000 approaches these records without mercy

. Thin is the last thing I am hearing but flats are a major factor. What tubes are you using with your HF-1 Carlos?

 

[carlosgp]

I have bought a pair of RS-1s from Silentpug387 (thanks!).
I am using a Heed Canamp with my HF1. I have one of my 5687 adaptors broken and I am waiting a replacement from Mikhail. I have some raytheon tough.
Anyway, I think the Heed is pretty good with grados, but now that I think about it maybe it is lighter than the singlepower. With a bit of luck the RS-1s with the slam will have the right amount of bass for my tastes.
And I love what you are describing about RS-1 never sounding harsh. This feature will be much appreciated by me. I am really sensitive to harsh highs

.

 

[MD1032]

Quote:

Originally Posted by carlosgp /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hi wolfen, your comments are very interesting. Reading about RS-1s and HF-1s, I have thought the same many times. I listened the RS-1s some time ago and I remember them thin and refined, but I listened to them with bowls. All grados seem thin to me with bowls . I remember the sweet highs too, and the fast and tight bass, much better than the rest of grados I auditioned the same day -- basically the entire grado line pre-GS1000. Anyway, the bass of the HF1s with flats is a little bloated and muddied. Fun, but surely it can be tuned down a bit . I think I will have to try the RS-1s and decide for myself... I am not going to sell my HF-1s, so I can always "headphile" them and compare. Sounds like a plan

I beg to differ. I use the HF-1's with flats and greatly enjoy the balance the flats offer. I had the opportunity to slap a pair of RS-1's on at the Philadelphia meet in March, and they had everything I loved about the HF-1's, but did it way better (much better soundstage and high end for one thing). They were phenomenal, of course. They're the RS-1's. And I did try them with bowls, and it was a similar experience to the HF-1's with bowls - too bright for my tastes. So yeah, I'm pretty much convinced the only upgrade for me Grado-wise in the (certainly distant) future is RS-1, or higher.

 

[carlosgp]

Well, I like the balance in HF-1s with flats too, do not misunderstand me. I like the bass volume in relation with the remaining of the spectre and love the impact. The depth could be a lot better tough. But the bass quality, being good enough, cannot be called excellent (all this from a flats lover, of course). I find it a little muddied, just a bit nasal, and this is the main reason why I want to try the RS-1s. I feel I need something better. I can't be blamed, can I?

Anyway, your comments about your experience in the Philadelphia meet are most encouraging. I really look forward receiving my new grados.

 

[carlosgp]

I finally got my pair of RS-1s... And I am delighted

.

I do not consider myself a Grado fan, but these "flatted" RS-1s are too much. Just what I was looking for. As several of you suggested, they have everything I like about HF-1s, but better. Much, much better.

They are not lighter than HF-1s. In fact, I found them bassier! The truth is that I still have not compared them with bowls, but with flats I think RS-1s are richer and fuller sounding. I love it! I think they have more bass, but cleaner, deeper, tighter and better defined. It does not feel a bit bloated and muddied like in HF-1s. And yes, they provide the "blanket of fullness" wolfen68 was talking about

. And this with the Heed, not with the MPX3 SLAM -- I still have not received the adaptor replacement from Mikhail.

But above all, the impact is much greater. The overall sound is more dynamic and engaging. Without doubt, I find them excellent for all kinds of rock. And as I remembered, the highs are really sweet, even with bowls. I cannot say the same for other grados, but with RS1s I see myself using the bowls with certain kinds of music, at least in their reversed form

.

Defects? As I knew from the HF-1s, RS-1s with flats do not have any soundstage, but I think this is part of the "magic" these cans have with rock. And you can always tune their sound just by changing the pads.

Now I will try to enjoy my new headphones for a while and try to avoid wondering about how the HF-1s may sound "headphiled"...

 

[wolfen68]

I'm glad you like the RS-1's...they're definitely a headphone I've considered re-visiting.