[Keiso]

As I wrote on a previous thread, I've borrowed a pair of HD600 to compare with my HD590.

Now, my plan was to buy a set of Stax SRS-2020 Basic System II this weekend. But now that I've been listening to the HD 600 for 3 days now, I'm not so sure anymore....

Like I wrote, I'm using the HD600 directly from my SACD player, without a dedicated amp. But already now, I think they kick a lot of @ss!

Buying the Stax set will cost me about twice the price of a pair of HD600. But if I go for the HD600, I will surely upgrade my set later with an amp (most likely with the Sugden Headmaster). Together with a quality amp and maybe the Carda cable, I think the HD600 will be more than a match for the Stax Basic System....

I'm a student with a limited budget right now, but I'm willing to save up and upgrade big time later.

Here's what I think about the Staxs vs. HD600:

STAX:
+ Very comfortable to wear, minimum pressure from the frame.
+ Soothing sound. Music just come out effortlessly. You can listen to them for hours with a smile on your face

+ Including a dedicated amp perfectly matched with the earspeakers.
+ Price more than a pair of HD600, but less than HD600 and a quality amp.

- The pads! The leather will kinda stick to your face after a couple of songs.
- The plastic frame! Not even half as durable as the carbonfiber frame of HD600.
- Lack the bass punch of dynamic headphones (but make it up with deep, tight bass!)

Sennheiser HD600:
+ We all know how good they sound...
+ Look hell lot cooler!
+ Carbonfiber frame can take much more beating!
+ Easily upgradeable/exchangable parts.

- Even after extensive stretching, the pressure from the frame is killing me... I can't wear them for more than half an hour continuously. Need to rest a couple of minutes at least....
- They are not electrostats

So go for Stax or join the already overcrowded gang of HD600 lovers?

Will somebody please give me some advice before my Stax deal runs out on Saturday? Thanks in advance....

 

[shivohum]

HD600

 

[dngl]

What do you listen to? I find that electrostats in general are less versatile... although they do what they do extremely well (to me, they are ideal for classical... but a comparable stax system cost far more than my melos/senn combo). How much of an issue is money?

 

[Audio-Me]

Before you make a decision, try to audition the HD600 with a good amp. Then choose the one you think you would enjoy more.

 

[Keiso]

Mostly Pop music (J-pop), some rock and some slow, strong vocal songs.

My current budget can only get me either a Stax Basic System II or a pair of HD 600 with money left to save for amp (or buy more music!)

But I have to say, that the Basic System II is quite an all-rounder. It performed very well with the pop music I usually listen to....

 

[Keiso]

Quote:

Originally posted by Audio&Me Before you make a decision, try to audition the HD600 with a good amp. Then choose the one you think you would enjoy more.

Oh, I would like nothing more than that. But the problem is, I'm stuck in a country called Norway

It seems like people here don't know what a headphone amp is, so the only way for me to get one, is to import one.....

 

[gloco]

Quote:

Originally posted by Keiso Oh, I would like nothing more than that. But the problem is, I'm stuck in a country called Norway It seems like people here don't know what a headphone amp is, so the only way for me to get one, is to import one.....

I'm sure you could get a corda from meier-audio.com for a good price with the 600's, it's based in Germany. Jan Meier will probably cut you a good deal for both if you went with him.

I have an old pair of stax and their general sound characteristics are more towards the AKG 501's than the Sennheiser's. I wonder if the more recent stax still carry on the same sonic signature?

 

[Keiso]

If I was to get a amp to go with the HD600, I wouldn't settle for just a Corda. At least a Sugden Headmaster I think.

Headphones are big in Japan too, sorta. HD600 are loved by many, many Japanese. In fact, the most popular high-end combo for them is the HD600 + Clou Red + Sugden HM. They rate this combo only second to a Omega II set with 007t.....

So if I'm going to get the Sugden anyway, I don't want to waste money on getting something in between.....

My main gripe against the HD600 is actually the pressure it has on my head. The lower edge of the cans are pressing on my neck, blocking some of my veins, which is VERY, VERY uncomfortable.....

I'll try to stretch them out a bit more. But the thing is, everytime I stretch time out, after a few hours, they regain the tension again!!! ARGH!

 

[Mumrik]

I think the HD600 losens it's grip with time... I tried out an old pair of HD600's at the Danish Fona2000 and they were very comfortable, almost "invisible"...

 

[Audio-Me]

Have you considered a AudioValve RKV Mark II? A very finicky head-fier kelly loves his (he didn't like Antique Sound Lab MG Head

). That to me says something damn good about the RKV. It's a little over $1000 USD retail I think, but I believe kelly got his used for $800. If I wasn't already dead locked (and saving up every penny) on the Cary CAD-300SEI, I'd most likely try to hunt the RKV down.

Of course all this will be wasteful without a good source. What will you be using for this system (already have or plan on getting)?

Better cables for the HD600 is recommended but in my opinion not necessary. I use the Clou Red cable right now, and plan on trying out the Stefan AudioArt Equinox cable. Many people seem more interested in the new Cardas cable however, including kelly.

Don't forget good interconnect cables to hook up your source to an amp. You have a huge variety to choose from for cables. I use Audioquest Coral, planning to try Bolder Type 2.

The strap of the HD600 loosens up over time. You can speed up this process by stretching it out (place it over a 20cm wide box or something overnight, for a few weeks, or everynight before you go to sleep if you'd like).

 

[Vertigo-1]

Keiso, one thing to take note of (I notice your music tastes are quite similar to mine) is that Staxs are very revealing of bad recordings. I would not consider most Asian pop to be well recorded, and Asian languages all tend to be somewhat sibilant in nature. Given that, you could get stung quite a bit by sibilance, especially if your source isn't up to par for Staxs.

Warm, smooth headphones tend to sound best with Asian pop, especially listening to those young voices crooning slowly in your ears. I think you know what I'm talking about.

Without a doubt though, if I had a choice today (if only my ears weren't busted), I'd go with an electrostat. There's something extra fun about just being able to hear from wall to wall of a recording. It's a major wow factor for certain, especially if during the short demo periods in a store. Keep in mind though that this ability is only so fun...after a while when you come back down to earth to truly listen to and enjoy the music, you may find it not so enjoyable. The only way to truly figure out if the Staxs are right for you is to do an extended audition with as many various types of music as possible. Particularly try some recordings that you feel aren't very well recorded...people aren't lying when they say Staxs can literally render half their recordings unlistenable because of their extremely revealing nature.

I agree about the HD-600's being way too tight...a solution is to actually just extend the headband by a notch or two over. You definitely don't want to make the headband just perfectly fit your head, that's how you get a vise-like grip. Loosen it up one to two notches over what would be the "just perfect" fit for you, and you may find it a little more comfy.

 

[Lunatic]

Being a long-time lurker I thought I'd share my experience this time as I own both the Stax SRS-3030 and the HD600 (currently driven by an X-Can V2 and in need of a Melos!).

I totally agree with Vertigo-1 that the Stax are very revealing (or shall we say "less forgiving") so poorly engineered recordings will sound bad through them. I listen to mostly classical and sometimes jazz and classic rock therefore the Stax can give me a very satisfying experience with good recordings. I also much prefer the wider, less "in your head" kind of sound stage the Stax reproduce. However when I want to listen to a historic recording (e.g. Schnabel playing Beethoven transferred from 78s made in the 1930s) I'd most definitely switch to the HD600. On the other hand, HD600 driven by a tube amp could sound very involving and moving with many recordings. In the end I'd say that I wouldn't be without either systems. Right now I want to get the most out of the HD600 by upgrading to a much better amp (where's the best place to find a used Melos SHA Gold?) and perhaps getting the Cardas cables (gotta sell the Clou Blue I have now first).

I feel the HD600 is more comfortable for me over extended period of listening, so much so that I could fall asleep while wearing them during bedtime listening sessions.

 

[Keiso]

Quote:

Have you considered a AudioValve RKV Mark II? A very finicky head-fier kelly loves his (he didn't like Antique Sound Lab MG Head ). That to me says something damn good about the RKV. It's a little over $1000 USD retail I think, but I believe kelly got his used for $800. If I wasn't already dead locked (and saving up every penny) on the Cary CAD-300SEI, I'd most likely try to hunt the RKV down.

Oh my GOD! That RKV Mark II looks BAD-@SS!!!! Very high-end looking, but yet the size looks just right! This baby looks like if it's actually worth the retail price

Of course, that Cary amp looks very sweet too

Quote:

Of course all this will be wasteful without a good source. What will you be using for this system (already have or plan on getting)?

Of course, it's not like I'm planning to use the cans to listen to MP3s on my PC

I like my current SACD player a lot, it's a European model: SCD-XB940. I would say it's one of the better players in the middle-class. Plays everything with great detail and flat. It should be enough for me for now....

Quote:

Don't forget good interconnect cables to hook up your source to an amp. You have a huge variety to choose from for cables. I use Audioquest Coral, planning to try Bolder Type

Of course, while I'm relatively new to the headphone addiction, I've been a Hi-Fi man for years. For me, interconnects make night and day differences, and I've already got many lying around here I would like to experience with a headphone amp

Quote:

The strap of the HD600 loosens up over time. You can speed up this process by stretching it out (place it over a 20cm wide box or something overnight, for a few weeks, or everynight before you go to sleep if you'd like).

****, I'm using a bunch of DVD boxes right now, I guess around 25 cm wide. I woke up this morning to find the HD600s soft and nice, but if I take them down from the box and leave them on my desk for a few hours, they regain the tension. I hope this will not happen again over time.....

 

[Keiso]

Vertigo-1:
Quote:

Keiso, one thing to take note of (I notice your music tastes are quite similar to mine) is that Staxs are very revealing of bad recordings. I would not consider most Asian pop to be well recorded, and Asian languages all tend to be somewhat sibilant in nature. Given that, you could get stung quite a bit by sibilance, especially if your source isn't up to par for Staxs.

Aa! Yatto nakama wo mistsuketa!!!
(yes! Finally found an "ally"!!!)

Yes, I agree. Being half Chinese and half Japanese, I know that many Asian recordings are not up to standard. But actually, that's mostly the case with HK CDs (original ones!!). Most of my Japanese CDs are just fine. Like from Utada Hikaru, I have no problems with her recordings at all

Which anime soundtracks to you like? I, too, have a whole bunch of them. Grew up with anime and videogames, so I've very found of those soundtracks.... (bring back memories!)


Quote:

Without a doubt though, if I had a choice today (if only my ears weren't busted), I'd go with an electrostat. There's something extra fun about just being able to hear from wall to wall of a recording. It's a major wow factor for certain, especially if during the short demo periods in a store. Keep in mind though that this ability is only so fun...after a while when you come back down to earth to truly listen to and enjoy the music, you may find it not so enjoyable. The only way to truly figure out if the Staxs are right for you is to do an extended audition with as many various types of music as possible. Particularly try some recordings that you feel aren't very well recorded...people aren't lying when they say Staxs can literally render half their recordings unlistenable because of their extremely revealing nature.

No doubt. But the thing is, I already have a pair of HD590s which I love. I know that a HD600 with a high-end amp will kick 590s' @ss easily, but just for enjoyment, the HD590s will do a decent job usually.....

That's one of the reasons I went to check out Stax. I want to experience sound which is different from the tons of dynamic headphones I've tried.

Quote:

I agree about the HD-600's being way too tight...a solution is to actually just extend the headband by a notch or two over. You definitely don't want to make the headband just perfectly fit your head, that's how you get a vise-like grip. Loosen it up one to two notches over what would be the "just perfect" fit for you, and you may find it a little more comfy.

Yes, I hope they will become more comfy.... I have to return these on Monday, so this better happen quickly

 

[Keiso]

Quote:

Being a long-time lurker I thought I'd share my experience this time as I own both the Stax SRS-3030 and the HD600 (currently driven by an X-Can V2 and in need of a Melos!).

Wow.... didn't know that my fellow countrymen in Beijing have access to this high-end stuff as well. God, I must definitely change my view on China these days

Quote:

I totally agree with Vertigo-1 that the Stax are very revealing (or shall we say "less forgiving") so poorly engineered recordings will sound bad through them. I listen to mostly classical and sometimes jazz and classic rock therefore the Stax can give me a very satisfying experience with good recordings. I also much prefer the wider, less "in your head" kind of sound stage the Stax reproduce. However when I want to listen to a historic recording (e.g. Schnabel playing Beethoven transferred from 78s made in the 1930s) I'd most definitely switch to the HD600. On the other hand, HD600 driven by a tube amp could sound very involving and moving with many recordings. In the end I'd say that I wouldn't be without either systems. Right now I want to get the most out of the HD600 by upgrading to a much better amp (where's the best place to find a used Melos SHA Gold?) and perhaps getting the Cardas cables (gotta sell the Clou Blue I have now first).

Yeah, actually, I do want the HD600 badly. I know they will probably be better suited for my music listening.... But there are so many advantages with a Stax too.... I don't need worrying about getting an amp later, for example. Tough choice, tough choice.

Quote:

I feel the HD600 is more comfortable for me over extended period of listening, so much so that I could fall asleep while wearing them during bedtime listening sessions.

REALLY!? You think the HD600 are MORE comfortable than the Staxs? Wow... that's new to me

I think I'll definitely need to go audition the Stax once more to make up my mind. But that would be my 3rd time this week.... the owner is going to throw me out soon....

Too bad he wouldn't let me borrow one home for comparision. If I could, my choice would be a lot easier. I told him I was considering either the Stax or the Senns, and he said that he didn't like the Senns. "Too cold" he said. And then he mentioned the Grado 325 as the better dynamic headphones. Right then, I almost threw up! God... the word Grado just disgusts me.