[nefilim]

Hi All,

I've had my Sennheisers HD580 (stock cable) for a few years now, along with my trusty & beloved Wheatfield HA-1 (about to receive a tube upgrade). A week ago I bought a pair of Grado RS-2s. I use my headphone system at the office, close to 8 hours a day. 200gig firewire drive, FLAC, Xitel Pro Link (still deciding on a DAC), Wheatfield, 'phones. I mostly listen to electronica (deep house, lounge, downbeat) but overall have a very wide taste in music, from Rammstein to Rachmaninov!

After a week of listening to mostly the Grados I've got a better idea of what I want but it's not met by either pair of cans. In a nutshell, the RS-2s have a nice lively dynamic presentation, punchy bass (although not as much extension as the 580s), a lovely immediate warm midrange, which is what attracted me to them most. They seem to do very well on well recorded strings, acoustic guitar especially. However, from the upper mids up they are scorching! When the recording is not perfectly suited to the RS-2s, it will beat you mercilessly with the mistakes. For instance listening to Morcheeba's Charango album, Sao Paulo, the snare drum rim shots are so hot, all texture disappears, it's just a painful whack. With the Senns it's somewhat more in the background but the wood on metal is identifiable and there's no wincing involved

I also find the RS-2s to compress much more in the upper registers at higher volumes than the 580s and also much more prone to exaggerated sibilance.

The RS-2s grabs you by the ears and shove the music down, which can be pretty exciting but after a few hours (or less) becomes rather fatiguing, especially with less perfect recordings. The Senns on the other hand is much more subtle and smooth in presentation, sometimes a little boring and in comparison to the RS2s subdued and somewhat veiled in the midrange, it does not have the immediacy of standing next to the musician. The trebles might be a little rolled off in addition to being somewhat recessed. While the RS-2s got my toes tapping here and there, the 580s woos me with smooth textures (if that makes any sense) and pleasant (and polite?) demeanor. I can listen to the 580s all day without fatigue. This is also contributed by the superior comfort (and build quality!!) of the 580s.

So what do I want? I want the 580s with the dynamic presentation and midrange immediacy of the RS-2s and touch more treble extension. I want the RS-2s with the smooth and textured upper mids & trebles and bass extension of the 580s.

So, where do I go from here? I have not heard the RS-1s, nor the HD600 (by all accounts to close to the 580s to give me what I'm looking for) or HD650s. I have not heard the 580/600/650 with upgraded cables.

Any ideas/advice/comments/rants/raves much appreciated!

Thanks,
Peter

PS. I really need to attend one of these meets, any SF Bay area meets happening soon?

 

[nefilim]

Oh a few more comments, sheesh it's hard to get all of this into a post

While I don't think the RS-2s has quite the bass extension, I find it easier to follow a bass line on them, there's just the tad more air around the bass notes which makes them more intelligible, which is nice and contributes to a better rhythmic drive (important to me!).

The very first thing that I noticed about the RS-2s is a somewhat hollow horn like quality to the trebles, almost sounding like the sound is coming from a tin can. Even after extensive playing (left them on overnights) that quality is still somewhat there. It's almost like this quality contributes to the overtly bright upper mids and trebles, accentuating and distoring them.

I have some flat pads on order from Todd to see if they make any difference to the brightness and lack of long term comfort.

 

[gerG]

Are you adverse to trying canal phones? The description of what you are after matches the Ety ER4S very closely. They are also the only thing that I could dream of wearing 8 hours at a stretch.

The other option that springs to mind is a digital equalizer. The Sens respond extremely well to eq, and can do almost anything that you want (actually I don't have 580s, only the HD600 and HD650).

The Grados are, imho, beyond help.


gerG

 

[lindrone]

You should audition either the HD650 or the CD3000. HD650 has sound that is different enough for some Sennheiser lover to make up for the lack of excitement and involvement. HD600, on the other hand, is just a more refined version of HD580.

CD3000 is a different beast altogether, but it might be where you end up.

 

[mAsh]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lindrone You should audition either the HD650 or the CD3000. HD650 has sound that is different enough for some Sennheiser lover to make up for the lack of excitement and involvement. HD600, on the other hand, is just a more refined version of HD580. CD3000 is a different beast altogether, but it might be where you end up.

ditto... i guess

 

[Jazz1]

I think some HD-650's deserve a try. Better bass than the HD-600's, and they seem more dynamic than the HD-600's IMHO without losing an overall smoothness. I'm using Zu cables, so the stock stock cables might not give you the sound I'm hearing.

I certainly can listen to the HD-650's eight hours straight without physical discomfort, or great sound fatigue. However, I have to admit that my ears get tired, and a break does help no matter what headphones I'm wearing.

I'm wondering about Alessandro MS-2's as opposed to your Grado's. People have report that they are smoother sounding, but some have warned that compared to the HD-650's that I might be a little disappointed.

One thing I like about the Grados is the flat storage. I forsee an XP-7 or a SR-71 in my future for mobile use and flat storing headphones might work well with my future mobile kit that will include an iPod (I plan to use the new Apple "lossless" compression scheme after I buy a larger hard drive and re-rip my favorit CD's.

Good luck in your quest!

 

[gpalmer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by nefilim PS. I really need to attend one of these meets, any SF Bay area meets happening soon?

You just missed a bunch of them, but the area is pretty active so there will probably be one coming up soon... (Hint: If you have space, they will come!)

 

[Wodgy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by nefilim I use my headphone system at the office, close to 8 hours a day. 200gig firewire drive, FLAC, Xitel Pro Link (still deciding on a DAC), Wheatfield, 'phones. ... However, from the upper mids up they are scorching!

You may want to improve your source first before abandoning the Grados. The Xitel Pro resamples all data to 48kHz before either converting it to analog or sending it out the digital jack, and this tends to introduce distortion in the highs and upper mids. This tends to be irritating with cans that are revealing in the upper midrange, such as Grados and the Etymotic 4S.

 

[Steve999]

Headphone nirvana for me was (and still is) digital EQ, as gerG suggested above. My absolute best results with digital EQ are with my HD580s, by the way. This is one way you can get what you are looking for.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nefilim Hi All, I've had my Sennheisers HD580 (stock cable) for a few years now, along with my trusty & beloved Wheatfield HA-1 (about to receive a tube upgrade). A week ago I bought a pair of Grado RS-2s. After a week of listening to mostly the Grados I've got a better idea of what I want but it's not met by either pair of cans. In a nutshell, the RS-2s have a nice lively dynamic presentation, punchy bass (although not as much extension as the 580s), a lovely immediate warm midrange, which is what attracted me to them most. They seem to do very well on well recorded strings, acoustic guitar especially. However, from the upper mids up they are scorching! So what do I want? I want the 580s with the dynamic presentation and midrange immediacy of the RS-2s and touch more treble extension. I want the RS-2s with the smooth and textured upper mids & trebles and bass extension of the 580s.