[kwitel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hempcamp /img/forum/go_quote.gif Maybe this will help. The Opus number is just the number of the piece in *all* of a composer's works. The Quartet number is just the number in his series of quartets only. Don't ask! --Chris

That actually makes quite a bit of sense to me (albeit the Opus appears to represent when the piece was published as opposed to when it was written-which to me is a little confusing.

Question: why then would a manufacturer ever name a CD w/o listing what number piece it is and ONLY supply the Opus number?
Yeah I guess that the Op. # is important, but id rather know what number the piece is in the series than at what point it was published (if I had to choose between the two).

 

[FalconP]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwitel /img/forum/go_quote.gif Question: why then would a manufacturer ever name a CD w/o listing what number piece it is and ONLY supply the Opus number?

Simple answer: the composer did not name the pieces that way.

In Beethoven and Mozart's day, string quartets were often published in sets of 3 or 6, so it was customary to refer to the piece by the set (opus) it was in. Think of these sets as today's "album": when we nowadays refer to the song of a pop artist, we don't say this is his song #35, but refer to the album where the song is found.

 

[kwitel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by FalconP /img/forum/go_quote.gif Simple answer: the composer did not name the pieces that way. In Beethoven and Mozart's day, string quartets were often published in sets of 3 or 6, so it was customary to refer to the piece by the set (opus) it was in. Think of these sets as today's "album": when we nowadays refer to the song of a pop artist, we don't say this is his song #35, but refer to the album where the song is found.

So when they say this is "String Quartet # 16", doesnt that refer to the set?
What do you think of this deal? (I have no idea if this is a good composer/recording, just seems like a great deal for 4 CD's)

BEETHOVEN - Essential String Quartets 4 CD NEW Busch - eBay (item 330201369596 end time Jan-09-08 09:54:26 PST)

or for the complete quartets:

7CD- BEETHOVEN -COMPLETE STRING QUARTETS - BERG QUARTET - eBay (item 120206914134 end time Jan-12-08 19:56:49 PST)

 

[FalconP]

Both the Budapest and the Busch Quartets were renowned Beethoven interpreters; the trouble is they are from ages ago, and this set is almost certainly in mono. At any rate I don't recommend Quadromania titles to beginners because they come with no notes.

Alban Berg Quartett's cycle under EMI is a classic. Clean and incisive playing. But the eBay price is not that good especially if you factor in shipping. You may find a better deal in stores.

 

[Tyson]

You NEED to get the sibelius violin concerto, fits your preferences to a T. I like Mutter and I also like Chung in this work, but most violinists are decent. If you don't mind less than state of the art sound, Oistrakh is also great.

 

[MonkeysAteMe]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwitel /img/forum/go_quote.gif So when they say this is "String Quartet # 16", doesnt that refer to the set?

Ok, the opus number is the set. The quartet number is the number in that set. For instance, String Quartet No. 5 in Fm, op. 20 (I am making this up). The op. 20 would be a group of quartets and the Fm would be the fifth in that set.

Does that help clarify anything?

 

[kwitel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MonkeysAteMe /img/forum/go_quote.gif Ok, the opus number is the set. The quartet number is the number in that set. For instance, String Quartet No. 5 in Fm, op. 20 (I am making this up). The op. 20 would be a group of quartets and the Fm would be the fifth in that set. Does that help clarify anything?

Im not sure.

So the Opus is the set number or the "Album", then there could be a "No. 3 string quartet within that Opus and then there can be for example four movements within that No.?

basically, movements are in numbered quartets, and a group of numbered quartets will be in one Opus?

please tell me thats correct...

btw-if the above is correct, then how does this box set have "the complete quartets"???

Amazon.com: Beethoven - The Complete String Quartets / Alban Berg Quartet: Music: Ludwig van Beethoven,Alban Berg Quartet,Gerhard Schulz, Hatto Beyerle, Thomas Kakuska, Valentin Erben Günther Pichler

Some Opus's here have no "Nos." in them?
Ive seen and heard for example Beethoven's String Quartet No. 16. How come its not listed here?

Sorry for all the questions, but this is driving me nuts!

 

[leroyhacker]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwitel /img/forum/go_quote.gif Some Opus's here have no "Nos." in them? Ive seen and heard for example Beethoven's String Quartet No. 16. How come its not listed here?

Beethoven's quartets are frequently identified by just opus number(and number within the opus, e.g. his 8th string quartet is usually referred to as opus 59 number 2), rather than the overall count. Op 135, on disc 2 of that set, is the 16th string quartet, but calling it opus 135 is enough to uniquely identify out of his body of work.

Opus usually refers to a single publication, which may possibly have contained multiple works. It happens with Beethoven that many of his most famous works are known by a name(pathetique) or a number(the ninth symphony), but generally many works will be identified by the opus number.


Unless a work was never published, and then it will be referred to by a catalog number. In Beethoven's case, the label would be WoO.

 

[MonkeysAteMe]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwitel /img/forum/go_quote.gif Im not sure. So the Opus is the set number or the "Album", then there could be a "No. 3 string quartet within that Opus and then there can be for example four movements within that No.? basically, movements are in numbered quartets, and a group of numbered quartets will be in one Opus? please tell me thats correct...

If I understood you correctly, then I believe you have the principle down.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwitel /img/forum/go_quote.gif btw-if the above is correct, then how does this box set have "the complete quartets"??? Amazon.com: Beethoven - The Complete String Quartets / Alban Berg Quartet: Music: Ludwig van Beethoven,Alban Berg Quartet,Gerhard Schulz, Hatto Beyerle, Thomas Kakuska, Valentin Erben Günther Pichler Some Opus's here have no "Nos." in them? Ive seen and heard for example Beethoven's String Quartet No. 16. How come its not listed here? Sorry for all the questions, but this is driving me nuts!

Sometimes Opus's are for single pieces. This is not normal, but a quartet could very well be published by itself therefore being the sole piece in an opus number. Also, CDs may refer to just having Op. 135, but it will contain all pieces in that opus.

 

[kwitel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MonkeysAteMe /img/forum/go_quote.gif If I understood you correctly, then I believe you have the principle down. Sometimes Opus's are for single pieces. This is not normal, but a quartet could very well be published by itself therefore being the sole piece in an opus number. Also, CDs may refer to just having Op. 135, but it will contain all pieces in that opus.

Thanks for being patient with me

So the above CD(s) which claim to tbe the "complete string quartets" really have all of them?
Im thinking of buying this and maybe a "greatest hits" type of CD.
Any recommendations?
Id like one that has a variety of types of pieces on it; maybe some solo paino works, a symphony or two, some string quartets, etc.

 

[leroyhacker]

For Beethoven, a complete set of string quartets will definitely have everything.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwitel /img/forum/go_quote.gif Id like one that has a variety of types of pieces on it; maybe some solo paino works, a symphony or two, some string quartets, etc.

I don't think you'll have much luck getting good sets with multiple types of pieces on them unless you get very large boxed sets. Though maybe someone will prove me wrong. A full symphony won't leave much room for other works anyway.

You'll do better picking single albums for the different types.

Something like Kleiber's recording of the 5th and 7th

and some piano sonatas performed by Brendel.

I don't know any good single album recordings of a quartet or two since those are usually sold in sets, except for the ones sold in partial sets, like the Takacs, which are usually the most expensive recordings

 

[MonkeysAteMe]

Check this out.

Amazon.com: Beethoven: Complete Masterpieces (Germany) (60 CD Limited Edition Box Set): Music: Beethoven