[moore1041]

hello everyone this will be my first post, i have been looking at both floor standing and bookshelf speakers to pair with my new amp but i am new at this and have no where to start. at the moment i have polk tsi 400's and a polk psw505 subwoofer. i think the speakers sound really harsh and lean, and the subwoofer is ok but rather boomy. so right now im just looking to replace the speakers for something less harsh and more oriented for rock/metal music and classical.  im open to any speakers as long as they are under 600 for both.  i guess i prefer warmer speakers as i have an old pair of bic venturi's and i swear they sound better than the polk floor standers, but i still want as much detail as possible without being fatiguing.

 

[moore1041]

i meant to say my first thread, please experienced audiophiles help me!!!

 

[cel4145]

Yeah. The Polk TSi series is a decent value for entry level speakers, but they are just entry level speakers. I run Ascend Acoustics CBM-170 SEs in my desktop setup. Fairly neutral frequency response with good transient response. Gives them very resolving mids. Given your budget, you might step up to the CMT-340 SEs.

And I know what you mean. The PSW505 is a very good sub for its price, but certainly not the tightest sound. I suggest that when you get ready to look at a new sub, you research 12" subs from SVS Audio, Rythmik Audio, HSU Research, Outlaw Audio, and Power Sound Audio. Those Internet direct subwoofer companies are well known for the best price/performance values. Check out AVSs subwoofer forum to learn more.

 

[moore1041]

thank you for a quick response. i have come across the cmt 340's they seem to be very nice for the price, my only worry is "and i forgot to mention" my receiver has no lpf or hpf filters so the front speakers are always getting bass. that makes me think i should get floor standing speakers so that it doesn't distort or roll of the sound. but then again i really don't know. i just noticed noticed Yamaha makes floor standing speakers but i cant find any reviews on them, and also the kef q500 which i have not heard anything about but is in my price range.

 

[cel4145]

That's what the low pass filter on the sub is for. You match it up with the natural roll off of the speakers. So if you upgrade to a good sub, why not let it pass off the bass a little higher up?

 

[moore1041]

that is a good option, but not that many subs have crossovers for the front speakers that i know of. i wonder if i can find a good sub under 500-600 with a crossover... the psw505 i have has pass through but no crossover. that's rather useless.

 

[cel4145]

Well, the idea is that you set the low pass filter on the sub to wherever the low frequency roll off is of the speakers. So with the TSi 400s, Polk lists the -3db point as 44hz, so that would likely be around 40 to 50hz (although certainly something else outside of that range could sound better)--unfortunately the low pass filter on the PSW505 seems like it only goes to 60hz, so you can't try it lower than that to see if it's better. BTW: note that the CMT-340 SEs have a -3db of 48hz, so really their low end extension is pretty close to your TSi 400s.

And I don't think that's common to have the high pass filter on the speaker level outputs on subs (can't think of any subs at the moment that have that). Where you find that high pass filter is on some subs that have left/right line inputs and outputs. My SVS SB-1000 has an 80hz high pass filter on the line out (that and the SVS PB-1000, both excellent subs in your budget range). But you would need an amp or receiver with pre-out/main-in connections to hook a sub up like that. The HK 3390 and 3490 have that for a receiver, and many integrated amps do. But if you were interested in replacing your receiver to be able to do something like that, might as well consider an AVR for the integrated bass management that has low and high pass filters built in for crossing over the sub.

 

[moore1041]

the receiver I have has pre outs and main in, I wouldn't think about replacing it for a long time it sounds excellent and according to the reviews it's a very clean amp for 500.

 

[moore1041]

also the sub out on the receiver is filtered so there is no lpf control on the sub either, the receiver sends out 90 hertz and lower to the sub out. i really like the receiver though i think the fact that it is so simple determines why it sounds so clean and natural. compared to the mid level denon and onkyo's ive had i like the rs700 Yamaha about 1000 times better, also its 100x2 but i think it has more power than that, it drives the polks way louder that the other avs's ive had which were around the power same rating. im guessing the reason it has no hpf or lpf is because it was designed to push larger speakers that wouldn't need any filtering. i found a speaker company called tekton design and i have yet to see one bad review from anything they have, but they are kind of unknown i think. they have a floor standing speaker called the mini lore its a single 8" driver with a 1" tweeter but its supposed to have sub woofer like bass with very good separation and detail. im just really weary spending money on anything audio now since i bought the polks i have definitely learned audio isn't always "you get what you pay for", or at least preferences vary a lot.

 

[cel4145]

I was looking at the wrong model. You have the Yamaha R-S700. That does seem to have a pre-out/main-in:



Get an SVS PB-1000 which has an 80hz high pass filter. Run the pre-out to the left/right input on the sub, then the left/right RCA output to the main in. Then you set the sub low pass filter to the 80hz to match the line out. Check out this review of the PB-1000.

I've heard about the Tekton Mini Lore, but the PB-1000 has been measured to have linear bass extension down under 20hz :biggrin:

 

[moore1041]

that sub looks great! i think i will get that after i purchase the front speakers, they bother me the most lol. i was thinking of getting a tube amp like this http://schiit.com/products/lyr to put between the amp and the sub to power the headphones and i think it would make the speakers sound better as it has a main out rca. i will be needing lots of rca cables. the only thing i have to figure out now is if i should get the mini lores or spend the extra and get the full sized lores. im still not 100% sure about that tekton company either they don't seem to have many reviews but the few reviews have very good ratings. the extra 400 dollars is quite allot for the gold tweeter and a 2 inch bigger driver though....

 

[moore1041]

i just noticed that the bottom of the page on that sub review it says audiophiles would prefer the 12 inch sealed model better, it had tighter bass...? i looked it up and its the same price so idk i guess its the same amp with a 12 inch speaker and its sealed. maybe it wouldn't get as loud?

 

[cel4145]

I own the SVS SB-1000, the compact sealed version. It has slightly better SQ, from what I understand. However, it has a good bit less max output than the PB-1000, and starts to roll off around the mid-20hz range in the low frequency extension. I use it in my computer desktop setup (see my sig), and it works great for bass in a small room if you aren't trying to blast the room with bass (but gets fairly loud). However, my understanding is that the PB-1000 is no slouch in SQ. It would definitely be an upgrade over the Polk PSW505. So how big is your room and how loud do you like to listen? That says a lot about whether or not you need the more powerful sub or not. Also, know that the SVS subs are considered by many to be equal or better to subs that are twice the price MSRP at BestBuy and places like that. So the quality is definitely there. See this review which compares the SB-1000 and PB-1000: http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/speaker-subwoofer-reviews/66069-svs-pb1000-sb1000-subwoofer-review.html

If you are going to use the 80hz crossover, what's the point of the Tekton speakers? You can buy monitors that have say a -3db low end point in the 50 to 60hz range, and they'll work just fine because the sub is taking over starting at 80hz.

Your Yamaha has a Zone 2 out. That's another way to plug in the LYR. Or, you might try my configuration. I run my ODAC to my Asgard 2, then run the pre-amp out from the Asgard to my SB-1000, and then run the output from the sub to the main-in on my HK 3390, bypassing the pre-amp in the HK completely. I like the Asgard 2 pre-amp better than the HK. Nice to just control the speaker/sub volume from the Asgard volume on my desk. The HK 3390 sits further out of reach because all I have to do is turn it on and off when I need it.

 

[moore1041]

i think the 505 has enough loudness even though it doesn't play loud on low frequencies. i do like textured bass and i think im willing to sacrifice the loudness for better sound. if i end up getting the lore or m lore i think i will leave the crossover off and just use the sub out so i can make it simple to plug in the headphone amp, apparently the lores go down to 35ish hertz so it would be nice to have the sub to back up the speakers still. would the sealed box go as low as the ported though?

 

[moore1041]

i do listen to music fairly loud though...