Some of you guys have made some excellent points. I especially liked Jude's and andrze's responses. I wish people who only want to derail or insult a thread would find some other thread to post in (or opt not to post at all)--but I've come to expect that from some folks.
andrze
I'm sorry for the misleading title of the thread but that was really the tone of the quote I took from Tyll. He's suggesting that it feels like a "fight" for a company to participate in a community and that this is why other companies haven't been as active. I could have as easily called the thread "Commercial Companies vs. HeadFi" but I felt like Tyll had taken it more personally because of his company's involvement with headphones and the community.
RE: economics of manufacturing electronics
I've had this discussion elsewhere so sorry for the redundancy for those who have read it before. It is typical in home electronics to see a retail price of four times the total cost of parts and manufacturing, not including research and development. In other words, if a compent costs $10 in parts and $15 in assembly, it will typically cost $100 retail. $25 in profit goes to the manufacture. $25 in profit goes to the distributor. $25 in profit goes to the retail. Keep in mind that out of the profit for those various levels, employees and overhead must be deducted.
Please don't respond with, "that's not the way it always works" or "you can't just generalize." You can generalize and it's useful to generalize for the sake of explanation. Does that mean you should use this formula and expect to calculate with precision how specific businesses work? No, of course not. Let's not debate semantics.
Often on the internet, you'll find deals that drastically reduce the retail profits and sometimes reduce the distributor profits. This is why you see products at "40% off." If you are both the retailer and distributor, "40% off" often means they still have a 10% margin. Not bad if you do high volume sales. Companies like HeadRoom don't do high volume sales. There just aren't enough headphone geeks in the world. Still, according to Tyll (and you can find this in other threads if you do a search), Tyll discounts what is essentially the retailer profit margin and sales his amps at roughly three times the cost of parts and manufacturing.
Generally, I agree that you can't compare DIY with retail. However, another part of me says, of course you can compare an apple to an orange. They're both fruits and some people like Apples better. So, let's even the playing field. Let's say you've developed an amp and want to manufacture it. Take the cost of parts. Pay yourself what it would cost to pay someone to assemble it (remember to count overhead: tools, electricity, location, etc.). Now take this total and triple it. Now compare it to a commercial amp. Will you still win? Sometimes. *shrug* If you find yourself winning all the time, start an amp company.
RE: the price of doing business on the internet
Some would say the biggest guy is always the biggest target. Maybe that's why so many people hate Sony. Maybe it's why so many people make fun of the president. I think a more accurate thing to say is this: the most visible guy is the biggest target. So, if there are bigger audio companies (and there are), but HeadRoom is more visible in our community, I think that means, generally speaking, that they're going to catch more flack. Of course, they also get the word of mouth sales and recognition stuff.
I guess the question in the end is this: Is there a net sum gain for an audio company to participate in online forums given the amount of grief that participation costs?
This is the question I really intended this thread to discuss. Of course, we can discuss whatever you like, but I really wish people who just want to complain about the thread itself would get a life.
