[eccdbb]

Assuming you're using a computer/laptop as a source, how does HDMI (from the motherboard) fare in terms of sound quality compared to coax/optical/usb-based DACs?

 

[Alai]

Um... depends on the DAC? That's like asking which is better, closed or open headphones?

 

[eccdbb]

are you saying it's the same case? as in if your mobo's HDMI DAC is stinko, then your SQ will suffer?

 

[obobskivich]

Quote:

Originally Posted by eccdbb /img/forum/go_quote.gif are you saying it's the same case? as in if your mobo's HDMI DAC is stinko, then your SQ will suffer?

uh...HDMI is a digital output...

as long as your system doesn't put noise onto the HDMI line, you should be ok

also, see 2

 

[MaZa]

HDMI transfers digital signal, so if your transport (in this case, your mobos soundcard) can transfer bit-perfectly, its up to DAC how good or bad it is.


*edit* too slow

 

[Alai]

Um... I don't think there is such a thing as HDMI DAC. There are DACs that have HDMI input or output.

I'm not really understanding your concern... You're basically asking the difference between coax or optical output. They are all digital. Not really any different. Supposedly you get higher bandwidth on HDMI so you can do hi-def audio (aka Blu-Ray discs), but there are quite a few people who say that it isn't that much better than optical or coax.

 

[obobskivich]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alai /img/forum/go_quote.gif Um... I don't think there is such a thing as HDMI DAC. There are DACs that have HDMI input or output.

no, DACs do not have a "digital output", and there are no specific DACs with HDMI inputs (unless you're saying that receiver's are "DACs", and given how head-fi defines "DAC"....

)


Quote:

I'm not really understanding your concern... You're basically asking the difference between coax or optical output. They are all digital. Not really any different. Supposedly you get higher bandwidth on HDMI so you can do hi-def audio (aka Blu-Ray discs), but there are quite a few people who say that it isn't that much better than optical or coax.

but that only matters with movie soundtracks, in terms of "audio", everything will be easily handled via coaxial or TOS (TOS being slightly limited in sample rate, but that doesn't really matter), excepting DSD via HDMI (which is "Sony unique"), so there really isn't "benefit" (now, if your options are analog line out and HDMI out, HDMI out could be better, if the analog out is junk, and your HDMI device is "good")

 

[eccdbb]

ah right. I forgot HDMI was digital...bad bad me.

Ok, end of thread, unless someone else has a similar question.

 

[Alai]

Quote:

Originally Posted by obobskivich /img/forum/go_quote.gif no, DACs do not have a "digital output", and there are no specific DACs with HDMI inputs (unless you're saying that receiver's are "DACs", and given how head-fi defines "DAC".... )

Yeah, that's what I meant. I lapsed into the Head-Fi idea of DAC (as opposed to DAC platforms like receiver or preamp or DAC box).

 

[iriverdude]

Quote:

no, DACs do not have a "digital output"

You're wrong, my stereo DAC has digital output.
AS for optical versus coaxial versus HDMI, all are digital but HDMI allows higher bitrate audio so if you have Blu-Ray ideally choose HDMI. Also if you use HDMI it's just a single cable from one component to another, rather than video + audio. I use HDMI but only for video, as my pre-power doesn't have HDMI switching.

Quote:

but there are quite a few people who say that it isn't that much better than optical or coax.

Probably don't have a system good enough to resolve the extra sound quality.

 

[Alai]

Quote:

Originally Posted by iriverdude /img/forum/go_quote.gif You're wrong, my stereo DAC has digital output. AS for optical versus coaxial versus HDMI, all are digital but HDMI allows higher bitrate audio so if you have Blu-Ray ideally choose HDMI. Also if you use HDMI it's just a single cable from one component to another, rather than video + audio. I use HDMI but only for video, as my pre-power doesn't have HDMI switching. Probably don't have a system good enough to resolve the extra sound quality.

1) obo is right. DACs don't have digital output. DACs can only do digital to analog and cannot output digital by definition. But that is if you define DACs as in the digital to analog chip itself and not the entire DAC vehicle/platform. It's the difference between weapon or weapon platform. Aka 50 caliber machine gun versus aircraft that holds the 50 caliber machine gun.

2) Just because there is higher bandwidth does not mean it is being used. I have 8GB of RAM but that does not mean my computer is faster than a computer with 4GB. Just because a CPU has 4.5 Ghz does not mean it will load a program faster than a CPU with 5.0 Ghz (harddrive bottleneck).

3) How good of a system do you think is required to hear HDMI versus other optical output difference?

 

[iriverdude]

1) Mine does. I'll let you figure out why a DAC may have digital out.

2) Did I say for standard bitrate audio it is? Just that HDMI has higher bandwidth for audio from Blu-Ray discs.
3) Not talking HDMI audio versus optical, but standard definiation audio versus high bitrate uncompressed audio, so yeah I think you would notice it, but not on a cheap system. Exactly the same as Mp3 versus flac, on cheap earbuds versus proper quality phones.

 

[Alai]

Quote:

Originally Posted by iriverdude /img/forum/go_quote.gif 1) Mine does. I'll let you figure out why a DAC may have digital out. 2) Did I say for standard bitrate audio it is? Just that HDMI has higher bandwidth for audio from Blu-Ray discs. 3) Not talking HDMI audio versus optical, but standard definiation audio versus high bitrate uncompressed audio, so yeah I think you would notice it, but not on a cheap system. Exactly the same as Mp3 versus flac, on cheap earbuds versus proper quality phones.

1) That's not the DAC chip that outputs digital. As I said, DAC chips output analog only. I think you are referring to the ADC chip or your DAC box's ability to act as a digital transport the way some receivers transport HDMI.

2) I suppose. Even with Blu-Ray discs, I find I don't hear that much of a difference between DVD and Blu-Ray. Although, I suppose that might change depending on the movie (action movie have more audio to process than a drama film).

3) So... a headphone rig of maybe $500 that is well-spent? (I guess $1k when translated into speakers.)

 

[iriverdude]

1) Pass through. Useful if you send digital audio to another device or zone, or recording from multiple digital sources through the DAC back to digital out digitally recording. basically acting as a digital audio switchbox, as well as a DAC. No different in principle to a stereo pre-amp you send multiple signals to it, and tape out can select from any inputs. Also my lexicon processor has digital out, so useful if that to another dac in another room for multi-room audio. Certainly useful if your source only has one digital output, but you want to send that to a DAC plus want to record from it, perhaps to a Minidisc, PC or other digital audio recording device.

3) $500 headphone rig is pretty cheap to some here. Some have spent 10x that amount. I don't have the best home theatre in the world but not the worst either but I do feel audio from DVD can be improved upon. If people don't like high bitrate Mp3 why bother with lossless?

 

[obobskivich]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alai /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yeah, that's what I meant. I lapsed into the Head-Fi idea of DAC (as opposed to DAC platforms like receiver or preamp or DAC box).

np man

eccdbb, glad your question was answered

@ the iriver posts that keep getting quoted, "better processing power = better sound quality", uh? no? basically "if your app runs fast enough, you're fine, you don't need "more", and "more" just adds dollar signs", and passing a signal over via HDMI won't suddenly have added fidelity because you've got a faster CPU, based on that reasoning my PC should have superior audio quality to my HD-DVD player, purely because it has "more" on paper (and if you really wanted to nitpick it, it actually doesn't have "more" on paper, because of the type of processing we're talking about, but thats wicked complex for most people to get into (no offense intended at all))

basically "if it can send it, its done", you aren't gonna somehow "send more" just by spending more

and alai, <3 your:

"50 calibre gun vs aircraft with the gun" analogy, apparently its a bit hard for some though?