[kenneth]

I still use Theta Pro Prime DAC and a Cal Audio Delta Transport to play my CDs on. Both units (bought used) have seen ten years of use but are still going strong. Cal Audio has gone out of business, and I do not know if Theta still services their older DACs. I haven't heard any other digtal sources during this entire time except a very impressive sounding but too expense Arcam CD player a couple years back. Just wondering if there are any CD players nowadays, under a thousand, which can match the performance of the older Theta DACs with a decent transport. Back when I bought the Theta Pro Prime, no CD player for under a thousand came even close to what any Theta DAC could offer in sound. Have times changed? I need a plan, when my transport decides to give up its spirit.

 

[Duncan]

You'll find two schools of thought here...

There is the school of thought that says DAC technology has moved on, so all old school must be junk...

...The other team realise that maybe old school DACs aren't the best around, but in those days the engineers paid more attention to the analogue section to compensate for this...

it all depends on which side of the fence you sit on as to the overall outlook.

 

[kenneth]

Ten years is a long time in the area of audio. Back in the early 90s ANY Theta DAC could improved the sound of any CD player for under a thousand with digital output. I have noticed that there are much fewer DACs and transports being made by audio companies. I do not know if this means the CD players have became so much better that for most people DACs and transports are unnecessary or if the audio companies are just more interested in selling CD players which can handle multi-digital formats.
I had seen a year or so back an review which someone dug up an old Muse II DAC and compared it to some new top-notch CD player which could handle various digital formats. He was surprized that the Muse sounded better playing regular music CDs.
I haven't tried any CDs players during the time I had my Theta DAC. The stores in my area basically just sell the lower priced Japanese models, which in the past, I thought all stunk.

 

[Duncan]

Hi Kenneth...

Definetly times are a changing... The days of redbook only seem to be fast fading...

Mix that in with the pile it high, sell it cheap culture... and I can halfway envisage, apart from the ultra high end, with Blu-Ray, Next-Gen DVD-A etc etc, that the average Joe before too long will have nothing more than MP3 quality playback... and i'm not thinking of Lame encoding either...

Long live old school... I'm contemplating doing a review of old school vs new school at a budget ($100-200) price - bearing in mind that the old school player cost $800ish when new back in 1991... then again, I think i'd be shot down in flames...

 

[Ferbose]

Lately there has been a lot of posts (and buzz) about Benchmark DAC1 ($975) on this forum, some by jsiau, the designer himself. It is supposed to be immune to interface jitter so transport should not matter. Its built-in hi-current headphone amplifier and pre-amp volume control are nice additional features. I have never heard a Theta DAC, but I doubt if $1000 CD player today would perform better. One of the useful features of a newer DAC may be the decoding of 96/24 signal from DVDs or AIX DVD-A. Jolida JD-100 ($900) is a tube-based CD player that has won a lot of praise for its smoothness and musicality. Maybe these two prodcuts will satisfy your potential needs.

 

[kenneth]

Quote:

bearing in mind that the old school player cost $800ish when new back in 1991

That reminded me that my first GOOD sounding CD player was a Phillips machine which Conrad Johnson heavily modified. Conrad Johnson seems to have gone back to making just amps and pre-amps, which I think is a shame. The digital stuff they use to make was fantastic.

 

[loveheadphones]

you can always use a PC in conjunction with a DAC if your transport goes bad. Computers can't play SACD so you're fine with an old 16/44.1 DAC. For better results (IMO), add a Monarchy DIP or some type of jitter suppressor into the mix.

 

[dsavitsk]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kenneth I still use Theta Pro Prime DAC and a Cal Audio Delta Transport to play my CDs on. Both units (bought used) have seen ten years of use but are still going strong. Cal Audio has gone out of business, and I do not know if Theta still services their older DACs. I haven't heard any other digtal sources during this entire time except a very impressive sounding but too expense Arcam CD player a couple years back. Just wondering if there are any CD players nowadays, under a thousand, which can match the performance of the older Theta DACs with a decent transport. Back when I bought the Theta Pro Prime, no CD player for under a thousand came even close to what any Theta DAC could offer in sound. Have times changed? I need a plan, when my transport decides to give up its spirit.

My guess is that newer DACs with a similar build quality will surpass your Theta in sound. What has happened, to my ear, is that the digital technology has gotten better and cheaper, but the analog has not changed too much. Thus, so long as the analog section is on par with yours, the digital will be better, but you still won't get away with a cheapo replacement.

A good option, however, may be picking up a used DAC (perhaps another Theta if you like the sound) from the late 90's or early 00's.

As for transports, simply by virtue of the laser getting weaker over time, a new one might be in order ...

-d

 

[Duncan]

Old School at arguably its very best

Take a look at the price

(and no, as much as i'd love to be - i'm not affiliated with that sale)

 

[kenneth]

Quote:

A good option, however, may be picking up a used DAC (perhaps another Theta if you like the sound) from the late 90's or early 00's.

Good advice. The person I bought my Theta upgraded to a Muse II which he liked better then the Theta Gen. V, which today, used, is quite expensive. I have a feeling that my Pro Prime may outlast me. I found someone who does repair work for Cal Audio equipment. Back in the early 90s the Cal Audio/Theta combination was considered unbeatable if one couldn’t afford the more expensive Theta transports. I do not know what transports being made today, if any, are affordable. Having taken a look at the various postings, I will try out any of the new NAD CD players, if I ever run across a dealer who has one. The same holds true of any of the offerings by Arcam.

 

[bangraman]

Exactly what dsavitsk said. Digital has got a lot better, while what happens to it after it's converted to analog hasn't moved on (if you discount the class D amps... and even then that's not a whole new world).


New gear designed with the same care as the best of the old ones (and there are plenty of those around, but at the same original sort of prices as the premium old-school gear might have cost you) will generally beat it.


Older gear may also be overcompensated in the analog stage to remove 'digitalis', a sound that some might like better than a state of the art high definition sound, especially with an inferior front end. When compared to buying new, old-school players are certainly the most cost-effective way to get into good levels of 'fi'.


Generalisation apply, IMO, etc.

 

[PinkFloyd]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duncan Old School at arguably its very best Take a look at the price (and no, as much as i'd love to be - i'm not affiliated with that sale)

Sheer class Duncan... that's what you call quality and it just shows how "we" accept the marketing mans ******** these days and spend loads of money for a case full of nothing ............

 

[PinkFloyd]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duncan Long live old school... I'm contemplating doing a review of old school vs new school at a budget ($100-200) price - bearing in mind that the old school player cost $800ish when new back in 1991... then again, I think i'd be shot down in flames...

That will be one review worth reading Duncan and will educate todays MP3 brigade into the bargain...... bring it on, the sooner the truth emerges the better.

Pinkie.

 

[clarke68]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duncan Long live old school... I'm contemplating doing a review of old school vs new school at a budget ($100-200) price - bearing in mind that the old school player cost $800ish when new back in 1991... then again, I think i'd be shot down in flames...

You'd get no flames from me...I'd love to find out more about what DACs can be found for <$200. Bring it on!

 

[Duncan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by clarke68 You'd get no flames from me...I'd love to find out more about what DACs can be found for <$200. Bring it on!

The biggest irony of it all is that one of the oldest DACs out there (Philips TDA1541 from 1985) has better specs than the TDA1543/45/47 that replaced it (albeit that the 1547 is a 'bitstream' rather than multibit IC) and the TDA1547 is in at least one semi-high end, and well regarded modern day player...

I would do anything to get my hands on a player that uses the TDA1541A S1 DAC... trouble is, these are from 1988 vintage, and on ebay - even now, these still go easily for in excess of $300...