[tracyrick]

I'm researching for a DAC solution for my iRiver H120. The MicroDAC is $300, requires a lot of power, and has USB capability.

Is there a cheaper DAC out there that uses less power but still has a nice DAC chip in it like the Cirrus CS4398?

I don't need USB, just optical. Smaller size would be nice too of course.

 

[laxx]

You can check the Monica2 DAC.

 

[labrat]

Deleted.

 

[Packgrog]

Jamato8 has an Altoid-tin Monica 2, and Mazuki built a similar one for me. Either one of them could provide pointers on how to get an optical receiver working with the Monica board.

Whether you would prefer the Monica or the Micro DAC is really a matter of taste. I wanted something "different", and more musical. Everything I'd read about the NOS DAC approach appealed to me. The Micro DAC is probably more analytical than the Monica, but I recall liking it when I tried it. In the end, the Micro DAC is a lot easier to get ahold of (it took five months from my first attempt of getting a build made until I got ahold of Mazuki and he managed to finish it for me), and will be much sturdier (it's built like a tank). Both sound great, and beat the hell out of the internal DAC in the H120. I prefer the sound style of the Monica, and thus am willing to put up with the quirks of the custom build (I'm still trying to find the perfect way to power it).

At the end of the day, I would probably recommend just getting the Micro DAC. It's a really nice unit, has built-in USB input, it's sturdy as hell, looks nice enough, and it'll just WORK. If upgraditis takes over afterwards, and you find the Micro DAC too analytical for your taste, THEN look into a custom Monica build.

There's some other smallish/portable DACs out there too. Check the DAC listing thread.

 

[Killercrush]

Wow ! You finally got it Packgrog !!! Too bad I don't have my H140 anymore

.

 

[Kabeer]

Yeah I agree with what Packgrog said. I have started threads and asked many on head-fi for help on exactly this question. And I keep coming back to the Micro DAC....just need to save up and justify the cost.

Anyways let me try and sum up the alternate options I have come across for you:

1. Core Sound's Headline Portable DAC/Headphone Amp/Source Selector link
2. Dac in the Box or Pro Dac link
3. Mini-Audio MAD-1 DAC/Headphone Amp link
4. AOS Flute/Piccolo unfortunatly Discontinued link
5. DIY build Monica 2 DAC like Jamato8 and Packgrog have.

Im nearly sure thats a comprehensive list of all the portable optical DACs that youll find. Unless your willing to go non portable, in which case I got no clue

(There is also Apogee's mini DAC (link), but thats v.expensive)

Good luck!

PS: Packgrog, cant wait to see your Monica 2 review

!!!

 

[cooperpwc]

Wow Kabeer, that's a wonderful list. I'm adding that to my records.

Another vote for the Micro DAC. It sounds great for turning the H120/140 into a proper source for a home system.

The H140's own line out is very good. So long as their impedance is at least 110 ohms, it's much better than the headphone out for driving many headphones. Much lower distortion. No doubt though, the Micro DAC is a step up in quality.

 

[catscratch]

The MicroDAC/H120 combo is nice, but I found a few problems over the years:

1) The H120 is very unreliable. Mine bricked itself in a few months with careful, regular use. I haven't been able to get it to work again, though admittedly I didn't put as much effort into it as I could have.

2) The MicroDAC has absurdly high output. This is not a problem if you're using high-impedance headphones on your amp, but if you're using canalphones, then you'd better get a zero-gain amp, or you're not going to be able to use any of your volume knob. What's more, most volume pots aren't balanced in both channels until you turn them up a bit, and with the MicroDAC, you're listening below that point, so channel balance will become a real issue.

I can't use the ES2 or E500 out of the Hornet when it's sourced from a MicroDAC, for instance. I have to turn it up well past painful levels for the volume in both channels to equalize.

You can try adding some sort of resistor or inline volume control between the headphones and the amp, but it will, in my experience, degrade sound quality.

 

[Kabeer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by catscratch /img/forum/go_quote.gif I can't use the ES2 or E500 out of the Hornet when it's sourced from a MicroDAC, for instance. I have to turn it up well past painful levels for the volume in both channels to equalize.

Hmm this is what I was afraid of, I would use it with a supermicro IV and e5c's. From what you say this would be practically impossible...maybe Ill contact Headroom about it.
Thanks

Quote:

Originally Posted by cooperpwc /img/forum/go_quote.gif Wow Kabeer, that's a wonderful list. I'm adding that to my records.

Thanks!

. I wrote this since I know thats what I was looking for when I joined this forum, and I think many iRiver h1xx users would want this list.

 

[Packgrog]

You know, catscratch, I didn't really have problems with the volume output of the Micro DAC with my Tomahawk on low gain using my Future Sonics EM3. The EM3 is 32 Ohms, and shows off hiss pretty easily (it's very noticeable with the H120 headphone out). That said, due to the lower-than-normal output level of the Monica, I can turn my Tomahawk a full notch higher. Given that with most sources my Tomahawk is at the 9 o'clock position, that's not bad. I NEVER turn it up to 12 o'clock with headphones.

Also, I find it strange that you've had stability problems with the H120. I never have, except for the occasional Rockbox-related bug. I've had my for three and an half years, and it's still a brick, even with the paint flaking off (I keep mine in an iSkin because of this).

Here's my setup:

And the innards of my Monica:

Love this setup.

 

[cooperpwc]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Packgrog /img/forum/go_quote.gif Love this setup.

Holy Cow, Batman. That's great! So it sounds like the Monica II doing all that you had hoped? Also how many batteries do you have running it? (I wonder if a slightly larger case might hold both although the Altoids tins are very cool.)

 

[kalis104]

I have no volume problems H120 -> MicroDAC -> Hornet on low gain -> Shure e4g

 

[Packgrog]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cooperpwc /img/forum/go_quote.gif Holy Cow, Batman. That's great! So it sounds like the Monica II doing all that you had hoped? Also how many batteries do you have running it? (I wonder if a slightly larger case might hold both although the Altoids tins are very cool.)

Well, I'm still experimenting with the battery power. See, different voltages have different effects on the sound, even though the voltage is stepped down to 5V internally. I still don't understand why this makes a difference, but it does. I've noticed that 12V vs. 9V from the switching power supply causes an extension of the soundstage and more powerful bass, but it also sound forced, with the bass sounding flabby and the soundstage lacking depth to match it's width. It's a weird experience, and I've found that I prefer the more relaxed, natural sound that 9V input provides (particularly via battery power, which seems far more magical).

Lately I've been running off of a single 9V battery. I went to Radio Shack yesterday, got some parts, and whipped together a simple power jack from a plain 9V battery straight into the Monica. Sound is fine like this, though I wonder if it might be better if I soldered the wires together and did better wire casing rather than just wrapping the wire ends together and wrapping the exposed bits in electrical tape (yes, totally ghetto, but it works). I did this because the Altoids battery pack was wired in series instead of parallel, so it's total voltage output is 18 V (or 19.2 V with my Maha rechargables) instead of 9V (or 9.6V) with double battery life. This way I can still use the DAC while someone with actual soldering skills can change the pack to parallel.

I still plan on writing a more in-depth review once I've had time to mess with more voltage input settings and once I'm able to do some direct comparisons with a Micro DAC and/or Piccolo and/or other smallish DAC(s). I can praise this thing till the cows come home, but it's not much use to other people without some comparisons. Heh.

 

[wolfen68]

I researched to death looking into my portable DAC purchase. In the end, the MicroDAC appeared to be the only reasonable off-the-shelf option. I've used mine for over a year now and I just love it, though I wish it was at least a third smaller and had double the battery life. I was always an H1xx fan, but an external DAC really makes these things shine!

catscratch, it's unfortunate your H120 tanked on you, but most people's experiences have been that they hold up very well as compared to other players. If something does break, it's usually fixed via a replaceable part (hard drive, battery) or it was dropped or plugged into the wrong kind of charger (which will fry an H1xx instantly). There's a good chance your H120 can be revitalized. If you want any help, feel free to PM.

What catscratch mentions is a good point however.....anyone considering an external DAC with all of the extra costs involved should consider they are out of business if their iriver dies. For that reason, I have two spares as backups (though one is technically my wife's).

 

[Kabeer]

Can any MicroDac users confirm for me that it works well with an amp like the Xin Supermicro IV?

Im hearing conflicting reports, some here say it works well with tomahawk, some dont. Cooper says he cant use his with certain amps....
Headroom say they havent tested with a supermicro...