[d73b3e]

If you have an LG V30, why would you need the BTR5?
That phone sounds really really good through it's own output.
I doubt if you can improve the sound in this manner.

In many cases, BTR5 gives better portability

 

[Chris Kaoss]

If you have an LG V30, why would you need the BTR5?
That phone sounds really really good through it's own output.
I doubt if you can improve the sound in this manner.

Sure.
I use the Fiio as a usb dac on my Surface and while doing car detailing, my hobby and second business.
On bluetooth, i force the V30 in aptX mode to improve battery life. Ldac is to high to last the whole working day.

 

[jsmiller58]

If you have an LG V30, why would you need the BTR5?
That phone sounds really really good through it's own output.
I doubt if you can improve the sound in this manner.

I have same situation - v30 and BTR5. Why use the BTR5? I only use it in BT mode and only when I dont want to have the wires interfere with my phone.

 

[Hooga]

My answer is, contrary to what is commonly assumed, digital music playback is far far more complex that meets the eye.

Very possibly. And again I think psychological & cultural factors are part of the game too.
Legions of marketeers know since longtime that a certain color works better for a milk tetrapak box, and another color is best for a pasta package.
Same with sound: a certain "accent" offered by this or that gear might be "nicer" for you and "nastier" for me. Does this have anything to do with numbers in the specs? Little. This means that not necessarily something of "higher, cleaner sound quality" is received as "better" by you or me. Too bad for the engineer colleague having designed it, but that's how life is, and not only about audio

A word of warning to you, this thread is a bit of a "Fiio appreciation society" , you may get told off if you complain too much (I have been).

Lol I think I noticed that, but thanks for the warning. What can I say? It's not my problem I am not up to convincing anyone that Fiio is not a good vendor. I am convinced it is not and that's enough to me. I am also convinced that Fiat - sorry, FCA now - is not a good car maker and I don't buy cars from them, yet they make millions anyway.

BTR5 is asked to do so much, so much , at any price level, let alone at under £100. This item is magic!

Very true. Which is the reason why, in spite of the disappointment about the company, I did not return it: what it has is worth its price and then some. Should it break I believe they would not support it, yet the good news is we are talking about something worth 100€ not 1000€, I can bin it just in case who cares.

Lastly I do know about other higher performance and cost DACs. It all goes down to usability (no the Mojo is too heavy for my tastes - before its price I mean), budget and time ofc. What I am currently eyeing as a nice formfactor / price / performance compromise is Hiby R3 Pro. One of these days.....

 

[jsmiller58]

Yes I am with you on the point that "do numbers matter that much?"
Bottom line is, the answer is yes and no! something like quantum physics and the Schrodinger’s cat - it matters only if you look.
I try to explain better, the humble vinyl LP has a best resolution of about 14 bits at about 48kHz (digital equivalents).
That is the best case scenario, assuming a pristine virgin LP played on a top player with best line-contact stylus. in reality it is much worse.
To most people a 'proper HiFi LP playback system' sounds better than Hi-res digital audio!!?? as demonstrated in many Hi-end shows that I have attended -
How could that be? if numbers are numbers - then it shouldn't.
My answer is, contrary to what is commonly assumed, digital music playback is far far more complex that meets the eye.
A word of warning to you, this thread is a bit of a "Fiio appreciation society" , you may get told off if you complain too much (I have been).
But in Fiio's defence, the poor little BTR5 is asked to do so much, so much , at any price level, let alone at under £100. This item is magic!
But is it the bees knees? well no! it understandably has its own glitches and flaws, but they are very limited.
You are talking to someone who has sent back his BTR5 for money back (No it wasn't broken) - but my reasons were very different. So although I didn't keep mine, I was never the less smitten by it.
I currently am happily listening to my Chord Mojo. it has no BT, no screen, no options on digital filtering, about four times the size and four times the weight. Gets hot while working and charging - it just does one thing, and it does it wonderfully - it plays music - the numbers (bit rate, sampling blah blah) are not your concern.
Did I mention it is four times the price also?
Ultimately, the humble 16/44.1 can sound wonderfully good - so when it doesn't, it is not the 24 bit or 192kHz or DSD that are not sufficient, it is the failure of the play back system and everything in the chain.
Once there is a shortcomming in that chain, you may be able to improve things by higher sampling rates, but you won't fix it!
It is not the numbers, but rather what can be done with those numbers.

I dont know about, and thus I won’t comment on the bulk of your post. However... LPs sounding better than good hi-res digital? I don’t know who these “most people” are that you speak of. But no, not to me. And yes, I do come from a generation where LPs were the only way to get music. And the radio. CDs were quite an innovation by the time I was already an adult. All to say I lived in that Audio world... I will take this one, at least the hi-res version of it, anyway. But, that is just my opinion, and I will respect that you have yours.

 

[Kentajalli]

Well I did say "as demonstrated during ..."
During London's Hi-end show in 2018.
there was a demonstration done by appointment in a closed door hall, where they played a new LP version of few albums, compared with HDtracks digital version of the same.
the LP player, if I remember correctly was an SME turntable and some exotic MC cartridge. the DAC was a top of the line British made I can not recall, but it was around £5K.
the audience were normal visitors and a few known reviewers from the press.
about roughly 8 out of 10 of the crowd preferred the LP rendition , even though it was not as high a resolution as digital version. The LP was more music like! to me.
of course I am not knocking digital music at all, hi-res or otherwise.
My point was that playing digital right is a complex science that has not been perfected yet.
assuming we need higher and higher resolution samples to get the sound we desire, is false!
at the same show, if memory serves, in Audio Research room, they were playing standard CDs through a Dcs Rossini player with the clock mod. via AR own tube amps into a pair of Wilson speakers.
What I heard, was the best sound I have ever heard in my 40 odd years of HiFi pursuit .

 

[hmscott]

...Which is the reason why, in spite of the disappointment about the company, I did not return it: what it has is worth its price and then some. Should it break I believe they would not support it, yet the good news is we are talking about something worth 100€ not 1000€, I can bin it just in case who cares

Just like a good pair of shoes, I always buy 2 or 3 for the time when the original finally wears out...

I've bought 3 BTR5's, 2 original "black" editions and one "Realms of the Sky", perhaps they'll all last a long long time...

BTW, I thought my 1st BTR5 had died and I couldn't resurrect it, so I bought the 2nd BTR5 - while it was still coming from China my original BTR5 "woke up", so don't give up if similar happens to your BTR5...

 

[Hooga]

Just like a good pair of shoes, I always buy 2 or 3 for the time when the original finally wears out...

I've bought 3 BTR5's, 2 original "black" editions and one "Realms of the Sky", perhaps they'll all last a long long time...

BTW, I thought my 1st BTR5 had died and I couldn't resurrect it, so I bought the 2nd BTR5 - while it was still coming from China my original BTR5 "woke up", so don't give up if similar happens to your BTR5...

I did this with my very first loved IEM, some years ago, being RE400 (beknown for their weak cable construction, I bought a second pair soon after the first).

On the DAC-AMP side, for how much I appreciate BTR5's sound in spite of the other shortcomings (bla bla I dont want to repeat here), my next step will be changing format: I'll leave the unbundled portable stack way and go back into the integral-DAP format. I dont have a budget for the purchase right now, if I did it would be an R3 Pro. Might be a different one upon budget availability time, who knows.

BTR5 (if still alive! ) would be "demoted" to "luxury BT box status" - read: "wife will steal that".

 

[Kentajalli]

I did this with my very first loved IEM, some years ago, being RE400 (beknown for their weak cable construction, I bought a second pair soon after the first).

On the DAC-AMP side, for how much I appreciate BTR5's sound in spite of the other shortcomings (bla bla I dont want to repeat here), my next step will be changing format: I'll leave the unbundled portable stack way and go back into the integral-DAP format. I dont have a budget for the purchase right now, if I did it would be an R3 Pro. Might be a different one upon budget availability time, who knows.

BTR5 (if still alive! ) would be "demoted" to "luxury BT box status" - read: "wife will steal that".

just a suggestion.
since your phone may need replacing, this is a good time to kill two birds with one stone.
LG phones, from G6+ onwards (I think) do have headphone sockets and fantastic sounding quad DACs, that I would say beat any DAC up to £200 or maybe even higher. they also have generous storage and micro SD card slot.
I used to have one, and it sounded great.
Also I have heard Samsung Note 8 having excellent audio and native DSD .

 

[hmscott]

I did this with my very first loved IEM, some years ago, being RE400 (beknown for their weak cable construction, I bought a second pair soon after the first).

On the DAC-AMP side, for how much I appreciate BTR5's sound in spite of the other shortcomings (bla bla I dont want to repeat here), my next step will be changing format: I'll leave the unbundled portable stack way and go back into the integral-DAP format. I dont have a budget for the purchase right now, if I did it would be an R3 Pro. Might be a different one upon budget availability time, who knows.

BTR5 (if still alive! ) would be "demoted" to "luxury BT box status" - read: "wife will steal that".

For a very long time Sennheiser was the only source for BT dongles with Audiophile asperations, and I kept wearing them out - I went through 3 or 4, same with Plantronics BT headphones, and then Sony BT headphones - they all fall apart after a couple of years, and then they keep changing the models - I often preferred the older more solid construction models - the newer ones fall apart in a few months. So I'm pre-programmed for BT device physical exhaustion.

I've got a FiiO M15 now, but I still have the BTR5 / BTR3k for more portable use - the M15 is a hunk of "iron" - it's a solid weight of density that plummets into the pocket.

It's nice to have the ultra light and portable BTR5 / BTR3k when I want to leave and quickly grab something to go... and now I'm "wearing out" IEM's and wired headphones - much less expensive and a lot more options to choose from.

Have fun

 

[Chris Kaoss]

Well I did say "as demonstrated during ..."
During London's Hi-end show in 2018.
there was a demonstration done by appointment in a closed door hall, where they played a new LP version of few albums, compared with HDtracks digital version of the same.
the LP player, if I remember correctly was an SME turntable and some exotic MC cartridge. the DAC was a top of the line British made I can not recall, but it was around £5K.
the audience were normal visitors and a few known reviewers from the press.
about roughly 8 out of 10 of the crowd preferred the LP rendition , even though it was not as high a resolution as digital version. The LP was more music like! to me.
of course I am not knocking digital music at all, hi-res or otherwise.
My point was that playing digital right is a complex science that has not been perfected yet.
assuming we need higher and higher resolution samples to get the sound we desire, is false!
at the same show, if memory serves, in Audio Research room, they were playing standard CDs through a Dcs Rossini player with the clock mod. via AR own tube amps into a pair of Wilson speakers.
What I heard, was the best sound I have ever heard in my 40 odd years of HiFi pursuit .

Nice.
But for a real comparison, i want that test to be blind, without the visual bias of an estethic chain.

 

[Kentajalli]

Nice.
But for a real comparison, i want that test to be blind, without the visual bias of an estethic chain.

nope, can't do!
surface noise would give the game away.
Indeed even knowing which one was which, people struggled to like digital better but somehow couldn't lie to themselves.
So, yeah - there was a bias, but mostly in digital favour.
still couldn't cut it.
If LP's weren't so cumbersome , CD's never would have taken off.
Originally the convenience of CD's won the day.
As I write this, I am listening to a new gadget I picked up at Costco, namely Marley get together Bluetooth speaker.
a simple SBC connection has no business sounding this good! hell with hi-res codecs.
the equipment and how it crunches those numbers, has a lot, lot more to do with sound quality than sampling rates or bit depth.

 

[eclein]

Hey folks just received BTR5 Titanium version from Amazon ($129). It was on my radar and the Titanium version sealed it.
I’m just streaming from an ipad pro to it via BT, and it sounds pretty dang good. I love the ESS SABRE sound and always go for equipment that uses it.
Heres a couple pics

 

[ClieOS]

Don't think it is actually titanium (*the metal) but aluminium anodized to titanium (= grey silver) color.

 

[FiiO]

Hey folks just received BTR5 Titanium version from Amazon ($129). It was on my radar and the Titanium version sealed it.
I’m just streaming from an ipad pro to it via BT, and it sounds pretty dang good. I love the ESS SABRE sound and always go for equipment that uses it.
Heres a couple pics