[DecentLevi]

OK everybody big newsflash: There's a new tube combination that just might surpass all others - and a fix for the EL3N...
 
Well make no mistake, @mordy really was onto something with his above mentioned combo of 4x EL3N + 2x 6BL7 as powers! Following his lead, I went ahead with my own mini-version of his 8-pack.
 
6SN7 / 6BL7 with EL3N - THE BEST OF 3 WORLDS!
 

 
 
* the general smeared sound of the EL3N's - SOLVED!
* The buzz from quad 6BL7's (for me anyway) - SOLVED!
* The slight lack in body from my former favorite 6SN7 + 2x 6BL7 / 2x 6SN7 intermixed - SOLVED!
 
Now I'm getting that nice lush / realistic sound of the EL3N's combined with the dynamics and detail of both 6SN7 and 6BL7, and I'd rank this setup is a full two notches higher than the best from my top 10 list from yesterday. For anybody who already has at least 2 EL3N with single adapters + the quad (or even six) 6BL7 adapter, all you have to do is a little switching around, and you get what I believe is yet another game changer with the Elise!
 
I had added two of my brighter 6SN7 tubes to dial in a bit more detail - of which this type has many variations.
 
note: I don't recommend 6SN7 + EL3N as powers because in my multiple testing w. various tubes / orders there is always a loud hum

 

[HOWIE13]

@DecentLevi
 
That looks straightforward enough and should suit my ears, once I receive my Elise.
Could you just let me know which tube type is which in that photograph? I recognise the EL3N's but which of the others are the 6SN7's and which the 6BL7's? They both look pretty similar to me. Also, which 6SN7's are you using there?
Also what are the adapters?
 
Thanks, as ever.

 

[richdytch]

[quote name="Suuup" url="/t/782754/feliks-audio-elise-new-thread/10665#post_12600601".... more forgiving of lesser recordings... hiding the crimes"
[/quote]


Having not yet received my el3n tubes, I have to say I'm quite excited about this, what with the majority of my system being extremely unforgiving of bad recordings

 

[richdytch]

Hi @DecentLevi @Mordy, may I ask what adapters you use for the power tubes on the 4 x el3n/ 2 x 6bl7 arrangement? I've been having a look around and I'm not sure... Thank you. Rich.

 

[DecentLevi]

Yeah Howie, this setup is SURE to please your ears, as we both tend to hear things similarly.
 
Regarding my above pictured setup - I went ahead and compared two more driver tubes with the existing powers
(2x EL3N + 2x 6BL7 intermixed)
     the above powers with drivers:
* 2x 6BL7: more forward / colored / lush (a bit to colored for my liking), but just as good really
* 2x EL3N: a bit too lush / smeared for my tastes
 
So the above photoed combination has everything in spades and is very clean sounding yet smooth / expansive! (just compared it directly to my solid state and it's almost as clean but so much more refine). This, being three notches better than my highest ranking combo two days ago which could only be described as "pornographic"... could only be described as perhaps something alien - like alien perfection!
 
What you'd need:
Two of these single EL3N adapters 
Two of these dual 6AS7 to 6SN7 / 6BL7 adapters
Zenith 6SN7 (for that added clarity in the highs)
GE 6SN7 GTA (for those great dynamics / bass definition) 
 
In the above photo it's 6BL7 in the back (powers) and 6SN7 in the front (drivers). These two types look similar, but BL's are about 25% taller.
 
note: this setup is essentially tuned for my HD 650, so YMMV depending on the headphones used
Also, mix & match your own 6SN7's - none of them really do anything wrong here

 

[HOWIE13]

  Yeah Howie, this setup is SURE to please your ears, as we both tend to hear things similarly.
 
Regarding my above pictured setup - I went ahead and compared two more driver tubes with the existing powers
(2x EL3N + 2x 6BL7 intermixed)
     the above powers with
* 2x 6BL7: more forward / colored / lush (a bit to colored for my liking), but just as good really
* 2x EL3N: a bit too lush / smeared for my tastes
 
So the above photoed combination has everything in spades and is very clean sounding yet smooth / expansive! (just compared it directly to my solid state and it's almost as clean but so much more refine). This, being three notches better than my highest ranking combo two days ago which could only be described as "pornographic"... could only be described as perhaps something alien - like alien perfection!
 
What you'd need:
Two of these single EL3N adapters 
Two of these dual 6AS7 to 6SN7 / 6BL7 adapters
Zenith 6SN7 (for that added clarity in the highs)
GE 6SN7 GTA (for those great dynamics / bass definition) 
 
note: this setup is essentially tuned for my HD 650, so YMMV depending on the headphones used
Also, mix & match your own 6SN7's - none of them really do anything wrong here

Thanks again. I have the 650's too so that's good.
I better start ordering!
Cheers.

 

[DecentLevi]

@richdytch for the 6x tubes in the back you would need this 6x adapter. Do note however that this also requires an external power supply... of which has also been a point for "heated discussions" on this thread. 

.
However I used two dual adapters, linked above.
 
And as good as my above pictured rig sounds, it can only get even better with more burn-in, and Mordy's 8-tube version is likely to sound even better yet.... then there's a chance that exitic drivers could also up the ante.
 
Hey @UntilThen I would love to hear your take if you try a similar setup as pictured above. And maybe you can recommend which driver tubes may sound even better than the 6SN7 in that setup? (excluding EL3N or 6BL7 which I've already tested). 
 
I'm actually trying to get this marvel of an amp show ready for its' first ever appearance at an official Can Jam later this summer.
@JerseyD, will you be making it? It should be one epic meet! There will be a lot of unique rigs from a thriving local bay area Head-Fi community

 

[Kon Peki]

  ... A number of people were taken aback of what they thought was hyperbole and exaggerations about how good the Elise sounds. I can confidently say that they all changed their minds after receiving their Elise amps.

 
I am one of those people, and I have not changed my mind now that I have my Elise.  Yes it sounds great, but I still view many of the comments as over-the-top.

 

[RedBull]

   
I am one of those people, and I have not changed my mind now that I have my Elise.  Yes it sounds great, but I still view many of the comments as over-the-top.

Care to share what amp do you heard better than Elise?

 

[Oskari]

To no-one in particular:

It's not the different opinion, it's how you express it.


To everybody:

Some people are more excitable. Filter as appropriate.

This is the internet, there's bound to be an occasional creeper crawling in. Ignore as best you can.

 

[Lord Raven]

Guys, found this better deal on T1 from Canada, what do you T1 owners suggest? 835 USD It is from Amazon, not any dealer (authorized or unauthorized), will I be eligible for 5 years warranty?
Conniflyer, please look into it The Gen 2 is almost the same price either or lower. I am almost there, wanna be your T1 brother hehe
Beyerdynamic T1 1125 CDN
Beyerdynamic T1 Gen 2 1099 CDN

 

[JerseyD]

  Guys, found this better deal on T1 from Canada, what do you T1 owners suggest? 835 USD It is from Amazon, not any dealer (authorized or unauthorized), will I be eligible for 5 years warranty?
Conniflyer, please look into it The Gen 2 is almost the same price either or lower. I am almost there, wanna be your T1 brother hehe
Beyerdynamic T1 1125 CDN
Beyerdynamic T1 Gen 2 1099 CDN

At this point, the original T1 should be selling for much less than the Gen2. There must be a better deal for you out there somewhere if you have your heart set on the Gen1 (although I cannot imagine why you would, except for cost). I have no Gen1 in stock.

 

[connieflyer]

Agreed, original T1 should be considerably less by now.  For those of you that want to try dual adapters,Dual 6SN7 6BL7 TO 6AS7 tube adapter, I have two adapters and two 6bl7 tubes, that I am not going to be using, if you would be intersted drop me a pm, I will make it worth your while.  Shipping to US only. Also have some great 6sn7tubes, Ken Rad vt231 and Sylvania vt231. I am staying with the El3n 6 pack and c3g and 6as7. Save you some money till you find what you want.  Don

 

[Suuup]

  Guys, found this better deal on T1 from Canada, what do you T1 owners suggest? 835 USD It is from Amazon, not any dealer (authorized or unauthorized), will I be eligible for 5 years warranty?
Conniflyer, please look into it The Gen 2 is almost the same price either or lower. I am almost there, wanna be your T1 brother hehe
Beyerdynamic T1 1125 CDN
Beyerdynamic T1 Gen 2 1099 CDN

I had the chance to demo the T1 gen 1 vs T1 gen 2 on my Elise the other day. Without getting into too much detail, suffice to say I greatly preferred the gen 1 to the gen 2. 

 

[mordy]

I would like to make a few observations, all in the sense of clarifying things, and absolutely not talking down on anybody - everybody who voices an honest opinion deserves full respect.
 
I once went to visit somebody and brought along a nice bottle of wine as a present. The host looked at the bottle and said: Please don't give it to me - it is wasted on me! I took it to mean mean that he did not notice any difference between different wines.
 
If somebody feels that different tubes that some people regard highly don't make a difference in sound to them, we have to respect their opinion and accept it - nothing wrong with it.
 
Regarding mixing power tubes: As far as i know, this is something new (I may be wrong on this), but I cannot remember any manufacturer selling tube amps that equips them with non-identical power tubes. So much so, that there are people who would look at you as navel lint for advocating mixing tubes.
 
This is uncharted territory as far as I know. My thought was that by combining different synergistic tubes you could tune the sound to your liking, much like adding different ingredients to a dish to make it more tasty.
 
Adding more power tubes seems to be a proven thing, and some amps use an array of them. Having more power tubes adds to the drive and bass with more definition.
 
For those who do not like the sound of the EL3N, perhaps trying a combination such as mentioned by DecentLevi or myself may prove to be useful.
 
As time goes by and more people will try different combinations, there will be a consensus on what works best (and what doesn't work). The main thing is that everybody should find the sound they like and be very happy with their listening experience - something that the Elise with it's great flexibility is able to accomplish.