[hypnos1]

 

  Hej Oskari,
   
  All the EL3N tubes I have have the factory code A on them, so it seems that Made in Holland means designed in Holland and built in Austria by WIRAG - Wiener Radio Werke. Could AG stand for Aktiengesellschaft? (Stock Corporation)
   
  There are two lines on the tube: M512
                                                    A4B
   
  Does A4B mean WIRAG 1964 February? M512?

 



Yup Wiener Radiowerke AG, Aktiengeselschaft. (Inc.)

The factory where the subsidiary of Philips made their tubes was previously used by Zeiss and later also for precision machinining in navigation, etc. It was the location of Philips first tape recorder, video recorder, etc. R&D and ultra high quality manufacturing. I would be very surprised if the WIRAG tubes are exactly the same as the orig. Philips. This was one hell of a famous high quality production location.

If you speak German:
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeiss-Werk_Wien

Cheers WB

 
Funny you should mention this WB...I myself was going to say that "Made in Austria" is certainly no bad thing in my book, lol!

...and perhaps might explain why those with this code (as are Peter's, of AcousticDimension) are giving such excellent results for most people?!

....mine, plus the GEC CV2523s are truly a marriage made in Heaven. And my new tube DAC just continues to bless this coupling even more by the day....unbelievable!!
 

 

 
Re. the T1s...prayers certainly for you LR. Plus fingers and toes crossed...GOOD LUCK!

Well the Mullard 6080s arrived surprisingly quickly from Langrex. I stuck them in this afternoon and had a quick listen - unpleasant harshness. Left them to do their thing and a few hours later they've lost the unpleasantness and will no doubt continue to develop. They're becoming increasingly smooth while retaining an airyness that the stock power tubes didn't have. The sound stage is more vivid and slightly more forward.The biggest improvement over the stock tubes is the bass - the very lowest end seems fortified and the bass in general is incredibly solid. On Bill Evans's Sunday At The Village Vanguard I've heard low rumbles that I've never heard before - possibly floorboard vibrations running up the mic stands. I wouldn't say they're subtle at the moment, but it sounds like they're changing in the right ways. Plus, at least when winter comes I'll be able to great the room off my headphones amp alone

 
Yo rich, those Mullards are indeed well-respected tubes, and I'm sure will improve a good bit more yet with time...next step GEC/Osram STs?!!! (have a quiet word with a rich aunt, mon ami!

).

 

[richdytch]

Yo rich, those Mullards are indeed well-respected tubes, and I'm sure will improve a good bit more yet with time...next step GEC/Osram STs?!!! (have a quiet word with a rich aunt, mon ami! :wink_face: ).

Hi Hypnos, they're certainly very nice and getting nicer. Most remarkable for their highs and lows - in fact last night I had my first bass-related complaint! Proud moment. It was my wife who complained, so a kind of complaint-lite

I understand you were instrumental in bringing the Elise into the world Hypnos, so thank you

 

[WB2016]

 


Best of luck
WB

 

[Lord Raven]

If you guys want to help then head to my sale thread and buy my tubes 

 Best power tubes for the price!!
 
 
Only two pair left!
 
Thanks H1, just looking for a valid T1 Not buying from unauthorized sellers, also keeping in mind a good price tag
 
Quote:

 
 
Re. the T1s...prayers certainly for you LR. Plus fingers and toes crossed...GOOD LUCK!

 
Thanks
 

 

 

 


Best of luck
WB

 

[WB2016]

 
Funny you should mention this WB...I myself was going to say that "Made in Austria" is certainly no bad thing in my book, lol!

...and perhaps might explain why those with this code (as are Peter's, of AcousticDimension) are giving such excellent results for most people?!

....mine, plus the GEC CV2523s are truly a marriage made in Heaven. And my new tube DAC just continues to bless this coupling even more by the day....unbelievable!!
 
 
Re. the T1s...prayers certainly for you LR. Plus fingers and toes crossed...GOOD LUCK!
 
Yo rich, those Mullards are indeed well-respected tubes, and I'm sure will improve a good bit more yet with time...next step GEC/Osram STs?!!! (have a quiet word with a rich aunt, mon ami!

).

 


Yeah WIRMAG was a top manufacturing location so most likely the tubes made there are of utmost quality, and consistency, maybe like a C3Gs, but this is pure speculation, there are some wonky EL series tubes, but generally they are very consistent. I would imagine people think the Austrians are like russian or chinese knockoffs, but the Austrians are a bit more like laid back Swiss, without the French element. Not wholey unknown in the Music world for the last 500 years or so

Well the GEC CV2523 sound tempting, but there are a few more things on the horizon before that, e.g. a really good afordable dac and some highend high ohm speakers.

Cheers
WB

 

[mordy]

Today I did an experiment - compared 6 x EL3N to 6 x EL3N + 2 added 6BL7 as power tubes.
 
Turned on the Elise with 6 EL tubes (two as drivers, 4 as power tubes) and played a recording. Then, while playing the recording, and without shutting down anything, inserted the two BL tubes.
 
Before I tried this, my friend the retired audio engineer, had told me that this is not dangerous and will not cause any problems.
 
Although 6 EL tubes sounded very nice, adding the two 6BL7 tubes to the mix, created an astonishing improvement to the sound. Instantly the presentation became much more vivid, with more clarity, punch, sizzle and detail. In addition, the grain increased significantly.
 
IT IS AS IF THE ELISE GOT A VITAMIN INJECTION - not a subtle improvement, no, MAJOR!
 
The added sparkle and vividness is not a product of the higher gain, but comes from the 6BL7 tubes added.
 
I invite others to try this improvement to the sound of the wonderful Elise - highly recommended.

 

[oshipao]

Hello guys (and gals),

I have followed the latest development of this thread and I must say with all the disputes and misunderstandings that It feels like...

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qIY_lVrT2pg

Everyone's got a opinion. How good/bad the argument may be. I will hopefully adore the Elise as stock. And I gladly take impressions from anybody who tries something different. Different is good. Cheers!

 

[Kon Peki]

... I will hopefully adore the Elise as stock. And I gladly take impressions from anybody who tries something different. Different is good. Cheers!

 
With all the posts about how some tubes or other are a WOW or MAJOR upgrade, it's easy to come to the conclusion that the stock setup must not be that great.
 
To me, the stock setup sounds terrific, and the upgrade tubes I've tried so far have made relatively minor differences to the sound.

 

[DavidA]

   
With all the posts about how some tubes or other are a WOW or MAJOR upgrade, it's easy to come to the conclusion that the stock setup must not be that great.
 
To me, the stock setup sounds terrific, and the upgrade tubes I've tried so far have made relatively minor differences to the sound.

I agree with this though as well, but it happens in every thread so I just read pass it that it might make a difference, will I be able to tell, maybe, maybe not.
 
Someone needs to invent a scale (I know this is most likely impossible).  Even something simple as saying "all my friends could easily notice the difference" is still better than "WoW, major upgrade" IMO.  Or what I try to do is let a few friends with different levels of listening backgrounds to see if they can notice the difference, if a novice with very little experience can notice the difference then I would consider it a major difference.  If only a few can hear the difference and it takes serious listening then I would say it makes a difference but would say "its noticeable" or "depends on the person".

 

[DecentLevi]

I for one believe rolling different tubes with the Elise can make a major difference, and  it's more than just "new toy syndrome" or the like, it's real just like how new members are discovering almost daily that this thread is real rather than just hype. If somebody doesn't notice big differences between tube combos, I'd say it more likely broils down to the user's ability to hear these kind of differences, or the tubes that were tried. I just did another A/B between two completely different sets of 6 tubes, and the differences I heard were wide ranging and all encompassing.
 
Though I do agree that feedback from extra pairs of ears does help make / break our claim especially when the differences seem inconclusive... just be careful with the 'feedback level', LOL

 

[DecentLevi]

Wow Mordy! Please do share a photo of your 'EL6' + dual 6BL7 config!
 
That really does sound revolutionary to combine the 6BL7 with EL3N, seeking how I was just balking at the vast improvement in detail I heard with the 6BL7 + 6SN7s in comparison 

 

[mordy]

Hi DL,
 
Just changed my Avatar (the picture that is in the left upper corner of my post)  to my current set-up. Double click on it, and you get a bigger picture. Then double click twice again for more magnification.
 
DavidA and Kon Peki,
 
Everybody agrees that the stock configuration tubes of the Elise sounds very good. There is absolutely nothing wrong in staying with the stock tubes.
 
However, there are tube combinations that sound better and our thread are full of different tube combinations that sound better than the stock tubes. It is a given that everybody has different taste, equipment,  and different ears and different preferences. When i started rolling tubes some six years ago I did not think that it was possible to reach a consensus on what the best sounding tubes would be because of these factors.
 
To my surprise I found that a certain group of top performing tubes  would appeal to almost anybody. Not that one set of tubes is the best, but there are certain tubes/tube combinations that definitively most people will agree are superior. And in this rare group everybody can find what they like best.
 
The contributors on this forum have spent considerable time comparing and listening to a multitude of tubes, and some of us have decades of experience listening to music. The recommendations have to be seen in this light.
 
A number of people were taken aback of what they thought was hyperbole and exaggerations about how good the Elise sounds. I can confidently say that they all changed their minds after receiving their Elise amps.

 

[JerseyD]

@JerseyD. Welcome to our little club and congratulations on becoming a US dealer for Feliks Audio. I enjoyed visiting your website. As a dealer for both Beyer and Sennheiser you are carrying two of the most popular brands of headphones on this thread. It's fun to know our beloved Elise will now have a formal presence here in the US.

Pretty mind boggling to try to sum up the gems of over over 10,600 posts. I actually hadn't been paying attention and was surprised when I saw your post and realized how many posts there already are on this relatively young thread. I think most new owners report an initial high degree of satisfaction with the stock tubes, but for many of us that was just the beginning.

A lot of us like the EL3Ns (adapters required) for drivers. They pretty well have taken up permanent residence in my driver slots. But there certainly are other highly regarded drivers. It is much more difficult to even try to identify much of a consensus for powers. I have had very good results with TS5998, quad EL3Ns, 6250, TS7236s, Chatham 6AS7G and single 6BL7s. But this is really just touching the surface.

Then we get into the whole issue of adapters for multiple power tubes and external power. I don't know if Feliks Audio had any idea of the seemingly limitless flexibility of Elise when they were designing it, but it is truly a very unique and special amp. And, as we like to say, "we are the lucky ones." :atsmile:  

Thanks. Looking forward to joining the club. Word from Feliks is that they are ramping up production, and I should be able to get some in August. Seems so far off, but it will fly by. If anyone in NYC has the Elise, please invite me over to take a listen and I'll bring a bunch of choice headphones for a listening party.

 

[DecentLevi]

+1
Quote:

...
The contributors on this forum have spent considerable time comparing and listening to a multitude of tubes, and some of us have decades of experience listening to music. The recommendations have to be seen in this light.
 
A number of people were taken aback of what they thought was hyperbole and exaggerations about how good the Elise sounds. I can confidently say that they all changed their minds after receiving their Elise amps.

Mordy you got the goods, lets see what you can do: I'm betting the 1st & 4th sound great
 
EL3N  /  2 EL3N + 4 6BL7
EL3N  /  2 EL3N + 2 6BL7 + 2 6SN7
6SN7  /  2 EL3N + 4 6BL7
6SN7  /  2 EL3N + 2 6BL7 + 2 6SN7

 

[Suuup]

To chime in on the whole EL3N debacle: I'm another person who dislikes the EL3N. It has a very special sound. To me, that sound is not appealing (very dark, no sparkle). It might be to others. I sent my pair to a friend so he could give them ago in his Elise. "Lacking in resolution, sound is somewhat smeared. Need to listen more, this may be a bit like the darkvoice.. more forgiving of lesser recordings... hiding the crimes." was his description. I was personally super excited about trying the EL3N when I first got them, after all, everyone on the thread liked them, right? I even put a mattress in the kitchen to sleep on, so I wouldn't miss the postman. I put them in, and found the sound very special. Couldn't decide whether or not I liked it at first. When I switched back to my 6N7G tubes though, it became very apparent. 6N7G was far superior (again, in my opinion) to the EL3N. 
 
What I want to say is, not everyone likes the EL3N, but those who don't like the EL3N generally doesn't stick around in this thread. As such, JV is the only one who tells any newcomers that not everyone likes the EL3N. We do however have some tubes that (to my knowledge anyway) everyone here likes. C3g, ECC31, 6N7G, FDD20. Haven't heard of anyone who doesn't like those (I might not be remembering right those).