[UTF]

Hi folks, I am trying to decide between HD600, DT880 and K701. After reading a lot, I think either of these headphones will be a great choice (one may prefer one over the other, but just a taste issue). Now my main question is which one would be easiest to drive, especially unamped? I don’t quite understand why it is said K701 is difficult to drive (maybe hardest among all these three), giving its specifications 62ohms and 105db/mw. Is it amp needed for getting decent bass? For my listening preference (classical and female vocals like Sinead O’Connor and Norah Jones), can amp be not necessary? Looking forward your inputs.

 

[1Time]

What is your total budget for headphones and an amp?

 

[Pyriel0]

I just tried my K701's straight out of my sound card because I haven't tried it before. I listened to the song "Sulfur" by Slipknot because it has lots of double bass + cymbals.

Straight of of my xtrememusic it sounds ok but tilted a little towards the high end. You can hear the bass ok but it seems to be behind everything else. It also seemed like the music was around my ears/head straight out of the soundcard.

Listening through the shanling the bass comes up and everything sounds tighter and more clear. The cymbals being tightened up sounds a lot nicer as well as having more bass. It doesn't feel like the music is around my head with the amp either which my friend said too. Its more like they are pumping the music into your head.

I was using foobar2000 asio output and I have the overall volume of the card maxed. In foobar I had to have the volume halfway up just to get to my regular listening level when hooked straight to the card. I don't think there is much room for volume on higher impedance cans because of that.

Again this is all using my xtrememusic sound card. To the best of my knowledge it is a 2-2.1 volt output and 50-60ma current out tops. I don't know if its stronger/weaker than whatever you will be using as a source.

I have no experience with senn/beyer yet so can't help you with those.

 

[UTF]

At this point, I only have budget for a new headphone but not for an amp. Even in the long term, I don't want to spend a lot on an amp, say cost same as the phone. I just want to get the best phone I can handle for now, say directly from the headphone output of an integrated amp or CD player, and maybe for the future if i want to add an amp (but I won't need to think about another phone upgrade then). Hence, easy to drive (to a degree for my listening purpose, no need for a lot of bass) is my main concern. Thanks!

 

[spacemanspliff]

Actually, if you want to keep it cheap, the JVC HAR-X900 sounds pretty nice out of a soundcard if you do the simple mods.

Otherwise, the 600 and an amp is probably your best setup. Sorry, you need amplification for all of those headphones eventually. The 600 might work out of the sound card, the 880 will for sure and so will the 701.

 

[UTF]

Quote:

Originally Posted by spacemanspliff /img/forum/go_quote.gif The 600 might work out of the sound card, the 880 will for sure and so will the 701.

Are you saying 880 and 701 will work better than 600 directly from a sound card?

My impression is an amp will definitely help to bring the maximum out of a phone, but how much the amp will add to the phone (compared to the value of the amp) is a question, subject to what you will expect for the phone and amp. I also have an impression that amp will bring out the bass more than other things, but in my case I don't need that much of bass for my listening. Did I misunderstand something here?

 

[Pyriel0]

My sound card analog out only has the 2 volts and the higher impedance headphones need a bit of voltage so sometimes running them without an amp to bump the voltage up is hard or just not possible. Just depends how strong of an output the source has.

Nothing to do with the bass/sound quality or clarity and stuff like that. That's why most portable headphones are lower impedance(around 32 ohms). Its easier to get the volume out of those on any small ipod/portable cd player.

 

[Rarach]

Amps are overrated IMO. I just listen to K701 unamped straight from my X-Fi xTreme Audio soundcard and they sound AWESOME.

Also have DT880 32ohm. They are little bit easier to drive (need less volume on x-fi volume panel) but its really easy to recognize difference between their sound signatures.

 

[lucky]

The primary benefit of an amp is to make things louder. Everything else is secondary. I suggest you try the K701 first from the gear you already have before automatically buying a new amp. Lots of people here will tell you to buy expensive amps because they bought expensive amps. Think for yourself.

FWIW, on my Macbook, the K701 takes four more volume notches to reach the same volume as my AD700. I also have a UB802 mixer with its own headphone amp. On that, I turn the dial two hours more to the right for the K701 than for the AD700, but it drives both with lots of room to spare. I like the sound on both, though I turn to the UB802 when I need More Volume. :O)

 

[tintin47]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucky /img/forum/go_quote.gif The primary benefit of an amp is to make things louder. Everything else is secondary. I suggest you try the K701 first from the gear you already have before automatically buying a new amp. Lots of people here will tell you to buy expensive amps because they bought expensive amps. Think for yourself. FWIW, on my Macbook, the K701 takes four more volume notches to reach the same volume as my AD700. I also have a UB802 mixer with its own headphone amp. On that, I turn the dial two hours more to the right for the K701 than for the AD700, but it drives both with lots of room to spare. I like the sound on both, though I turn to the UB802 when I need More Volume. :O)

Just doing a bit of mythbusting. That is not true in any way. OP and others reading this thread, don't think for one second that the point of an amp is just to make things louder. If anything I would say that volume increase is almost always unnecessary (unless you have super high impedance cans) Amps provide more power which they use to control the drivers of your phones more successfully. They tighten up the music, giving your phones more resolving power and making them more accurate. It is as simple as newtonian physics. F=ma. Your amp provides more current/voltage which is translated by the phones into more force with which to move the driver. If you can accelerate the driver faster, it gives you more detail because the phones have the speed with which to react to tiny variations in the music. You can get things plenty loud out of a soundcard, but they don't do what amps do, as far as SQ is concerned.

Furthermore, most of the people here who spend lots of money on amps DON'T buy them to make the music louder, because if you are at all serious about audio, you don't want to listen loud for the sake of your hearing. This is another area for which amps are useful. Your brain converts loudness into sound quality. If something is louder, you think that it sounds better. Amps, at least for me, lower the volume that I need to listen at to get the same perceived sense of quality.

 

[lucky]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tintin47 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Just doing a bit of mythbusting. That is not true in any way. OP and others reading this thread, don't think for one second that the point of an amp is just to make things louder. If anything I would say that volume increase is almost always unnecessary (unless you have super high impedance cans)...

Would you use your amps just as much if they didn't provide any more volume output than you'd receive from, say, an iPod?

 

[DarKu]

HD600 is the easiest to drive from my experience

K701 the hardest. It is not just about volume, i'm speaking about dynamics!

 

[apatN]

Get the one you like best and get an amp later.
Anyway I would think the K701 is the hardest to drive with the HD650 second.

 

[Rarach]

I never said its just about volume. But FWIR here on head-fi I would think that this headphones are absolutely useless without amp. DT880s were my first high-end phones and I thought that I dont like some things on them just because they are underpowered. Now, trying the phones which should be harder to drive (K701) I have to disagree. They are perfectly OK with anything better than onboard soundcard. Everything posted here about this 2 by people using them with high end amps is true even unamped.

DT880 more bass impact, little bit more details, sibiliant highs on bright recordings
K701 less bass impact, better mids, much bigger soundstage (and more 3d), more musical and balanced,

Compared to my EH350 they are both more on the bright side rather than warm but they both sound good (atleast for me) and loud enough from PC soundcard. Even on trance I prefer K701 sound signature over DT880 thanks to non fatiguing highs and incredible soundstage... Have to listen to some HD600/650 D2000 now

 

[QQQ]

Quote:

Anyway I would think the K701 is the hardest to drive with the HD650 second.

Actually, HD 650 are easiest to drive among high impedance cans due to high sensivity.