[Nicolaij R.]

Hi to everyone (first post ever...)

My portable setup is composed by:
Shure E4c
iPod (4th gen)

I have read tons of stuff on head-fi forums about the bad sinergy between E4 and iPod redarding the bass region of the spectrum; surely I have to admit that (even with the foam tips and boosting the bass frequencies with the iPod EQ) expecially the not-favoured-by-the-mixing bass lines are diffucult to be noticed.

However the main problem I have had with this setup so far redargs the treble department: I have noticed a pronounced distortion of the high frequencies and the problem appears almost exlusively on piano solo recordings.

I have tried the following combination:

HD580 + iPod
E4s + home source (Onkyo DVD-CD player)
E4c + PC line out (playing from PC hard disk)
E4c + PC line out (playing from iPod hard disk)!!!

and I have NOT noticed the distiortion in any of the above cases. The original tracks where encoded using the Apple Loseless format, but trying with WAV or high quality MP3 files does not solve the problem.

Expecially the E4c + PC line out (playing from iPod hard disk) cambo is starting to make me belive that the problem is in the iPod output stage...

Has anyone noticed the same problem? Can a good amp fix it?

 

[PodMan]

Hi, are you using a 4G photo or color model? It has been reported that those models distort in high frequencies because Apple redesigned the headphone jack to be able to output photos to the TV (through special adapter).

Here is a thread regarding the problem.

 

[mjg]

great, this is news to me, and i just bought a 60 gig ipod photo (e4's on the way as well)... i seriously hope these claims are exageraated, and luckily i plan on using lineout and a hornet when its out : ]

 

[Nicolaij R.]

Thank you PodMan...

Reading the stuff you indicated has reavealed that the problem I suffer is documented and common to everyone which is using and Ipod photo/color and is really paying attention to what he is hearing. Sadly no solution exists since the problem (as I supposed) is in the iPod output stage: that is to say it is an hardware problem!!

It is my intention to directly contact apple customer service but I fear they are not intereted in solving this problem (after all they sell millions of iPod in any case...)

 

[mjg]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicolaij R. Thank you PodMan... Reading the stuff you indicated has reavealed that the problem I suffer is documented and common to everyone which is using and Ipod photo/color and is really paying attention to what he is hearing. Sadly no solution exists since the problem (as I supposed) is in the iPod output stage: that is to say it is an hardware problem!! It is my intention to directly contact apple customer service but I fear they are not intereted in solving this problem (after all they sell millions of iPod in any case...)

Honestly let me know, how horrible is this?

If it really sucks, i'm going to return it immediatly.

 

[Nicolaij R.]

If I had never heard piano solo music I would have said: "Well, it's OK, bass is not perfect, but with an amp I can fix this..."

The first time I have heard piano solo music I have noticed the problem and I honestly say that this kind of music is literally UNHEARABLE!!! Every single note comes out distorted!!!

I don't know if the use of an amp can fix the problem: you have to consider that (since iPod has not a line out) the signal have to pass the internal headphone amp which is the responsible of the problem...

It is true that not all the headphones suffer this problem, so maybe introducing an amp on the signal path can alter the impedance "felt" by the iPod output stage... but this are just hypotesis to be verified case by case (dependening on which amp or headphone you are using)...

 

[PodMan]

I've browsed through a few of the posts on that thread and there seems to be reports that the line-out or through the dock doesnt have the problem. the distortion comes from Apple modifying the headphone-out jack to be able to output video signal to the television.

Also supposedly using headphones with high impedences 32ohm minimum should help alleviate the problem.

I think if you are just using it through the line-out it should be fine. but i think it is still pretty bad on apple's part to let something like this slip through on every color model particularly since they have been releasing color models for quite some time now. Apparently, even the latest 20gb/60gb models are still affected.

 

[Nicolaij R.]

So far there two alternatives:

1) Using an adapter that tarnsforms the dock connector into a line out + the attenuator that comes with the E4c as volume control.

2) Selling the iPod (here in Italy isn't an easy thing) an getting the X5; this way should solve (according to the comments here on head.fi) even the bass weakness. If I find a buyer (and it depends from the price)...

Any other idea?

 

[Jasper994]

sorry, totally off topic but...

MJG, nice Glengarry Glen Ross qoute.

 

[gerG]

Try the included in-line volume control on the headphone output. On my older ipods adding resistance really improves the treble of the Shures, and helps with the bass rolloff inherent to the ipod as well. It might also get you around the distortion problem.

Good luck.

gerG

 

[Nicolaij R.]

Great advice gerG!!

I must admit the problem has TOTALLY vanished using the shure attenuator... Probably the problem is so suble (tecnically speaking, but not musically speaking) that the simple insertion of the attenuator on the signal path solves everything... There is no distortion even with the volume of the attenuator completely up (that is to say with the attenuator virtually bypassed): that's a mystery...

As regards bass department... I have to say I have not made long linstening sessions with the attenuator inserted yet, but the atenuator appears to help just a little here...

Has everyone tried to convert the iPod dock connector into a line out a to plug your headphone directly here?
I make this question because if the iPod bass weakness is strictly due to the internal headphone amp, it would be bypassed in this way...

 

[markopolo]

It does help the bass problem quite a bit to listen directly through the lineout/attenuator... although I much prefer my E4c's amped -- much fuller, punchier bass with my PA2V2. I don't know if that's just due to the iPod's inherent flat bass response or some sort of deficiency with the E4's, or a combination of both. All I know is these phones like to be amped with the iPod. In all honesty, it's kind of frustrating that I have to use an amp just to get a satisfying level of bass. Maybe an X5 is in my future??

 

[Cannonfodder]

Nico,

Plugging your 'phones into the dock's line-out won't work since there is no amplification. You'll need to work an amp into the equation if you expect sound.

Maybe that would be a better solution if you find the bass lacking. You can find decent amps for cheap, like the PA2v2 or Go-Vibe, or you can go the DIY route.

This does wonders for me:
iPod 20GB -> PocketDock Line-Out -> PA2v2 -> Grado SR-60/EX81

Cheapest way to get great sound out of an iPod.

 

[mjg]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jasper994 sorry, totally off topic but... MJG, nice Glengarry Glen Ross qoute.

Still haven't seen it, thanks tho ; )

 

[ken36]

Outstanding thread. Great info. Thanks.