[Shahrose]

the title says it all, what do you guys think are the differences? people who own both, or atleast have tried both? list anything that's different about their sound, comfort, build quality, value for money etc. (mainly interested in sound though). i'd also like to hear which one you prefer and why.

edit: forgot to mention, but it REALLY matters on what kind of music you listen to, so please mentioned your music taste/preferred listening volume too if you care to.

 

[emericanchaos]

haven't heard the 650's but i'm planning to get them to accomodate my amp.

from the looks of your setup i'd say that you're not going to be able to fully utilize either headphone. i was really really surprised with what the 990's were able to turn out with a solid amp. if i were you i'd look at that path first.

 

[Shahrose]

hmm, my setup has changed, head-fi crash reverted my sig back to the old one :O

i'm wondering how the hd650 will sound since i've never gotten a chance to listen to them. i know that the dt990s have some sibilance issues (for me atleast, i'm sensitive to sibilance) and i have to eq the upper registers down a few db to make it perfect.

 

[emericanchaos]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shahrose /img/forum/go_quote.gif hmm, my setup has changed, head-fi crash reverted my sig back to the old one :O i'm wondering how the hd650 will sound since i've never gotten a chance to listen to them. i know that the dt990s have some sibilance issues (for me atleast, i'm sensitive to sibilance) and i have to eq the upper registers down a few db to make it perfect.

well what amp are you using then?

for me the treble isn't too bad. the M-audio is a tad warm and the tubes on the dark voice certainly help that notion along. with the current tube arrangement i find the treble bright enough to be detailed and clear but with minimal sibilance. it's still there on certain recordings but when compared to the big picture the sibilance isn't my real issue with them. i agree that they do need to be pinched off around the 7k area.

 

[Shahrose]

should let u know before i say any more that i love the dt990s, even if i were to find a new headphone to my liking i'd probably never sell the beyers just because they do almost everything right, especially bass/soundstaging. the only thing is that every source i've tried, the beyers have added some treble of their own. i know because i've compared them to other phones. it's safe to say that a bright amp/source + beyers definitely do not match, unless you want to cut up your eardrums with piercing treble. having said that, i have an eq and i use that to tame the highs. still, i'm interested in the hd650s (and proline 750) since one of those 2 will be my next purchase.

hm, the darkvoice amp you're using is quite well regarded here, and i know tubes add warmth and smooth out the treble, i bet that's why you don't have as much sibilance compared to mine on a solid state setup.

 

[granodemostasa]

hi
While the said characteristics of both cans would make one think that they sound similar, they are far from it.

one of the largest overall difference is the way both cans portray the midrange. the HD650 has what some would describe as a "romanticized" mid range that tends to carry over the mid-bass bump that presents itself. it's texture is more refined but also a little softer than the DT990. the DT990, on the other hand is more solid sounding, but not as authoritative (which is a result of the DT990's bass not intruding all that much on the midrange). i'magine the difference between a very very very good oil based painting (HD650) and a decent printer (DT990).

for most people, including myself, the DT990 does sound shrill and exaggerates the treble. Since you are looking for soundstage, I would say the HD650 is your best bet. HOWEVER, the HD650's soundstage isn't the best R-L soundstage in the world, if that soundstage was said to be 180 degrees, the HD650 is only 160 degrees of that... and tends to come out the most when it's put on a very good amplifier, so you might be disappointed with it at first.

 

[Shahrose]

that's quite an abstract comparison granodemostasa. it helps me identify some differences, although i can interpret "authoritative" and "solid sounding" as many different things. could you be more specific please? it seems like you know what you're talking about, i just need more concrete specific differences in plain terms. i understand your soundstage description though.

 

[granodemostasa]

it's hard to describe sound characteristics by the internet. so it's kinda hard to really get what that means. i'll try.
authoritative- this is really a strong sense of sound, it is well supported by bass, it is a deep tone that lacks not in decay.
solid sounding- the texture tends to create the presence of a concrete sound... imagine putting legos together. sometimes this could be bad because it lacks texture or refinement. think about the difference between a solid sounding 325i and a softer, but more authoritative RS-1.

 

[holland]

For soft music, I think the HD650 is fine. For fast, driving rock, it doesn't fare as well. The DT990 is better than it for that. Softer music, the HD650 is more intimate, more warmth.

The presentations are vastly different. If you're looking for just a small taming of the highs, then I would suggest looking for an AKG.

There is a veil on the HD650, it's not as boosted so if you change headphones immediately, it's noticeable.

I tend to prefer the DT990 because I favor rock music, particularly extreme rock. The veil of the HD650 takes away from the immediacy of the music, the strength of emotion is tamed, and mellows it.

For softer music, particularly acoustic strings, I think the HD650 is fabulous. Sometimes, however, the DT990 presents a crispness to the strings that I find appealing (due to the treble boost).

Overall, it's more a matter of preference and acclimation.

 

[Shahrose]

thanks holland, great description. and granodemostasa, what kind of music do you listen to?

thanks for the definitions by the way, clears a lot up

i'm interested in hearing other opinions on the hd650s as well.

 

[Reputator]

Some people may be referring to the new DT990, not the older one which it seems you have.

 

[poo]

I have compared my 650s to loads of other full sized cans (though not the DT900) and have always preferred them. As others have stated - it is very much personal taste. I am always impressed by the way my 650s 'bring the music together', whilst still maintaining excellent separation and positioning. To me, it really sounds as if you are in the location the music is being played - gives you the sense of dynamics of the studio or theatre or gig where it was recorded. Obviously alot of that is down to the recording itself, but that's sort of what I mean by 'bring it together' and is a big part of what I appreciate about the 'sennheiser sound'.

I disagree with Holland in regards to what was said about lacking immediacy and tamed strength of emotion - I don't find this an issue at all with my 650s - quite the opposite for me in fact. Again, that's a very personal thing, and I have not heard the DT990 myself, so perhaps Holland's explanation was specific to comparing the two models.

Darkvoice amps have been mentioned a few times so far, and I would like to add that my 650s sounded their best so far out of a Darkvoice too (was a laptop setup - foobar - musiland DAC - Darkvoice - HD650). I'm very much looking forward to finally receiving my DAC1 in a week or so to compare its sound

The 'veil' others have mentioned is particularly noticeable for me between Senns and Grados (in case you want to try to hear it yourself).

So... my suggestion is (if you have the money) buy some 650s from the forum (should be able to get a good price) and have a listen yourself. If they aren't your thing, sell them and buy the 990s instead - you should be able to do it without loosing a cent...

 

[keanej6]

i owned the dt990(2005) and hd650 simultaneously.

i remember just being very disappointed in the 990s considering that i thought i had a flagship model of beyerdynamic (i later found out that many or most consider the 880s their flagship). the bass was overwhelming and annoying, their was not much separation in instruments. i also find it interesting that people comment on it's wide soundstage. i found it to be very narrow, more so than the 650s and surely a far cry from the 701s (my brothers). the comfort however was exceptional with these cans.

i can't praise the hd650s enough. very warm and musical; pure bliss. the veil isn't that bad, and was solved with my aftermarket cable (zu mobius). the bass was tightened up considerably and the instruments were a little easier to focus on individually. i would've never invested in a cable until a fellow head-fier let me borrow his. it wasn't until i went back to the stock cable, did i realize what a difference it made. i find these cans very comfortable as well.

i listen to everything from classic rock, some hip hop, a lot of doomy and droney metal, but lately i've been listening to more instrumental post rocky stuff.

 

[Gurra1980]

Hd650, smooth, a tad rolled of treble, more neutral overall compared to dt990, has more texture to the bass. the dt990 has more bass and treble, to much of both, rececced midrange. I thought HD650 was better than dt990 but It did happen that I fall to sleep listening to HD650. Dt990 had a little bigger soundstage. I liked the midrange and deep bass of HD650, but to me the treble was a little to smooth, i'm thinking of buying the hd600, I really like neutrality they have with a little better treble than hd650, to my ears.

 

[hardstyler]

Quote:

Originally Posted by keanej6 /img/forum/go_quote.gif i also find it interesting that people comment on it's wide soundstage. i found it to be very narrow, more so than the 650s and surely a far cry from the 701s

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gurra1980 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I thought HD650 was better than dt990 but It did happen that I fall to sleep listening to HD650. Dt990 had a little bigger soundstage.

How can 2 people hear things so differently? That is very interesting