[Davesrose]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dwchin /img/forum/go_quote.gif And as I said, I don't profess to be an expert in tubes or tube amps. I have no qualms about labeling myself a tube "noob," as we say. It looks like the other amps he owns have been generally supported as being good value amps. I wish someone here with so-called golden ears could provide other opinions on how the Doge stacks up, but it looks like it's too early in the game for that. I bought it because I was looking for something new to try. Just based on my experience, I wouldn't call this amp worthless, even if it does use 12AX7 tubes, but then, what do I know? I'm a self-professed "tube noob" Also, just wanted to add that my original post was really just expressing that it's a shame this thread isn't more about the actual Doge anymore. I'm most interested in seeing what other people think about the amp, to see if my own ears agree with others' listening experiences. Really, that's the best way for someone like myself to get more knowledge of that tube sound.

Well Art's association with Cattylink shouldn't be discussed here.

I am sorry that actual evaluations of the Doge cannot be done because of the messenger: Art has always been rather aloof in these forums, so I think that's why the experienced tube users have learned to ignore him.

I notice you're in NY, dwchin. Not knowing anything about Cattylink products, I don't know how they stack up to other inexpensive tube amps. I would say hold on to what you have, continue to enjoy your tunes, and go to headphone meets. Meets are a good way to get info from more experienced members and get quick impressions of other equipment.

As for learning about tubes themselves, I know it's very daunting: tubes used to be the transistors of electronics, so there are SO many types of them. I profess that I know very little about them (I can just tell you about 5687s, 6SN7s, and 6CG7s that I can use on my amp). But there are other members who are a wealth of information and won't be blindly telling you that this amp is too muddy because it doesn't use "my tubes". They know enough that tubes are just another part of a long chain of what makes a good, synergistic system.

 

[MaloS]

Anyone care to bring a Doge 6201 to the International Meet so we can solve the dilemma once and for all?

 

[cotdt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaloS /img/forum/go_quote.gif Anyone care to bring a Doge 6201 to the International Meet so we can solve the dilemma once and for all?

i might be able to come, if the moderators don't ban me before then.

 

[Davesrose]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cotdt /img/forum/go_quote.gif i might be able to come, if the moderators don't ban me before then.

Why would moderators ban you? Being a k701 troll isn't an offense...poor choice, but not an offense

 

[dwchin]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davesrose /img/forum/go_quote.gif Well Art's association with Cattylink shouldn't be discussed here. I am sorry that actual evaluations of the Doge cannot be done because of the messenger: Art has always been rather aloof in these forums, so I think that's why the experienced tube users have learned to ignore him. I notice you're in NY, dwchin. Not knowing anything about Cattylink products, I don't know how they stack up to other inexpensive tube amps. I would say hold on to what you have, continue to enjoy your tunes, and go to headphone meets. Meets are a good way to get info from more experienced members and get quick impressions of other equipment. As for learning about tubes themselves, I know it's very daunting: tubes used to be the transistors of electronics, so there are SO many types of them. I profess that I know very little about them (I can just tell you about 5687s, 6SN7s, and 6CG7s that I can use on my amp). But there are other members who are a wealth of information and won't be blindly telling you that this amp is too muddy because it doesn't use "my tubes". They know enough that tubes are just another part of a long chain of what makes a good, synergistic system.

Thanks for the info, Davesrose. It's not so daunting as it seems at first, and I'm always up for a little trial and error. Yes, I am in the NY/NJ area, but just haven't been to any meets yet. No time on weekends really. I know it's no excuse

Unfortunately, I also won't be making the trip out to San Jose for the big meet, so someone else will have to bring their Doge if they can.

 

[drarthurwells]

I do not work for cattylink - never did.

I advocate certain inexpensive Chinese amps that perform at a level of amps costing three times as much. Cattylink sells most, but not all, of the amps I have advocated. Not unusual, since Cattylink.com sells all the major and worthwhile Chinese amps. Many Chinese products are junk - Cattylink will not sell these.

One of the posters on this site made complaints to the site administrator that I worked for cattylink. I have done free warranty work on cattylink products in the past - Cattylink gives me parts free and reimburses me for transportation costs in the form of credit toward items I purchase. I haven't touched an E5 for repair to it for over 10 months. I have done a few transport exchanges in that time - people send in their bad transport and I send them a new one which they put in themselves with my written instructions - easy to do - three screws to take out. I have worked less than an hour in the last 10 months - free. Member of the Trade?

I have never received any payment from Cattylink.com. The E5 is so reliable that I never have to do any actual repair work myself - just exchange transports.

I have purchased many things from Cattylink - thousands of dollars of stuff a year - much beyond the transportation cost credit.

I have several Bada 12s right now and ordered two more Doge 6210 amps that I am waiting on delivery - I love these amps, like to have spares on hand, and am buying before price increases. Because of my relation to Cattylink, even though it costs me instead of reimburses me, I have now been labeled a member of the trade. I accept that since I did receive one free gift from Cattylink, before Christmas - an Original Masters 220volt amp which I never opened and tried to sell (my ad to sell this amp in the amps for sell section was deleted right after it was posted). This gift came in with an order for the Jolida amp, and was totally an unwanted surprise when I got it.

I have upset people who advocate the more expensive amps than the ones I recommend. I hope every Doge owner has a chance to buy one of these amps in the future and see which is best. Then you can decide if I was trying to sell Cattylink products, or if I was trying to get others to obtain the top sound at the lowest cost, regardless of whether you bought it from Cattylink or not.

Pacificvalve.us has come done on their Doge 6210 price to $450. This is a result of Cattylink's low price. Since Pacificvalve offers a more easy to use warranty for USA buyers, potential Doge owners may want to buy from them.
I initially gave them as a source along with Cattylink - I am not trying to sell products for Cattylink.

The AKG K701 is not available from Cattylink and for $255 is as good or better as any dynamic HP you can buy. I do not recommend electrostatic HPs.

The Rega Saturn CDP is as good as any, and costs only $1600 from the USA dealer I buy my Rega CDPs from. This ii not available from Cattylink either.

I will no longer be posting on this site. I warn those who read posts here to be careful of the quality-is-measured-by-price crowd. You can easily end up spending too much and not getting the sound quality you could have gotten at a lower price, if you let this crowd sway you.

I stand by this earlier post below - I am a member of charity to others and not to any trade.



Quote:

Originally Posted by drarthurwells /img/forum/go_quote.gif I do not work for Cattylink. I have never received any money or other compensation from them. I say the K701 is the best headphone you can get. See my link below to others who agree. It is no accident that Head Room downgraded the HD650 after they heard the K701. I have bought four from USA dealers, paying the same price as anyone else, and bought one of the four for a head-fier who has 3 months to pay me for it (it was shipped from the dealer and due to arrive this Friday). On several occasions I have sent head-fiers stuff I sell and let them pay me later. I say the Rega Saturn is as good as any CDP at any price. I bought my Rega Apollos and Saturn from a USA Rega dealer who has the lowest prices in the world. I have recommended this dealer to other head-fiers who paid the same low price as I did. I have never gotten anything from this dealer in return. I do it to enable others to get the top sound available for low cost. I say my headphone amps, power conditioner, power cables, and IC match or beat any at any price. I buy most of my amp stuff from Cattylink because they offer great prices and service and are totally reliable. You pay $2800 for an award winning KT88 amp under a famous brand, made in China, and the exact same amp can be bought at Cattylink for $600. My three headphone amps would sell for three or four times the price if made in the USA, and many here would consider them as good as any at any price in that case. There are - at around $375 to $525 from Cattylink. Again, I recommend my amps not because you can get them from Catylink, but because they offer the best sound, and are low cost, to enable others to save money while having the best sound. The Doge is a great amp for a low cost - many USA buyers will prefer to buy it from Pacific Valve instead of Cattylink, because of the domestically available warranty. I pointed this out early in the thread here. I do free repair work on E5 CDPs and did one free Bada 12 mosfet repair, where Cattylink supplies me parts on an exchange basis. I do this because it is fun, quick and easy, and very infrequent, out of my deep appreciation for the great products I have bought from Cattylink. I usually buy in large quantity from Cattylink to save shipping, and share with my sons or sell at times (not for profit). I just sold two Doge amps on a trial basis after ordering a few before prices might rise. I actually sold them for slightly less than my cost, which was slightly below $375, but they both may come back (and go to my sons who have Bada 12s). Do you often make false accusations with no proof? I will send you, via Fed Ex, a new Doge, with tubes, and you keep it for two weeks. You then return it via Fed Ex, in the same condition as received, and include $14 cash for my original shipping costs. Hear for yourself - even with your sources that you own you might be able to hear how good it is. The K701 will help here.

 

[cotdt]

Actually, right now Pacific Valve sells the Doge 6210 for $425. Please stay, Art. Your posts and service here have been very helpful to me and I'm sure many others.

 

[tangsta]

I'd advocate the Doge over the PH12,

at the international meet, someone should bring a PH12 and the doge amp. everything will finally be settled.

 

[MaloS]

cotdt, better be at int-l meet We need at least one Doge, find me =]

 

[cotdt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaloS /img/forum/go_quote.gif cotdt, better be at int-l meet We need at least one Doge, find me =]

hey bro, so you're going? i'm leaning toward going, but still deciding. i have a balanced K701, modded Zhaolu, Doge 6210, and a maxed out 100W T-amp that might serve a K1000 one day. i would love to do some shootouts against some much more expensive audio equipment.

 

[MaloS]

I am more modest. I just want to hear if I am proper in my internal sense that my rig is one headphone away from being complete, or head-fi cursed me forever. Plus its always fun to see whats worth what.

 

[cotdt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaloS /img/forum/go_quote.gif I am more modest. I just want to hear if I am proper in my internal sense that my rig is one headphone away from being complete, or head-fi cursed me forever. Plus its always fun to see whats worth what.

you picked good equipment in your sig so you're definately not cursed. a couple changes here and there and you can quit this hobby i'm sure. i recommend you check out the various DACs, though. if you upgrade your microDAC, then it looks like a high-end system to me.

 

[spacecoyote]

This is one of very few posts I have made, here at head-fi, since joining but it is on a topic I feel I am modestly qualified to comment on.
I do NOT have much experience with headphone tube amps, so I did a decent amount of research before purchasing one. After several weeks of research I found that, in my price range, the Doge 6210 was a prime place to begin my tube amp experience. Dr Art was kind enough to offer and supply me with my first tube amp, the Doge 6210, at a more than resonable price. He also supplied me with as much solicited advice that I could ask for. To make sure I was choosing wisely, the tube amp over the solid state amp, I bought a moderately priced audiophile/reference-type (however you like to think of them) solid state amp. I then preformed an A/B comparison between the two amps.
As a sidenote let me just say that I may be inexperienced with tube and SS amps but I am in no way inexperienced with music. I play guitar, poorly, and I am an avid collector of jazz and live music. I have an extensive media library and have devoted the better part of the last 28 years of my life (I am 32) to listening to music, listening and hearing.
The A/B comparison was brief. I chose three very different recordings and listened to all three on both amps. A live rock performance, a studio album, and a 42 year old single-point-mic bootleg recording. With out a doubt the Doge 6210 tube amp was the champ. Soundstage, coloration blah blah blah. I'm not going to try and sound like I know what I'm talking about, I don't. What I do know is the Doge 6210 was superior in every way. The sound is just so much more real than through the SS amp.
Now alot of people seem to have turned this thread from what it was started for into a proving ground for their own ideological audiophile point-of-view. Again, I may not know much, but this is what I know: Dr. Art seems to dedicate alot of time and energy to this site and it's users. And of all the back and forth that's been going on he is the only one who continues to provide usable information, as opposed to some other people who continue to pick apart statements and basically look for a fight. Opinions vary, but facts and truths do not. A simple point of fact is that drarthurwells is an honest man who offers help to those of us who ask.
No one is perfect, but one thing's for sure...
My Doge 6210 IS perfect, in every way. Art was more than helpful and even more than generous through our dealings. That is a fact. What others may say of others is penny-anty, chicken-crap tactics meant to manipulate perception and push their own subversive agenda. That is also a fact.
Thanx, Art, for expanding my horizons.

"...to know that you know what you know...and to know that you do not know what you do not know...that is true knowledge." -Confucious-

 

[etys rule]

Very well said. As a novice to tube amps, I myself have sought out the good doctors advice and he has always been more than helpful. While he has his own opinions, don't we all. And unlike some, he is always willing to offer advice. Art, your experience is most appreciated.

 

[pftrvlr]

Of the three amps I have now - LD Micro Tube, Woo3. Doge 6210, I am listening to the Doge more than the others combine. It is simply more appealing to my ears.