Does a receiver act as an amp? Honest question

[Sean2884]

I run my computer and television through my receiver, which drives my HD-555's. I continually see users on here posting about their amps. I was wondering if the receiver is an amplifier. I dont mean if people are using the 2 terms to denote the same piece of equipment, but I mean physically does my receiver amp my headphones?

And if not, then what exactly does an amp do? More power? Clearer signal? I realize the 555's are a mid range headphone, so would they benefit from an amp? And more importantly, does using a computer as a source restrict possible quality as compared to a CD?

And no, this is not a joke.

 

[Necros]

A AV receiver has amps for the 5.0 speakers, but if it has a headphone amp/socket then yes it'll power headphones.

If you compared original CD to compressed MP3, especially latter with analogue connection then it should be obvious the difference..CD will most likely sound better with lower noise floor, and superior DAC's in the CD player or receiver. Unless you have a high-end soundcard, even then I'm not sure of quality of PC soundcards.

 

[jpr703]

A lot of questions here. First of all a reciever is usually used as a generic term to describe an amplifier, a signal processor, and an AM/FM "reciever" all in one box. A seperate amplifier is just that, an amplifier and nothing more. Amplifier quality can, of course, vary but generally speaking if someone is building an amplfier that does nothing but amplify they tend to concentrate on the quality with which it does that. "Recievers" do many things but, in general, don't do them as well as dedicated components.

Now, there are also several different types of dedicated amplifiers. One of those is a headphone amp. These can be customized a number of ways and are, again generally speaking, of higher quality than the the circuitry that the headphone jack in your "reciever" is.

As far as a computer source goes, these can range wildly in quality too. The major factors are the ripping/encoding method used for your digital music and your sound card. To put it simply 128k MP3s sound a lot different than 320k AAC files or lossless compression methods. Components used in sound cards very a lot too. See the Computers as Source Forum for help.

 

[Sovkiller]

Your receiver is an amp, of course, and it will power the headphones via the headphone jack, but as those amp are designed for very low impedances (usually 4-8 ohms of the speakers) and high output (more than 5 watts usually) you need to attenuate the signal at the jack, you can't get the signal straight from the speakers out, and just place a jack there for the headphones, as you will blow the headphones off (usually a few mW are enough to power them)...and there is the real problem, usually they use a resistor network, that is an afterthought device, and even with no so good parts, that make more harm than benefits to the sound of the headphones at the end....so the short answer is, yes it is an amp, but it is not a dedicated headphone amp...a dedicated headphone amp is designed for higher impedances and with lower power, just the needed to properly control the movement of the diaphragms of the headphones drivers.....

 

[Nak Man]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean2884 I was wondering if the receiver is an amplifier.

Receiver = Tuner + Amplifier, in a single housing.

Phones jack on receiver = will amp your phones.

There are two methods behind the phones output on your receiver, one is by a separate op amp or IC just like on 'entry level' dedicated mini phones amp such as cmoy, and the other is utilizing same power amplifier to drive main speakers - with additional resistors to 'turn down' the volume to phones, just like what Sov said above.

A good receiver phones output using the second method have the potential to sound better compared to entry level dedicated phones amp. However, the key lies in values of resistor network to match your phones' impedance. Standard resistor values that came pre-set from factory may not intended or designed toward your specific phones which may make them relatively sound bad.

 

[gundam91]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nak Man Receiver = Tuner + Amplifier, in a single housing.

Technically,
Integrated Amplifier = preamp + amplifier.
Receiver = integrated amplifier + AM/FM Tuner.

A preamp's function is mainly for selecting different sources (i.e. CD, tape, DVD, etc.). The amp then amplifies the volume, (or put in another word, drives the speaker/headphone).

When we talk about "amplifier" in regards to headphones, we are actually referring to an integrated amplifier, technically, as it has a volume control.


"Grasshopper" Sean2884,

There are usually two types of signal you can have coming out of your source. If you are running your signal out of the "Line" output from your source (computer, CD player, etc.) the signal is set at a standard level set by the industry. We call it "unamplified". The preamp part of the receiver receives this signal and the amplifier part amplifies the signal to the desired level based on the volume you set.

The other type of signal you get is through the headphone jack. The headphone jack in your CD players, receivers, integrated amps, etc. all have a build-in chip that acts as a small amplifier. (I used to work for National Semiconductor, and this was one of their main products) It will amplify easy loads like computer speakers, some headphones. It is connected to a volume control. Most of these chips are not so good in relative terms. They are cheap, and usually an after thought. But there are always exceptions.

So the answer to your first question is yes and no. Your receiver is amping your headphone, but it's not the bulky stuff that's amping your headphone, it's a little chip about the size of 1" x 1" sitting somewhere inside your receiver that's amping your headphone.

And to your second question. Yes, a real amp has more power, will deliver a cleaner and fuller sound. Some headphones will required a headphone amp. But many more efficient ones can get by without a dedicated amp, but the sound quality will be compromised. Think of playing a graphic intense computer game with a generic graphic card that came stock with your computer. It'll work, but you probably don't get as good of resolution as if you were using a graphic card designed specifically for games.

Each amp will have specific characters. Some will have more synergy with certain headphones. And a lot will base on your personal preference and music taste.

 

[Nak Man]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gundam91 Receiver = integrated amplifier + AM/FM Tuner.

Whoops, missed that 'integrated' word there. =)

Quote:

Originally Posted by gundam91 Your receiver is amping your headphone, but it's not the bulky stuff that's amping your headphone, it's a little chip about the size of 1" x 1" sitting somewhere inside your receiver that's amping your headphone.

Not always the case, sometimes the bulky stuff does the work through resistor network. And under this method we can try to find better resistor values to match phones' impedance. I'm not an EE but I'm 100% sure that some of integrateds / receivers don't use separate op amp for phones. Sorry if I got your message wrong.

 

[djbnh]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gundam91 Technically, Integrated Amplifier = preamp + amplifier. Receiver = integrated amplifier + AM/FM Tuner.

I'd add that some receivers additionally have a MM phono section (some preamps are line only, some have the phono section). Furthermore, the older (1960-ish) Fisher receivers could take a ceramic phono output, but are not really suited to MM/MC use.

 

[gundam91]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nak Man sometimes the bulky stuff does the work through resistor network. And under this method we can try to find better resistor values to match phones' impedance. I'm not an EE but I'm 100% sure that some of integrateds / receivers don't use separate op amp for phones. Sorry if I got your message wrong.

I am not an EE either. I am sure there are some receivers that use the bulk to drive headphones. But then again, I think he's talking about current production stuff, so there was no point getting him more confused.

Quote:

Originally Posted by djbnh I'd add that some receivers additionally have a MM phono section (some preamps are line only, some have the phono section). Furthermore, the older (1960-ish) Fisher receivers could take a ceramic phono output, but are not really suited to MM/MC use.

We could go there too, but I didn't want to overwhelm the dude.

Preamps do include phono stage. The one that doesn't is called a line-stage.

 

[Scopip]

currently using a sherwood recent model stereo reciever, via a chaintec710. quality is good.

but, i don't know whether to take a gamble buying a cmoy.

I clearly don't need any more power for ms1's. but, does a cmoy filter and make the sound quality good?

My gutt feel is that cmoy is really just for more power and that I need a real amp such as a pimeta to get the premium sound.

To put it simply. I have no power issues. will a cmoy likely improve the sound over my stereo reciever for headphones?

thanks,
dan

 

[jordanr]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sovkiller Your receiver is an amp, of course, and it will power the headphones via the headphone jack, but as those amp are designed for very low impedances (usually 4-8 ohms of the speakers) and high output (more than 5 watts usually) you need to attenuate the signal at the jack, you can't get the signal straight from the speakers out, and just place a jack there for the headphones, as you will blow the headphones off (usually a few mW are enough to power them)...and there is the real problem, usually they use a resistor network, that is an afterthought device, and even with no so good parts, that make more harm than benefits to the sound of the headphones at the end....so the short answer is, yes it is an amp, but it is not a dedicated headphone amp...a dedicated headphone amp is designed for higher impedances and with lower power, just the needed to properly control the movement of the diaphragms of the headphones drivers.....

Oh my god, try using a period every 10 words or so.

 

[Jonoh]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean2884 ...my HD-555's....

That's the Sennheiser 555 right? Those are highly efficient and do not require a headphone amp. I suspect they will sound better with one but they probably sound pretty good without. I have a Senn 650 which sounds recessed and slow, amoung other things, when not properly powered yet really delivers the goods when powered well. The 5x5 line is not so power hungry.

While not an absolute rule, most receivers do not have high quality headphone amps in them. Recievers do not sell based on how well they power headphones so companies are clearly not putting the money there.

 

[Nak Man]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scopip To put it simply. I have no power issues. will a cmoy likely improve the sound over my stereo reciever for headphones?

Never tried that specific receiver and can't generalize on receiver. If there's impedance mismatch, sound can easily get worse. A regular op amp ala cmoy works better with my phones compared to nak receiver, while another integrated phones jack works wonder with 501. Sorry couldn't help much. Since cmoy is extremely easy to build, why don't you try one using raw bread board ?