Definitive technology (DefTech) symphony 1
Apr 17, 2015 at 8:54 AM Post #31 of 121

Soundofmusic

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Not sure why no one other than plantronics with their backbeats pro are including class 1 bt chip?


AFAIK M2 are class 1. Both ends needs to be class 1 tho. See under "other" :

http://www.cnet.com/products/sennheiser-momentum-wireless/specs/
 
Apr 17, 2015 at 9:04 AM Post #33 of 121

Shinoke

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Just got a set 2 days ago, and finally bose has been matched in anc! These are incredible. Unfortunately they have the same bt issues as some others out there. Walking in manhattan causes alot of stuttering. Shame really. Not sure why no one other than plantronics with their backbeats pro are including class 1 bt chip? Sound quality imo is mediocre too. Kind of dead sounding if that makes any sense? So they go back, and the quest continues. I would keep the backbeat pros, but they are just too heavy, bulky and not comfortable.

 
Cheers suzook. Still not managed to get my hands on these but was quite interested in them, also still continuing the quest for the perfect anc bt headphones.
 
Would you mind doing a comparison of the BPP and the Symphony 1's in the dedicated thread for this? Think others would really benefit from it.
 
Shame you have BT issues with these as well, so far only seen it reported for the Momentum Wireless.
 
Here's the thread: http://www.head-fi.org/t/761894/the-active-noise-cancellation-bluetooth-headphones-thread-quick-guide-comparison-and-discussion
 
Cheers and good luck!
 
Apr 17, 2015 at 9:07 AM Post #34 of 121

Shinoke

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Yes, just checked the manual for the M2 and they are stated as BT 4.0 class 1.
 
I heard there were issues with BT 4.0. But Sennheiser have stated they won't update to 4.1 (which only requires a firmware update).
 
Perhaps Def Tech will update.
 
Or perhaps some people will work out a way to do it themselves.
 
The M2's BT max power output is 10mW - so it may be to do with that, the quality of the chip, materials used etc (e.g. the earcups contain glass)
 
Apr 18, 2015 at 12:51 AM Post #35 of 121

n00b2

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Cheers suzook. Still not managed to get my hands on these but was quite interested in them, also still continuing the quest for the perfect anc bt headphones.
 
Would you mind doing a comparison of the BPP and the Symphony 1's in the dedicated thread for this? Think others would really benefit from it.
 
Shame you have BT issues with these as well, so far only seen it reported for the Momentum Wireless.
 
Here's the thread: http://www.head-fi.org/t/761894/the-active-noise-cancellation-bluetooth-headphones-thread-quick-guide-comparison-and-discussion
 
Cheers and good luck!

 
I've noticed the bt issues with these as well. Wasn't as bad as the Momentum Wireless for me but range was poor. Couldn't go more than 2 rooms acorss before it started to drop out and there were a fair few random dropouts as well.
 
Apr 18, 2015 at 6:00 PM Post #36 of 121

Giogio

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Interesting...i wonder ifbthe m2's really have a class 1???? Why do the backbeats have such great range??


The class 1, as Soundofmusic explained, needs that also the source/transmitter is class1. So, when you pair the Momentum and the Plantronics with a class 2 device, they operate in class 2.
And as you may notice if you try many class 2 headphones, each performs differently, even VERY differently in the range, from epic fails like the most expensive bt headphones ever (the BeoPlay H8, worst range ever) till remarkable results like the Plantronics or also the Beats Studio Wireless and the Audio Technica ATH-WS99BT.
 
Anyway, there are good news, the Japanese make two Aptx Class 1 Dongle (Logitec LBT-UAN04C1BK and Sanwa MM-BTUD43). You can buy them from Amazon.jb or in Rakuten Global.
 
I am tester and counselor for Avantree, a very nice Chinese Company with a nice passionate team and an excellent support, which makes very good adapters and were among the first making Low Latency Aptx adapters. I have been able to convince them to make a Low Latency APTX dongle, so that people with a notebook do not have to travel with something attached to their 3.5 jack connector, and also because technically/theoretically speaking in this way there are less transmormations of the sound (it stays digital till it reaches the headphones, while in a 3.5 adapter would be transformed in analog and again in digital).
I am trying to convince them to make it class 1. So it would not only be the only Low Latency dongle in the world but also the only class 1 LL Aptx adapter. The perfect pair for the Plantronics (which are class 1 AND low latency) but for me also for the Momentum, as Avantree has got MUCH better support than the Japanese (they did not even answer to my emails, and their dongle needs that terrible CSR Harmony software, while the Avantree will be independent, like the sennheiser BTD-500, and will be 100% concentrated in audio, no mouse connection. One thing, well done, no intereferences).
Btw, for those having a class 2 headphone, Avantree is working on a stationary adapter (bigger, powered with AC), which will probably be class 2 but will have an antenna and will have a better range than the typical class 2, something wbetween 3 and 5 times more. Low Latency Aptx too. So people with a class 2 device will be able to move around at home more.
 
So, you can wait and see, I will surely inform of that in my thread (see signature).
 
Apr 18, 2015 at 6:13 PM Post #37 of 121

Shinoke

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I've noticed the bt issues with these as well. Wasn't as bad as the Momentum Wireless for me but range was poor. Couldn't go more than 2 rooms acorss before it started to drop out and there were a fair few random dropouts as well.

 
Shame, hopefully Def Tech will be better than Sennheiser regarding updates.
 
Apr 18, 2015 at 11:54 PM Post #39 of 121

n00b2

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I am tester and counselor for Avantree, a very nice Chinese Company with a nice passionate team and an excellent support, which makes very good adapters and were among the first making Low Latency Aptx adapters. I have been able to convince them to make a Low Latency APTX dongle, so that people with a notebook do not have to travel with something attached to their 3.5 jack connector, and also because technically/theoretically speaking in this way there are less transmormations of the sound (it stays digital till it reaches the headphones, while in a 3.5 adapter would be transformed in analog and again in digital).
I am trying to convince them to make it class 1. So it would not only be the only Low Latency dongle in the world but also the only class 1 LL Aptx adapter. The perfect pair for the Plantronics (which are class 1 AND low latency) but for me also for the Momentum, as Avantree has got MUCH better support than the Japanese (they did not even answer to my emails, and their dongle needs that terrible CSR Harmony software, while the Avantree will be independent, like the sennheiser BTD-500, and will be 100% concentrated in audio, no mouse connection. One thing, well done, no intereferences).
Btw, for those having a class 2 headphone, Avantree is working on a stationary adapter (bigger, powered with AC), which will probably be class 2 but will have an antenna and will have a better range than the typical class 2, something wbetween 3 and 5 times more. Low Latency Aptx too. So people with a class 2 device will be able to move around at home more.

 
Interesting that Avantree is making more low latency adapters. Will definitely be on the lookout for them to arrive. Any ETA? Also making the adapter class 1 would be awesome but I certainly hope it doesn't increase the price too much. A lot of people I know wouldn't bother with class 1 if they can get a class 2 a lot cheaper as they feel the 10m limit of class 2 would be fine (sure not all class 2 has the same range but not everyone knows that). I also agree that Avantree have an amazing support. Not a lot of Chinese companies that can compete with them in that area.
 
Apr 19, 2015 at 5:45 PM Post #40 of 121

Giogio

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For the dongle, not yet. They told me they just started the R&D so they will need a few months.
For the big one with antenna, which very probably will be class 2 but as said with much better range, and will be low latency aptx and have optical and 3.5 connections, they told me one or two months more or less. But I still did not receive the test unit.
The Priva 2 (a better Priva which will be able to use Aptx also in the Dual Link mode, a dream for us comparer, because we can connect TWO Aptx headphones at SAME time sending them the same music together, which is something more than what Multipoint can do. So, we can very very quickly switch between two headphones! Even if the original purpose is just to let two people listen to music or watch tv together) also one or two months.
And same for the new Audition Pro (headphones). I have received their first Audition in these days and, well, it's a very basic headphone. I am giving them suggestions about what they must change but they were already conscious of the limits and faults of the old model. They are auditioning the top headphones in my list to understand what to improve and how.
We'll see. I have my doubt that they can reach the level of those headphones but they can probably do something nearly good but much cheaper.
 
Apr 20, 2015 at 1:05 AM Post #41 of 121

n00b2

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Originally Posted by Giogio /img/forum/go_quote.gif
.
The Priva 2 (a better Priva which will be able to use Aptx also in the Dual Link mode, a dream for us comparer, because we can connect TWO Aptx headphones at SAME time sending them the same music together, which is something more than what Multipoint can do. So, we can very very quickly switch between two headphones! Even if the original purpose is just to let two people listen to music or watch tv together) also one or two months.

 
Good to hear about the Priva 2. That was the only thing that held me back from getting a Priva, the fact that both connected headphones might suffer from a different level of latency making a quick lip sync fix impossible when watching a movie due to them being connected by SBC. Good to head about the dongle with the antenna as well. Class 1 makes no difference for a class 2 headphone but a bigger antenna might. Any idea if the optical connection being includded is a standard optical or a mini optical one?
 
Apr 21, 2015 at 11:43 PM Post #42 of 121

n00b2

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@Giogio Forgot to ask before will the Priva 2 support aptx LL in dual mode or just aptx? Aptx on its own would be great for an uber reviewer like yourself but without aptx LL it isn't that useful for movies and games if you are trying to use the dual link mode for 2 people.
 
Apr 22, 2015 at 3:48 PM Post #43 of 121

Giogio

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@Giogio
Forgot to ask before will the Priva 2 support aptx LL in dual mode or just aptx?
normal APTX in dual link.
Still much better latency than sbc, and don't forget that only the Plantronics are low latency. So, unless people buy two of them, they would still have to lead with normal aptx.
 
Apr 23, 2015 at 12:17 AM Post #44 of 121

n00b2

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normal APTX in dual link.
Still much better latency than sbc, and don't forget that only the Plantronics are low latency. So, unless people buy two of them, they would still have to lead with normal aptx.


Yes better than SBC but still can be problematic for movies and games. Arguably its a bigger problem because as different headphones seem to have different latency, using two different headphones would cause issues with lip sync that can't be fixed as you can adjust the delay to suit one of them but the other will still be out of time. Yes you would have to use a second (and third) adapter with 2 pairs of headphones to utilise the aptx LL codec but someone who really needs low latency would willingly do it. I think I've mentioned before of my mate who stuck a Saturn Pro to his ear cup because the latency of aptx was killing him in online FPS gaming. Probably not a huge market out there but still handy for some people.
 
Apr 25, 2015 at 1:10 AM Post #45 of 121

etherealsleep

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I've been using the Symphony 1s for a few weeks now.
 
From what I've observed
 
ANC and Overall Sound Quality is Very good! You can sit outside in a strong wind activate the ANC and suddenly it's just you and the music.   
ANC does seem to act as a bass boost when in use -- mostly in (mostly rap/low bass eq - Kendrick lamar or Flying lotus) style tracks.   
Lower Frequencies seem to become somewhat crushed if you pay close attention to the details in a few songs (again in mostly low bass/rap/hip-hop music). **
All other genres of music sound full and rich with detail including movies. (Acoustic, easy listening, even metal-electro sounds great!)
The soundstage has a nice presence.  
Separation of music is clear and subtle at times but not anything you'd hear say on a pair of speakers powered by a mcintosh amp (life goals)     
Between active and passive I personally prefer the active. here is a quality difference between the two but not enough to 
 
Controls / Call Quality
The Controls are quite easy to use and simple.
Call quality varies - if you're soft spoken and outdoors it could be difficult for people to hear you. 
Quality of phone calls was excellent I'm assuming its due to the built-in DAC. 
Since I'm on a Custom Rom Android hanging up and answering calls using the built in controls struggled
(due to the ROM tested with was in nightly status not official not the symphony 1) If you use an iphone I'm pretty sure it'll be solid. 
 
Comfort
It's really impressive though as others have stated it is made of a seemingly pleather type mix for the earpad covering. 
The inner cushions are rather plush memory foam they retain their shape well even after hours of use without putting too much pressure on your ears.
If your body temp rises easily you'll feel comfortable for about 4-5hrs+ of use before needing like a 10-20 min break. 
 
 Range seems to vary with use 
   ---I'm assuming it's heavily dependent on the device you pair it with. (Paired with one plus/imac 27in 2014/older macbook pro) ---
 I've also recent tested it at my friends condo which is a bit of an open floorplan for a few days.
When paired with an older macbook pro the range is about rough estimate 15-20ft from the laptop (direct line of sight)
though when getting closer to the side of the laptop its about 10ft give or take 
 
Battery Life
Battery life is Solid. I could use them all day on and off without having to charge it once.
I'd say it's right around the advertised 15 hours give or take.
 
=======
Mind you this is just an average persons review from use, sorry if it's not fully encompassing. 
I've ordered a pair of Momentum M2 Ivory over the ear bluetooth to test next (should be here tomorrow!) 
 
I'm still on the fence about the def techs but definitely love the fact they're jumping into the headphone department
My only concerns
-Pleather mix earbuds (which are detachable i believe -- but I've yet to try and remove them)
-Deep Bass/Low Freq Music (like below 70hz roughly)
** This happens whether in passive wired mode or with active BT enabled
======
In the end it's always best to try to find a dealer
who has a pair on display and test them for yourself. 
 

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