[Peddler]

Hi There.

I have had some adventures in MP3 land over the past few weeks. I decided that I was getting fed up with trying to find something to listen to. Being an (ex) avid MD user that meant searching through two lots of media.

The SlimX gave me an idea of just how far things have come on with MP3 playback and so I decided to try out a HD-based MP3 player.

I started off with the Rio Riot. As reported in previous posts, this is a very impressive sounding machine - in fact I would go as far as to say it was the best sounding portable player I have ever heard - with any medium. No noise, very powerful and effortless sound - really good kit! The only problem (for me) with the Riot was the price. I was also not too keen on the built-in rechargable battery which meant that in time, you would have to open up the machine to change it.

After briefly trying out the Archos Jukebox Recorder 20 (really didn't like the sound quality) I settled on the Creative Nomad Jukebox 3.

I won't bore you with the extermal details about the unit - there's plenty of information already available on the web which is far better written than wot i can du.

Needless to say, the unit is reasonable portable (thanks to the supplied leather-type case). Although the machine came supplied with an infra red remote control, the truth is I would have much rather had the wired remote control/headphone lead as I could then try the unit with my Sony 888 (short lead).

Battery consumption is very impressive. Most users should not be too disappointed and the recharge time is impressively fast. There's no problem regarding skipping on the unit and, once I have the wired remote control, should be no different than carrying around my SlimX - except for capacity.

Sound Quality

I would have been happy with the Archos Recorder if it hadn't been for the poor sound quality. Luckily the Nomad 3 sounds a whole lot better. Perhaps not quite as good as the Riot but very very close.

Headphone output is rated at 100mw. It does go loud (almost definitely louded than the Sony R900 MD recorder for instance) but not as loud as you might think with that kind of rating. Users of the Senn 600's will still not be able to use this unit without a headphone amplifier. Through earbuds though the sound is more than adequate. I am currently using Senn 400MX buds and the Etymotic ER4 - both sound very good and the player doesn't let itself down when playing through the Ety's. There is a slight (and I mean really slight) hiss that can be detected through the Ety's from the electronics (irrespective of what MP3 is playing) but I really don't think it's worth worrying about.

I feel I must point out that I don't waste my time listening to 128K MP3's - they all sound *****!!! I tend to use LAME encoded VBR's at a fairly high bit-rate. The player works a treat with them and it really is very difficult to tell the difference between the MP3 copy and the original CD.

I briefly tried my Airhead amp with the unit and I can report that it sounds excellent - there are some reports on the net regarding the line output on the Nomad not being as clean as the headphone output - let me assure you that if there are differences I can't hear them at all.

I have not tried making real time optical recordings directly to the unit from my CD player - perhaps some time in the future but let's face it, it's generally faster to rip CD's using the PC.

One thing that really impresses me about the unit is the degree of support users can get from Creative. Just take a look at www.nomadness.net

Please feel free to ask questions - I will try to answer them.

 

[fredpb]

The Nomad Jukebox 1 and 3 have great line outs.

I was trying out my Grado's (SR125) with Headroom Little today.
The NJB3 sounded outstanding with these, and my JB320 MD unit sounded like crud.

I just got the new LAME MP3 encoder package, and use it now with MP3Tagger and Exact Audio Copy and this setup is great.
The Playcenter 3 that comes with the NJB3 also does a decent job of ripping and encoding in WMA and MP3 formats.


Note that the NJB3 did lose some functionality from the 1st version. They only way to truly locate music now is from ALBUM or using a playlist, otherwise, you get useless lists of thousands of tracks. They say they will fix this (Creative Labs). Creative does have some outstanding usenet forums on their own server! And they monitor them too. Sonicblue, well, what customers support?

The only three devices of the mp3 jukebox type I can recommend are Treo 10 by eDigital, PJB100, and Nomad Jukebox.

 

[acs236]

I'd like to hear for playback quality comparisons, if you could indulge me. What other portables have you listened to? This is the only HD unit I'm interested in. Any other shortcomings since you've been using it?

 

[Peddler]

I have listened to the following MP3 units:

HD:
Archos Jukebox, Rio Riot, Archos Jukebox Recorder and Creative Nomad 3.

CD: SlimX, Goodmans (can't remember model).

RAM: Hewlett Packard Jornada 568

To me, the one which sounded best was the Rio Riot. The Nomad is a close second but I'm afraid the Archos models just don't sound as good - they exhibit a harsh, almost 'metallic' quality to the music which is not present with other players.

The SlimX is an excellent CD/MP3 machine and I well recommend it for that application. Also, rather surprisingly, the Jornada actually sounds reasonable but obviously is limited by its storage capacity.

I must admit that, if money were no object, I perhaps would have ultimately gone for the Apple Ipod but it is damned expensive and almost unobtainable in my neck of the woods. I did like the form factor and functionality of the Archos machine - it's just a shame about the sound quality. The Riot has a very full and satisfying sound. Perhaps not as neutral as it could be but extremely enjoyable to listen to.

What I like about the Creative Nomad is:
Excellent sound quality
Good battery performance
Capacity
Optical/Analogue Input options (although in all fairness I have only used the USB so far)
IR Remote control supplied

What I don't like about the Creative is:
Size.
Button placement and sensitivity - I keep stopping and skipping tracks accidentally when I lean on things.
No remote headphone cable (I personally have more use for that than the IR remote.

The Creative is an excellent player. The sound quality is first class and 20 Gb of space is pretty damned impressive. I do use the player in "walkman" mode without any problems skipping, etc. Once I acquire the headphone remote lead I'm sorted.

 

[DeanA]

Peddler,

You do know that a wired remote will be available once Creative starts selling the NJB3 accessories. As for the control buttons, there is a menu “Button Lock” option that will lock out the control buttons. I’ll admit making this a menu option was a pain until I got used to the feature.

 

[traveler]

I wish I would have found this site a while ago. I stumbled upon it while looking for references to the "Ety's"; I have the Sony MDR-EDX70LP's; maybe I can get help on all my portable audio issues here.

I have just replaced my RioRiot with the Creative Jukebox 3. I am overall very impressed with it. However, I agree with Peddler in that the RioRiot is the best sounding player period (short of the Intel Pocket Concert, which is no longer on the market). Before going on, let me say this:

I rip to wm8 @ 128kbps. I do extensive research on codecs, and I am given to understand that AAC is the best lossy encoder out there. I can't wait to use it, especially as I plan on ripping 5.1 music from my DVD's, and AAC is supposed to support this format. The only problem is that no one has a codec for portable devices yet. I've googled across references which state that Creative will release one soon, but I've asked support and they don't know (another issue).

Overall, the advantages of the JB3 far outweigh the disadvantages. One thing I loved about the Riot was that I could clip it on my belt and wander around hands free. I can't believe the JB3 doesn't come with a cover or clip. If anyone knows where I could find one, I would really appreciate it.

While I initially bought in to the argument posed by the Riot folks concerning USB connectivity only (How often will you be downloading 20GB after the first time?) I actually ended up doing this more than once while I worked out the nuances of ID3 tagging...

The Riot also crushes every other player I've tried with its "Moodlogic Engine", the way it keeps track of what you've played/haven't played, and it's ability to generate playlists.

One major piece of advice for potential JB3 buyers: Fork over an extra $25 and invest in Notmad. Trust me on this. The only thing I use Playcenter for is upgrading firmware on the JB3.

The battery life on the Riot was ATROCIOUS, rendering it useless for long trips. Yes, I applied the firmware upgrade but only saw a slight improvement.

By the way, I have the Audigy Platinum ex sound card on my PC. One feature I am sorely disappointed in is that I don't have the ability to associate an environmental preset to a song after ripping it on the pc, and having that preset automatically applied whenever the song is played on the JB3. They advertise EAX everywhere, but it is almost impossible to find configuration info on either the Creative or EAX sites... Also, they've just added a parametric equalizer feature (in the form of a customizable advanced equalization setting (as of last week) but I can't seem to make it work or at least notice the effect (again, if anyone knows otherwise, let me know). I've asked Creative support, and they pointed me to the documentation which merely mentions the feature without telling how to configure it. The presets are useful once you understand them, but if you have playlists with songs that benefit from different presets, switching back and forth manually is less than efficient.

The line outs are great, obviously as is the firewire support. The JB3 is the first jukebox I've tried (I've also tried the IPOD as well), that has a useful queuing feature (the ability to add a song to a playlist while another is playing). The dual removable battery feature is also very nice.

So, while I greatly prefer the JB3 to the other two jukeboxes I've mentioned, my last remaining issue is with the sound quality. I want it to sound as good as the Riot. Until I came here, I thought it may be either that I didn't fully understand how to properly use EAX, or that the JB3 wma codec simply isn't as good as that of the Riot. I am hoping that the AAC codec will solve this problem, but I now have my doubts.