[digitalcat]

FYI Xin was working on a mp3 player project a while ago, then the mini amp project bacame his priority and now we have the wonderful supermacro. I hope one day he'll be able to get back to it again.

 

[acklee]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsc3 The main reason that it won't get done is that everybody here is saying "it will never happen". The only thing that might make it happen is if some *individual* or *small* group just designs the thing and puts the spec out into the world to be freely built/modded.

That is a great attitude, and you're right, if people stopped to realize how difficult it was to do certain things, a lot of cool stuff would never have even started. If anyone here is willing to take a swing at this, more power to you. At the very least, you'd learn a ton.

 

[Edwood]

If you want it to be small and portable, that would be far far far more difficult.

But, perhaps modding/hacking another existing player would seem more feasible.

-Ed

 

[Edwood]

I have an old Archos Jukebox that would've been perfect for me if it was capable of decoding Lossless audio files like APE or FLAC. But it can't.

So it was two out of the three requirements I need.

1. Digital ouput.
2. Large HDD support
3. Lossless Audio File Support

-Ed

 

[uzziah]

Quote:

Originally Posted by IstariAsuka At least from my point of view you don't have to play catch-up. If all you wanted was a nice DAP, just get whatever is already out--there're several players that have MOST of the features one could want. If you want a DAP with a good amp, use a line-out and a portable amp. The problem is that there is no unit with a really good digital out. Except a PC. Seriously, from my perspective this would be just about the most ideal: HDD based, transportable, gapless, and high quality digital output. Most of the convenience and benefits of a computer hifi setup without the computer. In fact, it might be easiest to just leave out the analog step completely--or at least the internal amplifier part. Stuff like physical UI, GUI, all that stuff would only have to be minimally functional. Just enough to get the job done. At least for my vision.

that's exactly how i feel. in fact, i don't even want the line out capability. i just mentioned it because some might want it. personally, i'd rather not bother with the analog stage, as you say. then, as i say, piccolo's would be selling like hotcakes (aos, you reading??

), as well as diy dacs. yes, all i want is a clean low-jitter optical out (i.e. just a transport), with a large hard drive (better: choice of hard drive size and replacable).

 

[uzziah]

Quote:

Originally Posted by acklee It's not going to happen. You can open-source complex software projects and do reasonably well - there are hundreds of examples. But building a hardware device like a DAP would require all the below: 1) Hardware design, physical / electrical 2) Manufacturing (not the same as HW design) 3) Device firmware 4) PC software The killer is that all of these would need to be very tightly integrated. You're much better off trying to mod an existing device. Figure out how to boot the device into Linux (it's been done for the iPod), take it apart and solder in component upgrades, etc.

1. not impossible
2. big ass problem
3. doable
4. drap-and drop. no itunes. no sonicstage stuff. just drag and drop to hd. still a big ****ing problem

 

[uzziah]

well, this is exciting. i think it's very possible. not easy; definitely time consuming, demanding many different areas of expertise. my point is that i think we underrate ourselves. i think we have here (and for that matter, anyone reachable by the WWW), many who would be capable of such an undertaking. interest, not just in the theoretical idea, but in the actual design, would be the question. i think this is a worthy topic of discussion though. it's easy to sit back and think "the big businesses have this and this and this and we don't." I think we do ourselves a disservice by thinking that way. we are very strong together.

to me, it comes down to:

1. is it worth it:
a. to save money? (doubtful)
b. to create a quality line out (i see the difficulty of this and still maintain a small device)
c. quality digital out: how many would really want to spend the $ and extra weight/space to carry a dap, dac, amp, and phones?
d. perhaps the best reason of all: open source diy: i.e. the ability to constantly expand/customize/tailor to one's specific needs. look at the amplifiers put out by tangent, morsel, ppl and the like, just to name one group. these are some of the best audiophile components we have, and they are made by diy'ers

i'm really encouraged and surprised by the responses here. i think the person above me made a very accurate point referencing linus' work. this is not a short-term idea. i don't think anyone is willing to drop everything right now and start programming/designing (maybe? maybe?

we'd love you forever). rather, i think the devolopment could be somewhat like linux. individuals adding their own talents and ideas to the project slowly. i think it's safe to say, don't start saving for the headfi dap (dap-fi?), don't neglect getting a currently available dap, but hell, we really could do this; if we wanted to.

 

[jsc3]

Quote:

Originally Posted by uzziah 1. not impossible 2. big ass problem 3. doable 4. drap-and drop. no itunes. no sonicstage stuff. just drag and drop to hd. still a big ****ing problem

What?! Drag and drop to HD is a problem? That is about the easiest part - there are plenty of USB-to-IDE bridge sets out there, if you wanted to, you could have a selector (hardware switch or software menu choice) that put the DAP into USB storage mode, and it would just appear as a disk drive to any Windows PC (or Mac, or Linux box, or Sun SPARC, or whatever). No software on the PC required - even Windows 98 with the USB patch can do this.

 

[jsc3]

I think one mistake everybody is making is to think they need to have the whole thing done in the first go. It doesn't work that way, even in business - they usually don't show you the first go, or even the tenth version.

The first step is to get something working minimally. This is then something to build on. Trying to design the whole thing from the start is not the way to do it - you are going to change your mind about how to do things several times before the finished product is ready. The best thing to do is design something easy to change. Then start changing it (and don't get to offended if others take the idea and make different changes you don't like - just let them go their own way, and if everybody else follows them, even consider doing that too).

Once a prototype is ready, then different versions can be built optimized for portability, additional functionality, etc.

 

[viator122]

If the goal of the project is to get a DAP with all the features the audiophile community wants, why not just work with what is out there? For example, there has been talk of the possibility of modifying an iPod to give it a digital out. So you do that, you modify the firmware to include gapless support, you create a no-messing-around EQ, drop in one of those super duper aftermarket batteries and you're all set. Or do it with a Karma, Zen Touch or NJB3.

But if the goal is to do this just for the sake of doing it, I don't see why it should be impossible, it just might take a long time and might not be worth it.

 

[ILikeMusic]

You guys are making this too complicated... all you would need to do is repackage an existing player, put up a web site with a bunch of pseudoscientific mumbo jumbo ('this player is oxygen free!') and off you go... I guarantee you'd have an amazing number of people attesting to how much better they sound.

 

[Mr Iriver]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ILikeMusic You guys are making this too complicated... all you would need to do is repackage an existing player, put up a web site with a bunch of pseudoscientific mumbo jumbo ('this player is oxygen free!') and off you go... I guarantee you'd have an amazing number of people attesting to how much better they sound.

I like that idea, however it would be illegal to sell a product with an operating system created by another company without their permission. It would be cool to take out the Hardware of the very small archos GMINIxs200, and then built in an amp like say a xin supermicro. The results would en up being an XS200 with maybe the size of an ipod or Iriver, which are both small, but with a powerfull amp for a portable.