[JMCIII]

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreatDane /img/forum/go_quote.gif Was that an error? Do you mean that it's "far better" than headphone out?

Yep. My bad. Thanks for pointing it out.

 

[JMCIII]

Quote:

Originally Posted by montell /img/forum/go_quote.gif That is simply untrue. The LOD does not bypass the ipods amplifier as it takes the same path as the headphone out (it leaves the DAC (read Amplifier) and then runs through the exact same bunch of circuits). The only difference is that the headphone out is volume controlled whereas the LOD is not. Your statement wouldnt make much sense at all since you can get a strong enough signal from the HPO using the volume control. As strong enough and maybe even stronger as the LOD. It is simply wrong what you are saying. There was even a test by some guy here on head-fi (forgot his name) that basicly confirms that the HPO produces the same signal as the LOD. You can do a seach on the forums for the terms ipod and headphone out. Also there would absolutely be no need for DIY mods or an iMod. I hope you are familiar with such mods. If the LOD bypasses the "internal amplifier" then how come the signal is as loud as the the volume controled HPO? If it doesnt use an amplifier (the name already says it: AMPLIFy) then wouldnt you get a pathetic weak sound?

Ah, no. Using an LOD you DO bypass the cheap internal amp of the iPod. How can you tell? Try using the volume control with a LOD - it doesn't work. Why, because you're not using the amp section of the iPod.

Think of it this way, if you plugged your CD player directly into your amp (which is sort of what you're doing via the LOD), you'd get a very powerful signal. Plug it into an integrated amp (with its volume control) and you have exactly what you'd get runing an iPod with a LOD. The integrated now not only amplifiys the signal, but controls that output as well. Hence why you run the LOD to an external amp.

 

[deeplove]

I like the LOD on the iPod. On my car, I've tried both the LOD and headphone out and you can tell the difference. To me it's a cleaner sound. I have no hissing problems or such. It does come out a bit bright, but it sounds great. I'm happy with Apple and ripping music to lossless is as simple as just popping the CD in. Literally. I'm going for my 2nd iPod, a nano.

 

[darkfury18]

Quote:

Originally Posted by montell /img/forum/go_quote.gif The headphone is essentially the same as the lineout dock. In essense you could get an exact same lineout signal from the headphone out but in reality it would be incredibly hard since the volume control on iPods are not discretized. The pathways when they leave the DAC are exactly the same. Hence there are DIY mods for ipods to tap directly into to the ipods DAC and sending that signal through your amp. Bypassing all the internal circuits in your ipod. Thats basicly the essense

I just checked of of your previous posts and found the head-fier that you were referencing and his thread, iPod 5G: Amping Headphone-Out vs Line-Out.

Well, I was curious to his findings so I took out my diyMod nano 1G and did what he said. Moved the volume to 5 notches below max and fed it into my mini3, listening to it with a modded iM716 (recabled with 68R). Maybe it was just the nano, or my amp, but all I can say is that I hear a lot of distortion/clipping and in no way comparable to the output of the diyMod. Maybe someone with a 5G can give it a shot, because even in that thread only the OP achieved the results he posted.

ipod + LOD = Good? (Yup)

 

[montell]

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkfury18 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I just checked of of your previous posts and found the head-fier that you were referencing and his thread, iPod 5G: Amping Headphone-Out vs Line-Out. Well, I was curious to his findings so I took out my diyMod nano 1G and did what he said. Moved the volume to 5 notches below max and fed it into my mini3, listening to it with a modded iM716 (recabled with 68R). Maybe it was just the nano, or my amp, but all I can say is that I hear a lot of distortion/clipping and in no way comparable to the output of the diyMod. Maybe someone with a 5G can give it a shot, because even in that thread only the OP achieved the results he posted. ipod + LOD = Good? (Yup)

Could be your cable. You could have used a higher quality cable for the LOD and a lower quality for the HPO. It could also be your diyMod. You probally wired your LOD directly to your DAC while the HPO is still the same old same old... I definately think the later. I'm not a genius on these sort of things...

I'm just basing this on the facts made in that thread and my experience with minidisc players. The majority of the minidisc players have a combined HPO and line-out jack. There was an option to switch to lineout or headphone out in the menu.

 

[darkfury18]

I made both the the LOD and the interconnect using Jupiter 26awg cryo wire, so I'm fairly sure it's not the cable.

The clipping/distortion is caused by the internal amplifier getting saturated. Do you even have an ipod to back up what you're saying?

Right now you're just taking the word of one man when hundreds/thousands of people on this forum acknowledges that they can hear a difference between the ipod's line out and HP out.

 

[montell]

I dont know how you modded your ipod but if you did it like in the diy section then you wired the signal coming out from DAC to the LOD. Ofcourse you'll get a different signal then. Hence that was what the mod is for...

You should try it with unmodded ipods.

 

[nick_charles]

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkfury18 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I made both the the LOD and the interconnect using Jupiter 26awg cryo wire, so I'm fairly sure it's not the cable. The clipping/distortion is caused by the internal amplifier getting saturated. Do you even have an ipod to back up what you're saying? Right now you're just taking the word of one man when hundreds/thousands of people on this forum acknowledges that they can hear a difference between the ipod's line out and HP out.

I have a 5G iPod I did an experiment comparing the lineout and the headphone out. I connected the lineout and heaphone out to a passive switch box then connected the output of the switch box to a Nikko Amp Aux input and thence to some JBL Bookshelf speakers or AKG K240s. I was able to do instant switching, making sure the iPOD was on full volume.

I switched between the two many many times.

They sounded absolutely identical to me , if there was a difference it was so small I could not hear it.

I posted this result months ago yet strangely it was completely ignored.

Both ways sounded tickety boo.

 

[darkfury18]

Hmm .. I don't know what's going on then... cause on the nano, they don't sound the same.

Does anyone in the US have a 5G and want to contribute? Cause in the other thread, it was also a UK ipod where the HP/LOD sounded the same.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BluePhone /img/forum/go_quote.gif bangraman, I have read the results of your headphone/line-out comparative tests with some interest. Curious as to whether or not I could replicate your results, I did a few tests of my own. I plugged the Stax SRM-001/SR-001MK2 directly into the headphones jack. I have to report that with regard to the headphone amping, my results do not quite tally with your findings. I found that when I backed off the volume 5 notches from full volume on my 5G iPod the volume was only about half that of the line-out. Even with the headphone volume set to it's maximum mark, it was still less than the line-out. I am still at a loss to explain why this should be so. The only reason I can think is that my iPod's headphone volume has been "limited" to comply with European guidelines. I did find that amping the line-out of the Universal Dock produced a finer/thinner sound - less full - than the SendStation PockDock. In light of this, I wonder if it is at all possible to draw any general - universally applicable - conclusions with regard to headphone vs line-out amping of the 5G iPod.

 

[shigzeo]

again, the ipod hpo is not bad at all, certainly above the average and most people have no idea what good is anyway since is usually means effects or eq like in iaudio (more bass roll off and less separation than ipod).

amping the hpo should render good results: unloads the hpo to make as good a signal as possible. i think that the argument posed in 2006 by the bangraman is good in a way: it opened up the thought that the ipod actually has a decent hpo. it has a one or two bad apples and that was it.

 

[bigshot]

The main difference between iPod generations is the quality of the headphone out. My 3G has a slight but noticeable difference in quality in A/B comparison. The difference is much less on each successive generation.

See ya
Steve

 

[skyd171]

dammit. i just wasted 15 bucks on an LOD cable.

 

[Spadge]

I just got my LOD today and paired my Xin Supermini-III and Nano 3G with it.

Sweet sound

Definately better than the straight headphone out. Not sure if it is better than the headphone out amped.

I currently have an ear infection so it's a little hard to listen to subtle differences.

Paul

 

[skyd171]

your comparison is moot if you compare LOD + amp to HPO without an amp. but good thing the sound is nice anyways =D

 

[Spadge]

I have compared all three.

I can definately tell that the LOD + Amp is better than HPO

However the difference between HPO + AMP and LOD + AMP is more subtle. After spending a little more time listening I can now tell the LOD + AMP is cleaner and 'smoother' sounding, but the difference isn't HUGE. Soundstage is also better with LOD+amp by a noticable margin.

Paul