[pp312]

  I picked up the T1s for around AUD 740.00 (included shipping and no other fees), so from my POV a real bargain.  
 

 
I assume you're talking used here. But even at that price, which is certainly pretty good, wouldn't you say the T1 is overpriced? I've read a number of reviews now and what comes through most clearly, as in yours, is the sense that overall the difference is not immense--which, given that we're in a forum where hyperbole usually runs rampant, especially from those who've just parked out $1000+, is rather telling. 
 
Not saying there's not a noticeable, even significant improvement; just that there's an interesting lack of those "blows the 880 out of the water" type comments you'd normally expect. My sense is not that the T1 especially lacks anything but rather that the 880 is if anything somewhat underpriced. After all, you can't buy an HD650 for less than $400, and I sold my 650 for the 880.

 

[0MoUsE0]

Beyerdynamic really did very well on the positional accuracy !
 
I have a T70p, and it did perform very well in gaming !

 

[Mani ATH 87]

   
I assume you're talking used here. But even at that price, which is certainly pretty good, wouldn't you say the T1 is overpriced? I've read a number of reviews now and what comes through most clearly, as in yours, is the sense that overall the difference is not immense--which, given that we're in a forum where hyperbole usually runs rampant, especially from those who've just parked out $1000+, is rather telling. 
 
Not saying there's not a noticeable, even significant improvement; just that there's an interesting lack of those "blows the 880 out of the water" type comments you'd normally expect. My sense is not that the T1 especially lacks anything but rather that the 880 is if anything somewhat underpriced. After all, you can't buy an HD650 for less than $400, and I sold my 650 for the 880.

 
This is personally why I've never made the leap from mid range to summit fi. I think the best "bang for your buck" comes from headphones in the 200-500 dollar range (just generally speaking). As is the case with this review, and many reviews comparing mid level headphones (300-500 dollars) to high level (800+ dollars) I personally don't feel the increased value, or dollar amount, is worth the upgrade in sound quality. Everyone has a different view on this of course, to some even minor improvements are worth the extra spending. But I happy with the range I'm in and don't expect to go anywhere.

 

[earfonia]

  Use to listen to beyer T1 but I find that it sounds quite muddy compare to audio technica flagships (known for crystal clear sound) , and I think could be due to the stock cable from what i read from  those that change the cable. I do find the cable and headphone plug short of low quality considering its price.
 
Anyway I reckon that Beyer T1 is ripe for new update after been around for almost 5 years.  I am expecting Beyer T2 for 2 tesla

, and that will surely  top the game.
Akg 812 and Fostex th900 already reached 1.5 tesla and I am amazed at their stunning clear sound. Imagine how 2 tesla headphone will sound like.

 
Since I reviewed T1 in Headfonia in 2010, till today, this is the first time I heard someone saying that T1 sounds muddy in comparison of audio technica flagships (what model?). I had W1000X Grandioso for a couple of years, heard W3000 for a few days, also auditioned all the famous Audio Technica AD series up to AD2000. Whatever the comparison, even with my HD800, IMHO T1 never sounds muddy.  Less bright maybe, but not at the level of muddy.  One possibility is the recording you heard is super muddy that it requires extra treble boost to sound natural.
 
And how did you analyze the T1 cable and the Neutrik plug, that make you think they are low in quality?
 
I know there are many plugs and cables that cost much much more than the T1 cable and Neutrik plug, but higher price tag is no guarantee that the product is higher in quality. I believe there are better cables out there, but still it doesn't qualify T1 cable and Neutrik plug are low in quality.
 
FYI, this is a cut out of my T1 cable, compared to Shure 1840 and 1540 cables. I cut them when I terminated them with 4 pin XLR (not the 1540 cable).  Much better conductor than the Shure cables.
I know Shure cables cannot be considered high-end cable, maybe more in the standard category cable. But I consider T1 cable is a good quality cable, by observing the build quality and the sound quality.
 

 

[Brooko]

I assume you're talking used here. But even at that price, which is certainly pretty good, wouldn't you say the T1 is overpriced? I've read a number of reviews now and what comes through most clearly, as in yours, is the sense that overall the difference is not immense--which, given that we're in a forum where hyperbole usually runs rampant, especially from those who've just parked out $1000+, is rather telling. 

Not saying there's not a noticeable, even significant improvement; just that there's an interesting lack of those "blows the 880 out of the water" type comments you'd normally expect. My sense is not that the T1 especially lacks anything but rather that the 880 is if anything somewhat underpriced. After all, you can't buy an HD650 for less than $400, and I sold my 650 for the 880.

Good questions.

The T1 I bought was used but I would describe the condition as "like new". I'm also not much given to hyperbole - and I try to keep a sense of realism and perspective when reviewing or comparing. So yes the two have similar signatures - but you'll notice that a couple of times I did mention phrases that should indicate my views.

I once mentioned that the difference between the two was "not subtle", and also that it was hard switching back to the DT880 after listening to a track with the T1.

For my personal tastes, the jump in sonics is worth the price. I definitely won't be going back. And it's not about any perceived status or anything. I sold the HD700 recently because I felt the HD600 was a better match to my preferences. This time the T1 reigns. And yes I think it's definitely worth the price I paid.

 

[FangJoker]

  Use to listen to beyer T1 but I find that it sounds quite muddy compare to audio technica flagships (known for crystal clear sound) , and I think could be due to the stock cable from what i read from  those that change the cable. I do find the cable and headphone plug short of low quality considering its price.
 
Anyway I reckon that Beyer T1 is ripe for new update after been around for almost 5 years.  I am expecting Beyer T2 for 2 tesla

, and that will surely  top the game.
Akg 812 and Fostex th900 already reached 1.5 tesla and I am amazed at their stunning clear sound. Imagine how 2 tesla headphone will sound like.

 
 
The T1 isn't muddy at all imho.  Now if you want to talk about muddy bass that is the HD650.  I couldn't live with the muddy slow bass on the music that I like so I sold the HD650 immediately.  The modded T1 was unbelievable and not even broken in yet.  But I have developed major neck issues so I'm not sitting a lot and lying down a lot more which is the only reason why I've gone the IEM route.  I hate that the IEM market seems overpriced to me when comparing IEM  and headphones in similar price ranges.  

 

[62ohm]

 

  I picked up the T1s for around AUD 740.00 (included shipping and no other fees), so from my POV a real bargain.  
 

 
I assume you're talking used here. But even at that price, which is certainly pretty good, wouldn't you say the T1 is overpriced? I've read a number of reviews now and what comes through most clearly, as in yours, is the sense that overall the difference is not immense--which, given that we're in a forum where hyperbole usually runs rampant, especially from those who've just parked out $1000+, is rather telling. 
 
Not saying there's not a noticeable, even significant improvement; just that there's an interesting lack of those "blows the 880 out of the water" type comments you'd normally expect. My sense is not that the T1 especially lacks anything but rather that the 880 is if anything somewhat underpriced. After all, you can't buy an HD650 for less than $400, and I sold my 650 for the 880.

 
It's all just a matter of perspective, some strive for bang-for-the-buck, and some strive for utmost performance. Even if the difference between the DT880 and the T1 may not be really substantial, sometimes the small details, those small difference are what distinguishes the mediocre and the exceptional. I've heard the DT880 before, and even though at that point of time I was still using the Q701 I was not utterly impressed by the DT880. But I am impressed by the T1, impressed enough that I eventually pulled the trigger on a pair of them even with the HD800 on hand.

 

[pp312]

Yes, I appreciate that it's the details that make the difference, but one thing Brooko did say, which I've read before, is that without direct comparison to the T1 the 880 sounded fine in its own right, which I guess is as much as to say that if you never hear the T1 you may happily live with the 880 in ignorant bliss ever after. And probably until the T1 drops to around $400 or hell freezes over, whichever comes first, that's what I'll be doing.
 
I wouldn't mind hearing it, I admit, but then I might be putting myself in the way of temptation. Also, and here's the rub, I'm 67 years old, and much of what I listen to is MP3--not necessarily 320kps either. A T1 for me could be throwing pearls before swine.  
 
Just as an aside, I listened to a piano concerto last night that on the HD650, and even to an extent on the LCD-2, had always seemed harsh to the point of unlistenable. On the 880 it was much better--quite enjoyable. I believe this is due to the dip in the 880s response, shared with the T1, between 1khz and around 5khz. I think such a dip is preferable for classical, even if it takes out some detail and a little punch from the sound. Listener fatigue with classical in particular is anathema. Better to lose a little definition than be wincing every few seconds.

 

[Brooko]

The DT880 are very good with piano concertos - and when I made the comparison I think a lot had to do with the fact that focus is on one instrument.  As soon as there is contrast (especially with strings), the T1 strides out in front (superior imaging and separation).
 
And I agree with you Paul - the DT880 is one heck of a bargain - especially if you haven't heard the T1.  The problem is that once you've heard the T1 for an extended period, it is kind of hard to go back to the DT880.  It still doesn't diminish the DT880's strengths as an incredibly well priced headphone though.  On the value stakes (along with the HD600) there are few that can compete.

 

[MrEleventy]

The DT880 are very good with piano concertos - and when I made the comparison I think a lot had to do with the fact that focus is on one instrument.  As soon as there is contrast (especially with strings), the T1 strides out in front (superior imaging and separation).

And I agree with you Paul - the DT880 is one heck of a bargain - especially if you haven't heard the T1.  The problem is that once you've heard the T1 for an extended period, it is kind of hard to go back to the DT880.  It still doesn't diminish the DT880's strengths as an incredibly well priced headphone though.  On the value stakes (along with the HD600) there are few that can compete.

+1

 

[earfonia]

  The DT880 are very good with piano concertos - and when I made the comparison I think a lot had to do with the fact that focus is on one instrument.  As soon as there is contrast (especially with strings), the T1 strides out in front (superior imaging and separation).
 
And I agree with you Paul - the DT880 is one heck of a bargain - especially if you haven't heard the T1.  The problem is that once you've heard the T1 for an extended period, it is kind of hard to go back to the DT880.  It still doesn't diminish the DT880's strengths as an incredibly well priced headphone though.  On the value stakes (along with the HD600) there are few that can compete.

+1
DT880 maybe the sweetest sounding bright headphones I ever heard. I admit it's colored and it's bright, but not offensive bright. It's those transparent and airy bright that is musical and enjoyable. The opposite of Ultrasone Edition 10 kind of brightness.
 

 
T1 is more natural sounding, less colored.  
 
That's the beauty of headphones.  While with speaker system most probably we will stuck with one type of sound signature for a long time, with headphones we can easily switch sound signature that suits our moods and recordings 

 

 

[pp312]

  The problem is that once you've heard the T1 for an extended period, it is kind of hard to go back to the DT880.  

 
Blast you, Brooko. You're eating away my resistance to the T1 bit by bit, undermining in the process my certainty that I need go no higher than the 880. It's cruelty, I tell you. Cruelty to dumb animals.

 
@earfonia: thanks for posting that review of Tyll's. I wonder if the Ultrasone Edition 10 is really that bad or if Tyll was simply honing his thespian skills.

 

[earfonia]

@earfonia: thanks for posting that review of Tyll's. I wonder if the Ultrasone Edition 10 is really that bad or if Tyll was simply honing his thespian skills.

I tried Edition 10 in a local shop, I think Tyll was not acting

 

[baronkatz]

  Yes, I appreciate that it's the details that make the difference, but one thing Brooko did say, which I've read before, is that without direct comparison to the T1 the 880 sounded fine in its own right, which I guess is as much as to say that if you never hear the T1 you may happily live with the 880 in ignorant bliss ever after. 

There's always a betterment or perfection to strive to. Living in ignorant bliss can be had even with Dre by Beats or some other horrible cans. It's probably the same things most Bose and Beats listeners are saying...
 

 
@earfonia: thanks for posting that review of Tyll's. I wonder if the Ultrasone Edition 10 is really that bad or if Tyll was simply honing his thespian skills.

I actually liked it. Maybe one of the few that did, granted I only listened for 30 seconds or so. I liked it better than my Edition 8s which were closed back and not as nice. I think that Beyer does an overall more natural presentation than Ultrasone. Ultrasone is better for bassheads and DJ's, Beyer for everyone else... Ultrasone focuses more on design, Beyer more on ultimate sound quality for a lower cost... There's a reason why most sound engineers, masterers, recording artists, etc.. choose Beyers usually the T770 and DT880 from what I have seen actually!

 

[pp312]

 

  Yes, I appreciate that it's the details that make the difference, but one thing Brooko did say, which I've read before, is that without direct comparison to the T1 the 880 sounded fine in its own right, which I guess is as much as to say that if you never hear the T1 you may happily live with the 880 in ignorant bliss ever after. 

There's always a betterment or perfection to strive to. Living in ignorant bliss can be had even with Dre by Beats or some other horrible cans. It's probably the same things most Bose and Beats listeners are saying...
 

 
Eek! What a horrible picture you paint, the idea that DT880 lovers may be as deluded as Beats lovers. I'm going to put it firmly out of my mind and go have a nice hot cup of coffee.
 
Deluded indeed! My psychiatrist assures me I'm fine as long as I keep taking the medication....