[Canman]

Comparison of the big guns: HD-600 vs. RS-1

I know, I know this subject has probably been beaten to death. But I wanted to post my opinion of these two classic phones as part of my introduction to Head-Fi. I also wanted to write a good comparison for people just starting out to help them find the sound that makes them groove. And hey that’s what this is all about. I think Head-Fi is an awesome community for all us Can fanatics. Thanks for reading.

First of all, I will cut to the chase. I ended up preferring my HD-600 headphones over the RS-1 with my equipment. These are two fine classy phones with a very different sound signature. One is not necessarily better than the other, I think at this level it comes down to personal preference. I will go into depth why the good old Senn’s are my choice for sitting down and getting into a listening session.

Associated Equipment:
I did all critical listening with a California Audio Labs Mk 2 CD player. Old but good, this player has good dynamics and a reasonable amount of depth. I consider its tonal balance to be slightly forward but not bright (for this reason it may not be the best match for the Grado’s—something really smooth like the Meridian 506 or 508 would do nicely here—if anyone wants to lend me one for a follow up e-mail me

). Amp is the fine Gilmore Dynamic V2. This amp is new to me and it is the best headphone amp I have heard to date. So smooth and so nice…Justin did a hell of a job on this piece. It looks very professional and parts quality seems to be first rate (ALPS pot, dale resistors, etc). I’m not going to get into a review on this piece (maybe in the future) but this amp is well up to driving these two fine phones. Interconnect used was standard zip cord. I didn’t have access to any decent cables at the time so they will have to do for now.

Background equipment

I just want to go through some of the audio equipment I know pretty well and that I either currently own or owned in the past few years.

Cans I own: Sennheiser HD-600 (stock cable), HD414 (from the early 1970’s), Grado RS-1, Grado SR-60, Sony Streetstyle. I mainly use the 600 at home for critical listening and the grado SR-60 with my portable cd player, and the Sony’s with my MP3 player for biking.

Cans I am familiar with: I have owned the Grado HP-1 and the comparison with the RS-1 is an interesting one. Bottom line is the HP-1 betters the RS-1 in almost every aspect in my opinion except for comfort. Notably, the HP-1’s are much more accurate and neutral than the RS-1. I suppose has to do with its being marketed as a studio monitor. I sold the HP-1’s a few years back(WHY???) because they are so dang uncomfortable. Imagine heavy chunks of aluminum on the side of your head. I have not heard the good Sony’s/beyer/AKG so no comparison there.

Look/feel

Grado RS-1. Oh mama, when I opened up that fine wood box I couldn’t do anything but stare. This is one classy phone. These headphones are chick magnets. OK, so they would be if I wore them outside. The leather headband and mahogany cups are very nice to touch. The RS-1 is really not very comfortable though. They are surprisingly light but the supra-aural design is nothing like being ensconced in Sennheiser black velvet.

The HD-600’s are nothing crazy to look at (no space alien like antennas a la HP-1) but the carbon fibre/plastic/velvet is a nice package. Oh so comfortable but a crappy connecting cord. I’ll have to try out the Cardas one of these days.

The Sound

The Sennheiser HD-600
This is by far the most important part. I am very used to the Sennheiser’s detailed, tight, laid back sound. There is never audible distortion produced by the drivers, but I think there is still room for improvement. The tonal balance suffers slightly from the ‘veil’ that is commonly associated with the Sennheiser brand. I think this is caused by a darkness in the upper midrange. Still, the HD-600’s are quite neutral and accurate. Attack and decay of notes is lighting fast so things never sound muddy and congested passages are always resolved with ease, which is why I like to do critical listening on my headphones rather than speakers. They respond well to changes in equipment which leads me to believe that you will have to spend a lot of money on upgrades to find the absolute best these headphones can reproduce. Like I mentioned before, that Cardas headphone cable is high on my list to audition. One of my favorite characteristics of this phone is the spatial integrity. Instruments are presented with a realistic soundstage that is not only side-to-side but front to back. Instruments are defined in the soundstage so well that I have discovered on long known recordings that hey, there are two guitar tracks on this recording, not just one! Such is the fun with these headphones.

Grado RS-1
I am new to these headphones but I am familiar with the Grado tonal balance from the SR-60 so I do not think it is too soon to write about them. These headphones really shine for me in one area: classical music. I am listening to one of Stereophile’s solo piano tunes right now off their demo disc 3. The Sennheisers may be more accurate, but with the Grado’s its more about the emotion of the music coming through rather than the details. The piano sounded really smooth and realistic – HUGE – through the Grado cans. Female voices also sound fantastic. The midrange is very natural sounding. Now the bad news. These headphones are neither neutral nor accurate. I find that the midbass is slightly muddy and the sound is very forward so it has the tendency to sound much brighter than the Sennheiser. Not shrill by any means, just don’t match it up with bright sounding equipment or cables (I would recommend Tara labs or maybe Cardas, over faster sounding cables like Kimber or Nordost). I find that the Sennheisers present much more inner detail, although sometimes at the expense of sounding analytical in respect to the Grado.


The choice is made

Both of these phones are awesome, but it is ultimately the Sennheisers that make me groove. I don’t listen much to what the Grado does best (classical and vocal). The Sennheisers more detailed and spatial sound, more accurate representation of what is on the disc, and greater comfort lead to choose them over the Grado. And this is before taking cost into account---the Sennheiser’s are way cheaper. I would definitely recommend trying both of these for yourself because both headphones are fantastic and everyone has different preferences.

I know this posting is long but I hope it is of some help to those who are in search of audio nirvana. Enjoy the music.

–Canman
(Brian)

 

[Rizumu]

Thanks for the comparison, you did a very nice job (resists alluding to a certain other RS-1 review that will remain unnamed).

I've owned the HD580's and can't say I cared too much for them. They were good headphones don't get me wrong, and beautiful for classical, but they weren't for me They just sort of sat in a drawer while I used my other phones. The exaggerated soundstage and laid-back, veiled sound didn't do much for me. They sounded far too murky with rock. I'm sure the HD600's with a cable upgrade would help this, but I still think the right headphone for me will be found elsewhere.

Having said that I'm mainly looking to the RS-1's as I can plan on saving up for them and know that I'll be able to buy a pair (unlike HP1000's which fluctuate a lot in price and are infrequently sold). Your comments seem to echo those made previously by others. I know that the RS-1's won't touch the HP-1's neutrality but I'm still willing to take a shot with them

Your descriptions of how pianos and vocals sound on the RS-1 make me excited.

If nothing else....mmmm.....sexy wood

Again, great job and welcome to head-fi

 

[purk]

Great job on the review. I never had a chance of owning or auditioned the RS-1, but I had the SR-225 for awhile. If you love the Senn HD-600, you must give the Cardas cable a try. I highly recommend the Cardas to the Clou Blue/Red. The room for improvments will be very narrow with the upgraded cable.


Purk

 

[jibra]

One good point about piano! Canman.

I know in many cases people are taliking about Senn HD-600 for classical music. But piano just sounds much more exciting with my RS-2 compared to Senn HD 600. I am not talking about a piano concerto but a piano sonata.

Jibra

 

[Howie]

I don't have much experience with other headphones and I'm not sure whether a stock HD600 is in fact the best buy. But with the Cardas headphone cable and a good interconnect (good source and amp too of course) I doubt anyone would consider them to be "veiled". It's very much grain free in my opinion. There's an ease to its reproduction of music that I like very much. That doesn't mean they're not dynamic. They are just non fatiguing. Definitely a pair of headphones you can keep and be happy with for a long time. Knowing that you can upgrade the headphones by swapping out the headphone cable should be considered a plus rather than a negative.

 

[Beagle]

Very well done Canman!

I find that comparison between headphones such as these is more a matter of the portrayal of a different perspective/position that one would encounter when listening to live unamplified music, as opposed to the phones being right/wrong/accurate. The Grado would be a position in front of the musicians, the Sennheiser a little further back. Either can be thrilling.

 

[bangraman]

Unsure if the Grados are more suited to vocals and classical compared to the HD600... But my specific memories of the 600 are fading away.
And CHICK MAGNETS? Only if chicks like a guy with two doorknobs sitting on his ears...

 

[Canman]

Hey bangraman, I really like the warmth and depth that the RS-1 gives classical and vocals. This makes them very pleasing to listen to. Even though I think the RS-1's are colored they are so darned natural with acoustic instruments and voices. I like them with my 1960's jazz recordings liek Jimmy Smith and Miles Davis too.

 

[Sean H]

Very nice Canman! Well, I guess my inquiry to you in PM yesterday sure answers my question! Very nice review of them.

As I said, I have a pair of RS-1's coming and will be comparing them to my HD600/Equinox paired with the Gilmore V2 as well. As I said, I have been a little disappointed with the V2/HD600 pairing, with criticism mainly of the bass and treble areas finding them slightly dry and anemic. So far using my SR-60's has proved better as they have really thrown me into the groove of the music better, I feel bored with the HD600's. However, with Classical the HD600's/Gilmore is very nice indeed.

I'll post some comparisons of the two as well.

 

[Guyferd]

I prefer rs-1 much more than senn hd600

 

[bangraman]

Ah, now I see it Canman. They're certainly not that fatiguing (apart from the design... pad chop makes them better in this regard).
Sean H, I think they'll be what you want. The HD600's are relatively docile phones. The RS-1's are much more dynamic, jumping-around phones. Good fun.


Off topic slightly, but the more I hear about the Gilmore V2's sound the more I'm thinking they're more or less how I've tuned my main amp. Better or not I don't know... But cool and tight, would that be correct?

 

[scottpaul_iu]

Quote:

Originally posted by Guyferd I prefer rs-1 much more than senn hd600

Seconded. I could never quite get into the HD600s when I had them no matter what I did to them. You know change the headphone cord, roll tubes, switch amps, switch cables. So in the end I decided that they were just not for me and away they went.

 

[Sean H]

Hi bangraman- Well, I'm hoping they are. I feel stupid saying it but I actually listen to my SR-60's more than my HD600/Equinox. Thing is I once loved the HD600's when I had them paired with a Wheatfield HA-1 tube amp about a year ago. I like the HD600's, they are great cans, but I'm not grooving on their pairing with the Gilmore V2. I'm inbetween sources right now, using a Sonica, but was using a $2k CDP before it and still was not happy. I personally am getting the feeling the Gilmore, which by the way Kevin Gilmore designed around Grado's, seems to like the lower impedance despite it's powerful design. The lowly SR60's just sound full, fast and fun. the HD600's have sounded anemic and dry. Sure, I hear their differences in refinement, the HD600's better depth of stage and all, but I feel sleepy with them paired with the Gilmore.

I'm going to be experimenting with a Musical Fidelity X10-D tube buffer in the chain right after the bufferless output Sonica (which really is an excellent little DAC) that I bought from Hirsch which may prove to be a great little thing for my front end for now. I have not given up on the HD600's yet. I am extremely excited to hear the RS-1 as I think they might be an excellent pairing with the Gilmore V2. Let me ask you, do you find the RS-1 has a decent stage, is it decently layered? I do tend to look for soundstage with Jazz or Classical, but then again the SR60's aren't staging phones but their groove really sweeps me into the music and I don't care about staging. I was more inclined to want the visuals and imaging when I was into two channel, but more and more I'll take whatever it is that simply involves me in the music. I'm getting the inclination the RS-1's will do that. I listen to Ambient/electronic, Jazz (Smooth and traditional), Classical and vocals.

EDIt: Oh, and about the V2- I find it to be a great amp, great bass, smooth, excellent resolution, great dynamics and balanced tonally. I find it extremely revealing however, very transparent, wide open through the mids on up. Careful matching is required with the Gilmore in my view, even when using a forgiving can like the HD600. I'm very happy with it.

 

[bangraman]

Not that stupid. Amp fuzziness aside, the HD600's are very docile and refined phones. Rock phones these are not. They weren't my taste either which is why I got rid of them eventually, but a minute's sampling with the Cardas cable did promise tantalising (or misleading? Charlotte Church is hardly the best way to judge whether a phone would provide great dynamics... And next time we have a UK head-fi meet, I'm choosing the music

) taste of possibilities.


I've never felt that Grados (60/80/325/1) provide great staging. Good in some cases, but never great. But having made the effort to drive these things properly, the RS-1's are great foot-tappers and 'lost in the music' phones, especially with a pair of DIY or vwap pads...


...If you haven't made the same effort with anything better.


And that's where my W2002 comes in. Consider me biased. Compared to the W2002, the RS-1 is somewhat Fisher-Price in both sound (although it's superior in dynamics, but the 2002 has enough for me to be happy) and design/construction.


Once again slightly off topic, but you guys are totally tipping me over the edge towards the Gilmores... Naughty.

 

[Davie]

Thanks for the impressions, Canman. They reinforce my positive impressions of the HD600s from the recent NYC meet.

I particularly like what you say about spatial integrity and lack of congestion. Those are good phrases to describe what I like about the Senn HD280pros also, and what keeps me returning to them 280s inspite of their other drawbacks (somewhat dry, hollow sound and lack of bass warmth). I find with the 280s that you feel that instruments are all placed clearly and separately, without sounding unblended. It sounds like that describes the 600s also.