CHORD ELECTRONICS DAVE

[ubs28]

What does negative and positive output phase do? The manual offers no explanation and I also tried searching.
 
Which of the 2 settings sounds best by the way?

 

[theveterans]

What does negative and positive output phase do? The manual offers no explanation and I also tried searching.

Which of the 2 settings sounds best by the way?

It's for the low frequencies if I recall it's especially useful when you hear that the sound out of the subwoofer seems detached to the loudspeakers. Changing the phase to opposite can make the sound of the subwoofer in sync to the rest of the frequencies.

 

[Nik]

The phase (polarity) inverter you need to set depending by the recording, there are a lot of CD recorded with wrongl phase, you can adjust it for better result in sound...

 

[ubs28]

Ok thanks. No 1 setting that sounds best I suppose.

 

[TheAttorney]

Warning: if you have any OCD tendencies in you, then walk away from the absolute phase (polarity) switch. Sometimes ignorance is bliss, as it has been for most of my audiophile life on this topic.
 
It does not just affect the bass. It affects the solidity of the sound images. I could explain that in moe detail, but I won't for your own good. On the one hand, it's pretty subtle and varies with the type of recording - the more diffuse the images are to start with (or the less resolving your source), the less obvious are the differences, and most people probably wouldn't notice most of the time. But once I've latched onto those differences, then it's not so subtle anymore, and my OCD forces me to check every album I play.
 
To save a few seconds of A/Bing at the start of each album (and falling foul of DAVE's really, really, really irritating 8 second selection timeout feature), I've started marking up the albums. The good news for those that want to leave the phase switch alone, is that of the 52 albums I've marked so far, almost 3 to 1 sound best left at positive phase. So if you always stick to that, more often than not you'll be at the correct phase.

 

[Nik]

Good, but not enough... I also had starting to marking the CD... Until I have discovered that Each single tracks need to be controlled for the correct phase... (unfortunately...) No one only CD with all the tracks in the same phase...

 

[Mython]

The phase (polarity) inverter you need to set depending by the recording, there are a lot of CD recorded with wrong phase, you can adjust it for better result in sound...

 
 
Not the same thing, but that nonetheless reminds me of an interesting little anecdote I was told (by a very reliable source, during the mid 1990s) about George Michael's 'Listen Without Prejudice' album - in particular, the track 'Cowboys and Angels'.
 
IIRC, the album mix was monitored on a pair of Wilson Watt/Puppy loudspeakers, and it only emerged, after the album had gone to the pressing plant, that one of the subwoofer drivers (a replacement SEAS unit) had been accidentally wired out-of-phase, thus undermining the intended accuracy of the mix.
 
If you listen to that track, you may note that there is an ambiguous peculiarity to the bass notes in the mix - they seem a little 'sucked-out', although quite what may or may not have been done on the mixing desk, etc., is anyone's guess, as I wouldn't anticipate an engineer flipping phase on the mixing desk (especially not knowing of any loudspeaker issue), and certainly not for just one channel.

 

[Music Alchemist]

Concerning whether to use an external amp... I hope no one thought I was implying (from my previous comments) that no one should ever use an external amp that has a lot more power than the DAVE. Since powerful amps can be so much more affordable than the DAVE, that's not an issue from a price perspective, nor from a timing one. I'd imagine most would already have some good amps lying around anyway. I guess the natural thing for anyone to do is simply compare with your own system and music to see which you prefer. Power needs will ultimately depend on the individual. I do know that some people happily use just a Mojo with their LCD-4, for example.
 
And here's a relevant excerpt from this review:
 

Now as far as power, the amp built into the DAVE is sufficient to power the Abyss to ear-splitting levels. I don’t really go past the -10 dB mark. It gets pretty painful. That answers the question “Is the DAVE amp section sufficient to power current thirsty headphones?”
 
So what are the sonic differences between direct-from-DAC or having an amp in-between? Two things:
 

1. Softness
2. Transparency

The softness actually helped me tame that harshness I mentioned previously (which I didn’t get with the Lumin or Berkeley Reference). It actually doesn’t sound bad and smooths out the rhythm a bit. I do notice a thin veil to the overall sound. With direct-to-DAC, there’s literally nothing between your ears and the microphone. Without a direct comparison, you wouldn’t notice this as the 430HAD is so transparent. Speaks volumes on the Moon amp IMO. In any case, direct-to-DAC improves clarity, layering, dynamics, and transparency. Imaging and soundstage sounded similar to my ears.
 
I have to say, the differences aren’t huge, but it’s there. For high-resolution recordings, the direct-to-DAC was superior…by a fair margin. For studio and synthesized recordings, it’s not as apparent and I could be happy with either.

 

About 7 month ago i think someone published it here, but there is not accurat info in the old review from the "drunken sailer" WhatHifi ,
i remember was my comment, so you havent read through the whole thread my friend.

Start from page 1 ,

happy reading,..

It was discussed on the thread. From memory one of the elements discussed was that WhatHiFi felt that they could not bring themselves to give the DAVE a perfect score, but had to deduct a mark because on the demo model, the two halves of the case were misaligned by a fraction of a mm.

 
Yeah, I didn't read the entire thread since it's so incredibly long; only did a few search techniques (which aren't entirely accurate) for the link. (I did at first assume it was already discussed since it's one of the easiest to find links.)

 

[Nik]

I'm still comparing the two beasts ... (hard work...)
 
1) Dave directly to the Abyss
2) Headtrip from Vitus cd player to the Abyss
 
(so two different DAC working, Vitus and Dave)
 
Hard to find a winner... Dave alone is something special for transparency, image and details... 
 
Headtrip gives to the Abyss authority that Dave do not do... (also Vitus has more warmth sound respect to Dave...); the Abyss with Vitus/Headrip sounds more like a speakers, with the Dave more like a incredible headphones... The bass with Headtrip is simply superb and "abyssal" not the same with the Dave, but still excellent bass ...
 
But if I remember a certain "robotic" sound with some recordings with the Dave, this totally gone with the Headtrip, even with the stock JPS cable...
Also the med/hi of the female voices are better with the Headtrip, more present and analogical sound... 
 
Very hard to find the best of the two setups in a direct head by head comparison...
 
Now I'll try another way... I listen for one mount with the Vitus/Headtrip, and than I come back to the Dave, if the impact will be to come down from a speaker like sound to a headphone one, I'll give the winner to the Headtrip...
 
These are only my opinion with this incredible test head to head with two beasts...

 

[rgs9200m]

Yeah, even though I love my TT on my desk system, the EMM xds1 cdp w/ external amp (of course) is still a gold standard, with supreme reach and groundedness; very analog-like with more resolution than vinyl.
(That's a good word you used Nik, "analogical". I think you coined a great one there; I love it.)

 

[Nik]

Following ...

Dave/Abyss: highest hifi sound...
Vitus/Headtrip/Abyss: incredible live performance...

(And I' still waiting for the Prion4 with left and right xlr... May be the winner will be declared...)

 

[bmichels]

  I'm still comparing the two beasts ... (hard work...)
 
1) Dave directly to the Abyss
2) Headtrip from Vitus cd player to the Abyss
 
(so two different DAC working, Vitus and Dave)
 
Hard to find a winner... Dave alone is something special for transparency, image and details... 
 
Headtrip gives to the Abyss authority that Dave do not do... (also Vitus has more warmth sound respect to Dave...); the Abyss with Vitus/Headrip sounds more like a speakers, with the Dave more like a incredible headphones... The bass with Headtrip is simply superb and "abyssal" not the same with the Dave, but still excellent bass ...
 
But if I remember a certain "robotic" sound with some recordings with the Dave, this totally gone with the Headtrip, even with the stock JPS cable...
Also the med/hi of the female voices are better with the Headtrip, more present and analogical sound... 
 
Very hard to find the best of the two setups in a direct head by head comparison...
 
Now I'll try another way... I listen for one mount with the Vitus/Headtrip, and than I come back to the Dave, if the impact will be to come down from a speaker like sound to a headphone one, I'll give the winner to the Headtrip...
 
These are only my opinion with this incredible test head to head with two beasts...

 
very interesting.  Indeed, I will soon listen to a a VITUS SCD-025 mk2 (and compare it to an Esoteric K-01x) used as a CD player but also as a USB DAC.  
 
--> Is the SCD-025  the VITUS you are refering to ?   Isn't the VITUS sound too warm/live to the point of loosing micro details ?
 
Note :I will also listen at the same time to the NASDAC DAC & Metronome C8+

 

[Nik]

Yes, Vitus scd 025 mk II, a full sound with a lot of micro details but, first music, than all the littlest details... Some other players put the details first and then the music...

 

[bmichels]

Yes, Vitus scd 025 mk II, a full sound with a lot of micro details but, first music, than all the littlest details... Some other players put the details first and then the music...

 
Very exciting comments.  I am looking forward listening to the SCD-025 paired with my BHSE amp + Stax SR009.  I hope it will offer good synergy with my Electrostatic set-up.
 
I am indeed looking for the Best DAC for my BHSE: a DAC that is very detailed, « non digital » and very engaging... like the NAGRA HD DAC but... a more reasonable price than the NAGRA. So I intend to use the SCD-025 not only as a CD player but also (and most of the time) as a USB DAC (have you heard also the Esoteric K-01x ?).

 

[Nik]

Yes, I heard many top class CD players like Esoteric, Playback... And I bought the Vitus, (I had before the Linn Sondek CD 12), even because I do not have sacd but only redbook CD...