Cayin HA-300MK2 (2022) TOTL Transformer coupled Direct Heated Triode Tube HeadAmp (Page 91)
Apr 20, 2024 at 4:41 PM Post #6,211 of 6,478
Why is no one doing some experimentation with two different types of driver tubes? One type in the front and electrically matched but a different brand in the rear.
Im on this ... white print front, red print rear :) 6j5 front, 6c5 rear :)
 
Apr 20, 2024 at 4:47 PM Post #6,212 of 6,478
I definitely agree.

I'm very curious as to looking at the power supply section one day. Opeining it up to see for myself. I'm no electrical engineer but I hazard a guess that the filtering banks of capacitors are allowing for large levels of power storage and thus allowing for plenty of reserves for instantaneous current. It's that instantaneous current demand that lasts for only milliseconds that allows the amp to keep pace during dynamic transients in music. People ask if the Cayin HA-300B MKII is slow or hobbled due to being a tube rectified amp. On the contrary the MK2 is snappy and fast and has never shown any signs of the usual voltage sag some lesser amps may exhibit.
I've heard slow in solid state many a time. I never ever hear it in the Cayin with the top tier tubes. I often sit in disbelief that tubes 70/80 years old can free the emotions as they do.
 
Apr 20, 2024 at 7:34 PM Post #6,213 of 6,478
Why is no one doing some experimentation with two different types of driver tubes? One type in the front and electrically matched but a different brand in the rear.
Been wondering about this myself. The possibilities could be endless. . .

I have mixed different vintages of the same brand, but never different brands (yet).
 
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Apr 20, 2024 at 7:44 PM Post #6,214 of 6,478
Im on this ... white print front, red print rear :) 6j5 front, 6c5 rear :)
I like the idea of White and Red mix.

However, not sure I would mix different tube types. I could be wrong though, and what do you think @jamato8?
 
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Apr 20, 2024 at 7:49 PM Post #6,215 of 6,478
I like the idea of White and Red mix.

However, not sure I would mix different tube types. I could be wrong though, what do you think @jamato8?
You want to know your tube measurements. But, many amps will have a few tubes lined up and you don't need to use the same brand and often the same brand is not used. With the 6SN7 socket, the heater connection is all that is shared. And, even two different tubes of the same year and manufacturer are going to measure somewhat different. Also, 7193 types are base on a set of electrical characteristic that has to be followed, if it is to be classified as a 7193/CV6 etc., if it is going to work in that circuit.
 
Apr 21, 2024 at 12:16 AM Post #6,216 of 6,478
Been wondering about this myself. The possibilities could be endless. . .

I have mixed different vintages of the same brand, but never different brands (yet).
I know 6c5 have a higher resistance than 6j5 due to the mesh's. I would expect if two higher resistance 6c5s are ok (they are so far!) then a mix of both should be ok ... It might be one for the Gold lions to take fo rthe team LOL!
 
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Apr 21, 2024 at 10:26 AM Post #6,217 of 6,478
Why is no one doing some experimentation with two different types of driver tubes? One type in the front and electrically matched but a different brand in the rear.
I have a related question.

What effect does deliberate tube mismatching have on the sound quality?

For example, let's presume that one takes a single brand of single-triode driver tube (eg. Mullard CV6) and that one one tube example has a transconductance measurement of 3200 microHos with a plate current of 8ma and another tube example that has a transconductance measurement of 2,200 microHos and a plate current of 6ma. Then, one could mix them in the same channel. What effect would that have on the sound quality. Also, one could mix them so that the left channel has two higher output tubes and the right channel has two weaker output tubes. What effect would it have on the sound quality?

Has anyone deliberately experimented to determine its effect?

Jeff.
 
Apr 21, 2024 at 11:02 AM Post #6,218 of 6,478
I've had mine for a while now and rolled in new WE and 50s RCA red base 5962. Plugged in to the PS Audio PowerPlant 3 - never had a fuse blow :fingers_crossed:
 
Apr 21, 2024 at 4:11 PM Post #6,219 of 6,478
I have some of the Pinnacle USSR tube marked as 6J5GT for convenience all about as matched. I bought 6 as it is never a good idea to buy just the number you need in case one goes bad or they don't really match. Four match really well, one is a little high on the current draw and one is much higher. So 4 out of the 6 are truly matched. I have no idea of the dates for these tubes as the tubes, as mentioned, have been scrubbed.

I also bought some from Ukraine that are rebranded and I marked them as 6J5 as convenience as that is also how I measure them. Out of 12, most of them match pretty well, with a couple of outliers but not bad. They range from 1961 to 1969 (1) as the tubes are not scrubbed to get rid of the factory printing, which is always a shame to do. The tubes all have testing on them but they don't match what I get for measurements and don't test as close as the measurements indicate on the tube, which is why I always want to test my own tubes.

These tubes need at least 50 hours of play time. They start out pretty nice and then for me, go a little flat sounding, lacking in dynamics and transparency and then come back and pass how they originally sounded but they need plenty of hours on them.

For some cases, matching isn't real critical but in the input stage, you can get an imbalance if they aren't close. A follower tube will have little effect on this, depending upon how it is being used.

I still need to measure or flip the MKII over and look at the circuit to see if the 6SN7s are in parallel (reduces noise but also increase gain) or how they are connected. Andy could let everyone know.

I had one 6S5S, or what ever they are called, with the shielded plate (USSR), die. The heater did not light up. Ok, about 50% of the time the heater doesn't burn out (filament) but the connection as they are old, can be bad. So I resoldered pin 2 and 7 and it works now. So don't just toss a tube if the heater doesn't light up. It could just need to be resoled as this solder is very old. And, in this case, contrary to what I normally do, I only bought 4 tubes. :^)

IMG_4228.jpeg
 
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Apr 22, 2024 at 1:58 AM Post #6,220 of 6,478
the cayin gives me a new respect for hd800S... it plays to 800s strengths of detail, space, holographic positioning in the headstage but then also makes it warmer, richer a bit more bassy... its a great pairing
 
Apr 22, 2024 at 2:01 AM Post #6,221 of 6,478
I have some of the Pinnacle USSR tube marked as 6J5GT for convenience all about as matched. I bought 6 as it is never a good idea to buy just the number you need in case one goes bad or they don't really match. Four match really well, one is a little high on the current draw and one is much higher. So 4 out of the 6 are truly matched. I have no idea of the dates for these tubes as the tubes, as mentioned, have been scrubbed.

I also bought some from Ukraine that are rebranded and I marked them as 6J5 as convenience as that is also how I measure them. Out of 12, most of them match pretty well, with a couple of outliers but not bad. They range from 1961 to 1969 (1) as the tubes are not scrubbed to get rid of the factory printing, which is always a shame to do. The tubes all have testing on them but they don't match what I get for measurements and don't test as close as the measurements indicate on the tube, which is why I always want to test my own tubes.

These tubes need at least 50 hours of play time. They start out pretty nice and then for me, go a little flat sounding, lacking in dynamics and transparency and then come back and pass how they originally sounded but they need plenty of hours on them.

For some cases, matching isn't real critical but in the input stage, you can get an imbalance if they aren't close. A follower tube will have little effect on this, depending upon how it is being used.

I still need to measure or flip the MKII over and look at the circuit to see if the 6SN7s are in parallel (reduces noise but also increase gain) or how they are connected. Andy could let everyone know.

I had one 6S5S, or what ever they are called, with the shielded plate (USSR), die. The heater did not light up. Ok, about 50% of the time the heater doesn't burn out (filament) but the connection as they are old, can be bad. So I resoldered pin 2 and 7 and it works now. So don't just toss a tube if the heater doesn't light up. It could just need to be resoled as this solder is very old. And, in this case, contrary to what I normally do, I only bought 4 tubes. :^)


When picking the duelunds for modding did you consider VCAP CUTF ?
 
Apr 22, 2024 at 2:22 PM Post #6,222 of 6,478
When picking the duelunds for modding did you consider VCAP CUTF ?
The VCAP takes many hours to form/burn in. I am familiar with the Duelund and like them so that is what I went with.
 
Apr 24, 2024 at 9:22 AM Post #6,223 of 6,478
Cayin Soul 170HA is around the corner, I promise this is something that will you'll WOW when you see this in person. :wink:

Soul 170HA Tube Glow.JPG
 
Cayin Stay updated on Cayin at their sponsor profile on Head-Fi.
 
http://en.cayin.cn/
Apr 24, 2024 at 10:34 AM Post #6,225 of 6,478
Cayin Soul 170HA is around the corner, I promise this is something that will you'll WOW when you see this in person. :wink:

It gets a WOW from me, without even seeing it in person. I can only imagine how incredible it looks and sounds in person.
 

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