[Chaucer]

Hi,

I've been reading this forum for a while and have enjoyed reading opinions and reviews. I learn a little here and there and it's been very helpful. I finally want to dive into getting something higher grade in terms of a stereo.

I've gone to my local hi-fi place that sells over-the-top stuff that a college student like me can only dream of (one room has a $100k system with Wilson Audio speakers, Mark Levinson amps, and Transparent cable). They don't really have much for me that I can use to build a more introductory system. So, I'll either look to buying online (where I'd suspect I'd fine better prices) or looking for another hi-fi shop farther away.

And I'm looking to spend around $800. From talking to a few people that have built things in this price range, I have looked into getting a classic Marantz receiver from the 70s and a pair of Axiom speakers (either the M22ti or M3ti). From what I have read, the old Marantz receivers are very well made and sound very good for the price.

But that's just one idea. What would you suggest? This will be primarily for music (obviously), but also connected to my computer for my 80GB mp3 collection and general computer stuff (to a lesser extent, PC gaming). I have a separate CD player already for it, so I'm just looking to buying the speakers, cable, and a stereo receiver. Is an amp necessary? Is a subwoofer necessary? At one point is getting a separate amp and pre-amp a better idea than simply getting a receiver? Examples of music I listen to would include Radiohead, Godspeed You Black Emperor, Clinic, Sigur Ros, Fiery Furnaces, New Pornographers, and Explosions in the Sky. I don't listen to classical or jazz or anything bass-heavy like hip-hop and trance. Mostly indie rock, post rock, or some blend of experimental electronic rock.

I'm thinking that as long as I avoid buying solid gold cables and $700 speaker stands, I should be able to put together a much better system than my Klipsch ProMedia 2.1s that I currently have.

 

[meat01]

I would look into getting an integrated amp. This is a great compromise between separates and a receiver. The power supplies in integrated amps are a lot heftier than receivers. I would check out a used Rotel, NAD or other integrated amps.

 

[soundboy]

A receiver is the combination of a power amp, a pre-amp, and a radio tuner in one case. If the tuner is not a priority for you, then I would suggest an stereo integrated amp. The usual suspects have been mentioned, but I will also add Cambridge Audio to the list as well.

You should audition as many speakers as possible and don't solely depend on specs. Hearing is believing. Also try speakers by Energy, PSB, Paradigm NHT, Triangle, Acoustic Energy, Tannoy, B&W, etc....

My system was under $800 and that's including a brand-new Sony DVP-NS500V DVD/SACD player.

 

[soupy]

Get used stuff. Chances are with that, you might not even use more than half that budget for complete satisfaction. Unless you want a radio tuner and want to invest for some surround sound in the future, there's no point in getting a receiver (vintage stereo receivers can be great, but it's hard to tell what's good and what's not since there's a lack of online reviews for them, so it's risky. I've had instances where it just sucked). Separates are generally better, but you'll be spending a lot more than you will need. Go for an integrated amp. You might want to invest in a sound card upgrade if you plan to do a PC based stereo rig. Plus, because it's on a computer, I'd look more at monitor speakers than larger sized ones.

 

[Chaucer]

Thanks a lot for the replies. It looks like an integrated amp is a much better option. Surround is not something I am looking at in the future. I have an average system already for that and I'm much more concerned about music than movies.

I have a Game Theater XP right now, and I wasn't going to be getting this new system without at least updating to the m-Audio Revolution or possibly even the 1212M that everyone seems to love. But, I will be spending the majority of the time using a proper CD player than my computer.

Thanks for the list of brands to check out, soundboy. I've been bored at work today so I did a lot of looking around this afternoon and was especially looking at the Paradigm Studio 20s. I'm going to be demoing things in the near future and hopefully building something this summer.

Also, where would be a good venue for finding used equipment aside from eBay?

 

[soundboy]

Try audiogon.com for used equipment as well.

For get to add KEF and Monitor Audio for speakers.

 

[ooheadsoo]

Get down to guitar center and audition their powered monitors. They have monitors starting from $300 that sound great (event tr-5.) I like the events best until you get to the mackie 624's which run for $900. Then get yourself down to ebay or agon and pick up a used pair. Subwoofers are expensive and you'll want one. One thing to consider is to get speakers with weak bass performance if you're going to get a subwoofer. If you properly integrate your subwoofer with speakers that do 50hz all by their lonesome, you'll need one expensive subwoofer to get down below there with authority. If your speakers have weaker bass performance, you'll feel like your subwoofer was a much greater value purchase. I'm a college student too and let me tell you, it feels really bad when your subwoofer only plays a 20 hz range yet cost you as much as your speakers or more. If you choose speakers with 5.25" woofers, they won't take up too much space in your room and they'll benefit much more greatly from a subwoofer than larger woofers. There are lots of great 5.25" woofer monitors, not all of them at GC, so it may be a tough call, but with a $800 budget and a subwoofer and preamp, you're pretty much restricted to the stuff they have at GC anyway.

If you choose to get regular speakers, I'd recommend going with some EASY diy design like Dennis Murphy's plop in a box (http://www.murphyblaster.com/) or Wayne's PeeCreek (http://www.speakerbuilder.net/) for kits with cabinets premade or if you can handle your own cabinet, then your choices really open up. You just need to do a bit of soldering and screwing in for the diy designs using the PE cabinet. Then, I'd recommend getting a tripath based amp, which can be found as low as $22 from some retailers. Check audiocircle.com for tripath information. If you do go the tripath route, I'd recommend sticking with speakers with (true) sensitivity above 87db/w just to be safe. The diy sensitivity numbers are probably accurate, but those posted by manufacturers may fudge, so be wary. With the ~15w tripath and 87db/w, you should be able to score around 102db at 1m. 80db is already dangerous to listen to for more than a few hours at a time, to give you some frame of reference. This ~$20 tripath is being compared to el-34 tube amps costing up to ~$2k and being competetive.

 

[Wodgy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chaucer And I'm looking to spend around $800. From talking to a few people that have built things in this price range, I have looked into getting a classic Marantz receiver from the 70s and a pair of Axiom speakers (either the M22ti or M3ti). From what I have read, the old Marantz receivers are very well made and sound very good for the price.

Sounds like you've been getting great advice. The older Marantz units are indeed very nice, and I highly recommend them. There are a lot of threads about these guys here on Head-Fi, so do a search and you'll find a ton of information. My personal feeling is that the 70s Marantz units sound better than current production NAD amplifiers, which I don't recommend.

ooheadsoo makes great points about subwoofers. You have to decide in advance whether you'll get a sub or not. ooheadsoo already covered the speaker+sub scenario, and I echo what he has to say. There are no good subwoofers under $350 (unless you consider DIY), and you need to budget for a good one if you're going that route. If you're not going to get a sub, you need to pick speakers with very good bass performance. This is the route I ended up going, though I started out with a sub+bookshelf speaker combination then sold both and got better main speakers with no sub. I personally think this route can be cheaper (it was for me) but it can also be more expensive too. With the M3ti you'll probably end up wanting a subwoofer. You might be able to get away without one with the M22ti. If you can swing it, consider the M40ti. Speaker recommendations are very personal though and I would encourage you to see if there are any local stores in your area, even if you have to drive a little out of your way, where you can audition them.

 

[Gopher]

Add Magnepan MMGs to the list of speakers to audition as well. They are still some of my favorite cheap speakers and look pretty cool to boot. They can be had ~300 if you strike at the right time on audiogon leaving a good $500 in your budget.

I had descent results pairing my old MMGs with a Marantz 1060b, but with as much left over in budget as you have I'd consider giving one of those panasonic digitals a shot. That would take care of you souce and pre/power amp wise and leave you with a couple bucks for descent DIY speaker cables (I'd recommend grover sr). I suspect a rig like that could keep a sane person satisfied for some time.

FYI, lan is the person who bought my MMGs and is driving them in a similar setup to what I advise. You might want to drop him a line for particulars/questions. He's got a really good ear.

 

[hubcaps]

I wouldn't go for an older marantz. I have owned one (4430) and well it sounds very... vintage. It was overly warm and boomy. I'd only go for one if it was tube, but those are very pricey.
I like the maggie suggestion. My first audiophile speakers were smgas, but they were big and not appropriate for my small room in college.
Axiom's would be a good choice. If you want a kit the parts express br-1 kit would be good. It's only about $150 and it includes everything, you just gotta solder the xover.
An audiosource amp one or two would be a good first amp, they are super cheap second hand, like off ebay. If you want tube, the now discontinued antique sound labs wave 8 is great bang for the buck. I don't know why the discontinued them. They sold well and got great reviews. They popup once in a while on audiogon.

 

[ooheadsoo]

If you go br-1, make sure you check out Wayne's crossover on his version, which was designed at the same time as the br-1 was. Most seem to agree that Wayne's crossover is better.

 

[peter braun]

Look into some vintage Marantz or Sansui gear for your amplification. If you wish to listen to FM as a source look into any of the 22xx series Marantz receivers from the 1970s. The 2220B (>$200) or 2230 (>$250) are great pieces that will sound great and look slick too. Shain's Collectibles sells refurbished Marantz's units that are all in near mint condition. If you want an integrated amp, the Marantz 1060 and Sansui AU-517 are really nice units. As far as speakers are concerned look into a pair of PSB Alphas or those of the Paradigm line. Magnepans are indeed great speakers but may prove problematic to drive if you do not have the neccessary funds to put toward amplification.

 

[peter braun]

Here is Shain's site-

http://members.ebay.com/ws2/eBayISAP...userid=sstk100

I personally do not use a sub as most are too slow for my tastes and the models that are quick enough are far beyond my price range.

 

[augustwest]

I would highy recommend going the vintage route.

If you want a receiver:
Marantz (22xx series)
Fisher (some models)

If you want a integrated amp:
Marantz
Sansui
Luxman (some models)

For more info on Marantz vintage gear check the following:
< http://www.classic-audio.com/marantz/mindex.html >

Happy listening!

- augustwest

 

[Chaucer]

First of all, thanks for all the replies. I have made a list of all the reccomendations here and it's going to prove to very useful.

Went to a place that carries Paradigm and listened to the Studio 20s. I was very impressed, even without a sub they sounded very good. This was the Ver. 2. The Ver 3 sounded much worse, in my opinion. It definitely needed a sub and it just sounded very average. Especially since they were $300 more than the Ver. 2.

I also listened to the Kirksaeter Silverline 90. Much more detail in the highs and more forward than the Studio 20s. The bass was better rounded and it was leaps and bounds nicer in almost every aspect. Then I saw it was $1,200.

I set out for more listenings next week. This is going to be a hard decision. And lots of conflicting opinions on whether to go with the vintage Marantz or a modern intergrated amp. I just hope I can find enough places to demo the stuff.