[Beagle]

Some bass humps seem to gradually go away, or rather one gets used to them. But the one on the P9 just seems to stick out like a sore thumb and stay there...at least thus far.

 

[shurealltheway]

Some bass humps seem to gradually go away, or rather one gets used to them. But the one on the P9 just seems to stick out like a sore thumb and stay there...at least thus far.

That's exactly how I felt, which is why I had to send them back. Still I wonder if their lightning connector will smooth that out. I'm holding out with hope because if it does, I'm buying them again.

 

[Onetwothree]

You can try to pair the P9 with Dragonfly Red or Dragonfly Black on iPhone or laptop, they are tiny (like USB size) and very affordable. I am really loving the sounds coming out of this pairing. And I listen to mostly Scandinavian Metal such as Opeth, Amorphis, etc. and a bit of classical music. They all sound amazing.

I've been debating whether to buy something like the Dragonfly Red. I hear a lot of mixed information about whether it makes a difference or not. I'm debating whether to buy a new amp/dac as well because my iPhone 5 is 32gb and I'd like more space. I hear differing opinions on whether something like an AK300 will really be an improvement over an iPhone 5. I'm also considering the chord mojo. I think my current tv headphone solution may not cut it with better headphones because the amp/dac isn't good enough. When I plug the P9's in I'm able to get enough volume at 50% but the acoustics are just strange. I hear lots of detail but the voices are really low, then someone shoots a gun and wow it's loud. Then the voices are really low and music starts to play and speech is barely audible. This doens't happen with my Senneheiser MX 980 ear buds or my Audio Technica ATH-AD900's or with the accompanying wireless headphones, from those things sound normal. I'm considering the chord mojo because of its optical input which I'm hoping to use as a tv headphone solution.
 
Lots of choices but I suppose I'll have to try out the an amp/dac and decide for myself whether there is a real sound improvement.

 

[Mikeoscar]

 
I've been debating whether to buy something like the Dragonfly Red. I hear a lot of mixed information about whether it makes a difference or not. I'm debating whether to buy a new amp/dac as well because my iPhone 5 is 32gb and I'd like more space. I hear differing opinions on whether something like an AK300 will really be an improvement over an iPhone 5. I'm also considering the chord mojo. I think my current tv headphone solution may not cut it with better headphones because the amp/dac isn't good enough. When I plug the P9's in I'm able to get enough volume at 50% but the acoustics are just strange. I hear lots of detail but the voices are really low, then someone shoots a gun and wow it's loud. Then the voices are really low and music starts to play and speech is barely audible. This doens't happen with my Senneheiser MX 980 ear buds or my Audio Technica ATH-AD900's or with the accompanying wireless headphones, from those things sound normal. I'm considering the chord mojo because of its optical input which I'm hoping to use as a tv headphone solution.
 
Lots of choices but I suppose I'll have to try out the an amp/dac and decide for myself whether there is a real sound improvement.

Definitely sounds like dac/amp combo would immensely benefit you. My own experience with the P9's is they absolutely need to be driven properly and a standard phone or laptop is not going to cut it.
 
It's funny you mention the fact speech is barely audible - when I first bought a pair of high end full size speakers two years ago, these were paired with a wrong (not underpowered as such, volume was fine) amplifier. Music sounded unmusical and a banged up mess. But more important for this discussion: I suddenly noticed I needed to switch on subtitles for all the movies I watched. Speech had become impossible to understand in some weird, bizarre way. After replacing the amplifier everything became crystal clear again.

 

[Zaroff]

FYI Amazon.de has an great price on it: https://www.amazon.de/gp/product/B01KLO2HQ4/ref=od_aui_detailpages00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 
EDIT: Amazon.es is even better: https://www.amazon.es/gp/product/B01KLO2HQ4/ref=od_aui_detailpages00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 
 
EDIT 2: Nevermind. They went very quickly, at 630 Euros.

 

[scarfacegt]

I have to say that i like the p9s more and more.Its dark sounding for sure.But im getting used to it.And i like them more now then when i first listened to them

 

[netdog]

  At the same volume? I certainly accept that the sound signature can shift as new gear is used, but it won't change the sound signature of the headphone significantly, that really isn't scientifically possible, unless the two amps/amp + DACs being compared are very different sounding to begin with, and or, if one of the amps and DAC devices is really poorly designed. Don't forget, the majority of amps for instance, even very inexpensive ones, actually have distortion ratings well below the point of practical audibility. Really nasty ones when pushed and with a load will certainly introduce some audible distortion, but that isn't as common a reality as we might expect. The P9 sounded pretty nice from my G4, albeit too quiet for my preferences.
 
Now I can really accept more clarity being introduced by a better DAC, that isn't so hard to accept, but that isn't what was being discussed. The idea was that the P9 requires more power to start to be itself, but the reality is that the P9 is extremely easy to drive. Yes, I can agree with you that some improvement is possible with a better amp as they can handle the frequency response swings better and help control the driver, but again, unless the other amp was extremely bad at this, you aren't getting significant changes simply from adding a little more power which is what has been suggested. You may get minor changes, but we aren't talking night and day here.
 
With very difficult to drive headphones certainly the effects realized by better amplification will be more obvious and substantial, but people need to be realistic, the P9 is a very easy to drive headphone. I have never had a headphone suddenly sound night and day better when switching amps, I'm not saying there aren't shifts, and some certainly are audible improvements, but repeating myself again, they have never been so significant as to really change the way the headphone's signature is perceived, more like minor differences. Again, I am not saying no difference is possible, nor am I implying minor differences can't be meaningful because they can.
 
Edit: a caveat/disclaimer, if the P9 had a very erratic frequency response that could also be a factor and in some cases yield more obvious improvements, but I as of yet haven't seen any real measurements so hard to say one way or the other.

 
While I do appreciate your viewpoint, I also wonder if you are finding yourself slipping into a posture of defending your negative view of the P9s beyond reason.

 

[netdog]

You guys aren't helping me. Someone says they're bad for the price, you need an amp, you don't need an amp, they're amazing etc. Did you try them straight from a phone?

 
Bowers & Wilkins will be providing a bespoke DAC and amplifier free to all purchasers.  The DAC/Amp is designed specifically for iOS devices with Lightning ports. 
 
And I think it goes without saying that most decent DACs/Amps will improve the sound produced by an iPhone 6s, a device that may very well by augmenting the midrange hump, compounding a trait that may also be designed into the P9s as they are a Made For iPhone device, and therefore a portable device for use out in the world in my view.
 
I know the size and leakage make these less appropriate for some a portable soundstage, but of course, they're free to use other devices.
 
I love my P9s, and can't wait for what I expect will be the vast improvement afforded by the DAC/Amp/Lightning chain.

 

[netdog]

What about when using a macbook pro? I guess that is a bit better than a phone but still needs an amp?

 
Neither device provides decent fidelity to anything without an external DAC/Amp added to the change.

 

[shurealltheway]

While I do appreciate your viewpoint, I also wonder if you are finding yourself slipping into a posture of defending your negative view of the P9s beyond reason.

What a ridiculous accusation. I agree with everything he said.

 

[netdog]

What a ridiculous accusation. I agree with everything he said.

 
That's fine by me. I actually said I appreciate his viewpoint, so me wonders who might be reacting in a ridiculous manner.  I have no problem with his opinions on the P9s.  I just have the impression that he is perhaps sticking his oar in to disagree with members with positive views more than I'd expect.  But no, I think his points are valuable and part of what make up the overall response of this forum.  
 
If you don't like what I had to say and accuse me of being ridiculous., shure, rest assured that I've taken note and have dropped your grievance in my circular file.

 

[Beagle]

   
That's fine by me. I actually said I appreciate his viewpoint, so me wonders who might be reacting in a ridiculous manner.  I have no problem with his opinions on the P9s.  I just have the impression that he is perhaps sticking his oar in to disagree with members with positive views more than I'd expect.  But no, I think his points are valuable and part of what make up the overall response of this forum.  
 
If you don't like what I had to say and accuse me of being ridiculous., shure, rest assured that I've taken note and have dropped your grievance in my circular file.

 
I think the P9 will be somewhat of an acquired taste. I'm starting to acquire it myself.
 
The big fly in the ointment at Head-Fi is that too many folks judge a headphone based on how it compares to another headphone (oft-times myself included..much to my chagrin). There are way too many variations in headphone sound for a proper judgement to be made on how one particular model should sound.
 
My litmus test is to go for long walks with the dog, into the woods or where I am surrounded my nature. Or hear some street buskers or listen to some kid practicing their musical instrument some evening as you walk down the street. When I go back to listening to music over headphones, if it sounds "odd" or unnatural (or not "occurring naturally") I make the necessary correction.

 

[Sonic Defender]

   
While I do appreciate your viewpoint, I also wonder if you are finding yourself slipping into a posture of defending your negative view of the P9s beyond reason.

While I was still being objective, respectful, and posting impressions based on actual (but limited) listening with the P9, I do think there is a grain of truth in your view. I do think I was pushing back a little against what I believed was a glossing over of the bass signature of the P9. I do regret if it made people think I was on a witch hunt against the P9 and deprived them of enjoying their purchase. As I said way back, I went to the store to purchase the P9 (hopefully), but for my needs and preferences I was able to happily leave with the P7 wireless. Lucky for me, there is an opportunity to possibly borrow a P9 from a local head-fi member who I believe will happily do so and use my P7. So I may yet get some quality time with the P9 yet and who knows, perhaps I will also begin to "acquire" a taste for it.
 
I will still never change my view that the P9 has a focus problem in that I believe the design was caught between being a stationary home system headphone and a mobile headphone. I don't think that is overly harsh to say and that shouldn't be viewed as grinding my axe, just an observation.

 

[netdog]

  While I was still being objective, respectful, and posting impressions based on actual (but limited) listening with the P9, I do think there is a grain of truth in your view. I do think I was pushing back a little against what I believed was a glossing over of the bass signature of the P9. I do regret if it made people think I was on a witch hunt against the P9 and deprived them of enjoying their purchase. As I said way back, I went to the store to purchase the P9 (hopefully), but for my needs and preferences I was able to happily leave with the P7 wireless. Lucky for me, there is an opportunity to possibly borrow a P9 from a local head-fi member who I believe will happily do so and use my P7. So I may yet get some quality time with the P9 yet and who knows, perhaps I will also begin to "acquire" a taste for it.
 
I will still never change my view that the P9 has a focus problem in that I believe the design was caught between being a stationary home system headphone and a mobile headphone. I don't think that is overly harsh to say and that shouldn't be viewed as grinding my axe, just an observation.

That's all I was trying to say, and I do want to re-emphasize that I do appreciate your opinion.  In fact, I think your observation about the hump is dead on. For me, that's mitigated by the fact that they are my on the go MFi solution so they work better for me than they might for others, but I am also partially hoping that the DAC will correct the issue you've correctly identified.  I certainly didn't mean to slag you off, something that I think you understood (and still do!).
 
I think your more recent insight/revelation that these cans are somewhat victimized by not knowing who they are (mobile vs. home) may get right to the heart of the matter.  I love these cans, but I also see the truth in your observations.

 

[Sonic Defender]

 
That's all I was trying to say, and I do want to re-emphasize that I do appreciate your opinion.  In fact, I think your observation about the hump is dead on. For me, that's mitigated by the fact that they are my on the go MFi solution so they work better for me than they might for others, but I am also partially hoping that the DAC will correct the issue you've correctly identified.  I certainly didn't mean to slag you off, something that I think you understood (and still do!).
 
I think your more recent insight/revelation that these cans are somewhat victimized by not knowing who they are (mobile vs. home) may get right to the heart of the matter.  I love these cans, but I also see the truth in your observations.

No worries mate, it is always fine to be honest and your post, and the fact that another member messaged me saying essentially the same thing, was helpful as it made me look at the situation from the perspective of those who had shelled out some serious cash for the P9. I stand by what I said; however, I don't think I needed to say things quite as often as I did so for what that is worth there it is. I'm sure had the shoe been on the other foot I may have been a little irked.