[Quinto]

 
So, I guess you can not stand Richter's Bach? Pedals all over the place 

Sviatoslav was special

 

[CanadianMaestro]

 
Sviatoslav was special

but not for Bach...or Schubert. 

 
 
Maybe Gould...but no Schubert from him.

 

[CanadianMaestro]

A stupendously luscious, smooth voice --
 

 

[eyeresist]

Just comparing track lengths, the old school conducters used to take it slower than the modern norm: Furtwangler, Knappertsbusch, Schmidt-Isserstedt, Klemperer, Beecham, Krips, Jochum, Fricsay, Kurt Sanderling, Bruno Walter...._

That's why they're old school conductors I've heard this movement taken slower than 60bpm... no way that's anywhere near being considered an Allegretto, unless they're considering the pulse to be the eighth note, but it's marked in 2/4 and even the old school conductors make something of the quarter notes. An actual 100bpm allegretto makes the movement an entirely different beast.

I've been looking into this, and planning on blogging on the subject for a while (just need to finally get it finished), but the meaning of musical directions has changed over the years. Now we seem to take them as a straight indication of speed, but originally they were often more about attitude. For example, allegro meant "cheerful" (and still does in Italian) which suggests moving forward with some energy but not necessarily "fast".
There is a lot of confusion about andante, which a lot of people think means "at walking pace" - which of course could mean almost any tempo. In fact, this was originally a reference to the "walking bass" style of continuo, so is a direction to bring out this aspect of the music, implying a certain deliberateness of tempo. Although this meaning faded somewhat, it does seem to be the overt meaning of the direction for the slow mvt of Prokofiev's 2nd violin concerto.
_

 

[CanadianMaestro]

I've been looking into this, and planning on blogging on the subject for a while (just need to finally get it finished), but the meaning of musical directions has changed over the years. Now we seem to take them as a straight indication of speed, but originally.....
There is a lot of confusion about andante, which a lot of people think means "at walking pace" - which of course could mean almost any tempo.......
_

 
https://sites.google.com/site/canadianmaestrosaudiosystem/desert-island-recordings/tempo-markings
 
*yawn*  (What does this have to do with "Best classical recordings ever"?)

 

[leomitch]

   
https://sites.google.com/site/canadianmaestrosaudiosystem/desert-island-recordings/tempo-markings
 
*yawn*  (What does this have to do with "Best classical recordings ever"?)

 
 
'Yawn!"  Hardly a Canadian response! IMHO it has to do with helping guys like me get a better grip on Classical music.  We are not all wells of knowledge here...I certainly am not and so I appreciate this piece of wisdom. Helps me to understand better so I can  better judge what is best, although "the best" is like the search for the best of anything...there will be as many opinions as there are people listening!
 
Cheers
Leo

 

[eyeresist]

I've been looking into this, and planning on blogging on the subject for a while (just need to finally get it finished), but the meaning of musical directions has changed over the years. Now we seem to take them as a straight indication of speed, but originally.....

There is a lot of confusion about andante, which a lot of people think means "at walking pace" - which of course could mean almost any tempo.......

https://sites.google.com/site/canadianmaestrosaudiosystem/desert-island-recordings/tempo-markings

*yawn*  (What does this have to do with "Best classical recordings ever"?)

The point is that BPM has less to do with "legitimate" interpretation than is often assumed, as historically "tempo" indications were more to do with style of playing than tempo as such.
Allegro ≠ fast.

 

[Quinto]

 
but not for Bach...or Schubert. 

 
 
Maybe Gould...but no Schubert from him.

Richter's Schubert is special to me

 

[uchihaitachi]

 
Richter's Schubert is special to me

His Schubert is exquisite. Just that the tempo does have some sleep inducing magical effects!
 
The bigger gripe I have with Richter is his technique when playing, he always seems to forcefully hit the keys. The piano sounds hard and 'hit' rather than singing.

 

[bracko]

 
His Schubert is exquisite. Just that the tempo does have some sleep inducing magical effects!
 
The bigger gripe I have with Richter is his technique when playing, he always seems to forcefully hit the keys. The piano sounds hard and 'hit' rather than singing.

 
It is his Yamaha pianos maybe?

 

[Quinto]

 
His Schubert is exquisite. Just that the tempo does have some sleep inducing magical effects!
 
The bigger gripe I have with Richter is his technique when playing, he always seems to forcefully hit the keys. The piano sounds hard and 'hit' rather than singing.

I agree, he had a fabulous dynamic range

  (he forcefully hit the keys when the score asked for it, his pianissimo was wonderful as well, otherwise his play would be a bad joke)
 
His Beethoven is very special, for a considerable part thanks to his unique percussive talent..and the fact he had no desire what so ever to smoothen things up..
 
Did you ever hear his decca recordings of Haydn from the eighties? dahhh no one plays Haydn like that, the man was a treasure!

 

 

[Quinto]

   
It is his Yamaha pianos maybe?

He did praise Yamaha pianos for their dynamic range, but obviously it was his choice to play the way he did..

 

[uchihaitachi]

   
It is his Yamaha pianos maybe?

Yamahas are pretty good especially their grands
 
Even videos of him playing, you can see that he really assaults the keyboard and you can always release your wrists instantly upon impact to the side, which can create very sonorous and rich sounding fffs, Even his grieg he really hits that stuff hard makes me wince

 

[CanadianMaestro]

   
 
IMHO it has to do with helping guys like me get a better grip on Classical music.  We are not all wells of knowledge here...I certainly am not and so I appreciate this piece of wisdom. Helps me to understand better so I can  better judge what is best, although "the best" is like the search for the best of anything...there will be as many opinions as there are people listening!
 
Cheers
Leo

So....how does one judge what is "best" based on tempo indications?
Just wondering.....

 

[CanadianMaestro]

 
He did praise Yamaha pianos for their dynamic range, but obviously it was his choice to play the way he did..

 
 

  Yamahas are pretty good especially their grands
 
 

 
@uchih:  In a nutshell, what do Yamahas, Steinways, Faziolis, Pleyels, and Bosendorfers bring to the table, in terms of sonic attributes (bass depth, tonalities, balance, etc?). Not much comparative info on this online.