[jordannn15]

At this point I have tried enough headphones for my liking and have returned to the HD6XX’s. Now I want to try them with a balanced amp and dac.

I have one main question that I couldn’t find while googling. If my music source is a macbook pro, how would I connect it to a balanced amp? I assume I cannot use usb to get a balanced connection because usb is digital and xlr is analog. Correct me if I am wrong about anything but this is what I am gathering from googling about the subject.


What would be a good balanced dac and amp to pair with the HD6XX’s? Would be great if it would be an all in one but not necessary. Budget is $500 and I am okay with buying used. I need it to have a optical input as well so I can use it with my ps4 when I want to play games.

I was thinking about the Topping DX7S for an all in one or the THX AAA 789 for just the amp. Thanks in advance!

 

[ProtegeManiac]

At this point I have tried enough headphones for my liking and have returned to the HD6XX’s. Now I want to try them with a balanced amp and dac.

I have one main question that I couldn’t find while googling. If my music source is a macbook pro, how would I connect it to a balanced amp?

Depends.

Is it just a balanced amp? Then no, it won't work.

Is it a balanced amp with a circuit for converting the signal into balanced drive? Then use a 3.5mm to 2xXLR.

Does it have a DAC? Because...

I assume I cannot use usb to get a balanced connection because usb is digital and xlr is analog. Correct me if I am wrong about anything but this is what I am gathering from googling about the subject.

...USB is digital. It doesn't care if it's balanced or not, it's still 00101001010010100101001010101000101000101000010100101100111000010.

But if you use a balanced DAC, then that DAC will convert that to a balanced analogue line signal, which can then get passed on to a balanced drive amp. Example: Schiit Gungnir and Mjolnir.

If you use a balanced DAC-HPamp-Preamp, then the 10010101010100010100101010010011001010100000010010100101011011111000000 goes from the Macbook to the DAC via USB, the digital receiver chip splits left and right, left DAC chip/s send out a signal into an output stage that already runs L+ and L- while the right channel is doing its own R+ and R-, no common GND, and the balanced amplifier gets this balanced signal.

 

[PurpleAngel]

Topping DX7s.
https://drop.com/buy/topping-dx7s

 

[jordannn15]

Depends.

Is it just a balanced amp? Then no, it won't work.

Is it a balanced amp with a circuit for converting the signal into balanced drive? Then use a 3.5mm to 2xXLR.

Does it have a DAC? Because...




...USB is digital. It doesn't care if it's balanced or not, it's still 00101001010010100101001010101000101000101000010100101100111000010.

But if you use a balanced DAC, then that DAC will convert that to a balanced analogue line signal, which can then get passed on to a balanced drive amp. Example: Schiit Gungnir and Mjolnir.

If you use a balanced DAC-HPamp-Preamp, then the 10010101010100010100101010010011001010100000010010100101011011111000000 goes from the Macbook to the DAC via USB, the digital receiver chip splits left and right, left DAC chip/s send out a signal into an output stage that already runs L+ and L- while the right channel is doing its own R+ and R-, no common GND, and the balanced amplifier gets this balanced signal.

Topping DX7s.
https://drop.com/buy/topping-dx7s

Okay so based on Protege’s reply, if I were to go with DX7s, it would be balanced whether I was using the optical in (ps4) or usb in (macbook pro) because it has a balanced dac not only an amp section. Is that correct?

And since it is an all in one, no XLR cables would be needed besides the balanced headphone cable?

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Okay so based on Protege’s reply, if I were to go with DX7s, it would be balanced whether I was using the optical in (ps4) or usb in (macbook pro) because it has a balanced dac not only an amp section. Is that correct?

Yes. Worst case scenario the DAC is still single ended and runs the signal through the same converter circuit that it might be using for its single ended analogue inputs.

And since it is an all in one, no XLR cables would be needed besides the balanced headphone cable?

Yes, just the headphone cable.

 

[jordannn15]

Yes. Worst case scenario the DAC is still single ended and runs the signal through the same converter circuit that it might be using for its single ended analogue inputs.




Yes, just the headphone cable.

Thanks! Would you recommend anything else other than the Topping DX7s?

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Thanks! Would you recommend anything else other than the Topping DX7s?

Personally I wouldn't even bother with balanced drive unless it's a DAP that has it and you might as well get the most out of it. Desktop amps aren't as limited as mobile devices when it comes to power source so the Lyr3 can actually make more power than the Jotunheim, and that's not even with noise and distortion penalty on the Lyr nor the Jotunheim just running more Class A bias.

 

[jordannn15]

Personally I wouldn't even bother with balanced drive unless it's a DAP that has it and you might as well get the most out of it. Desktop amps aren't as limited as mobile devices when it comes to power source so the Lyr3 can actually make more power than the Jotunheim, and that's not even with noise and distortion penalty on the Lyr nor the Jotunheim just running more Class A bias.

So do you think it would be more beneficial or a bigger difference if I went with a tube amp rather than going balanced? If so, any recommendations on tube amps. Again would be great if it was a combo amp and dac but not 100% necessary. I just need usb input and optical input.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

So do you think it would be more beneficial or a bigger difference if I went with a tube amp rather than going balanced?

That depends on what you'd consider an improvement.

What exactly do you want to improve? Because many tube amps will deliberately change the sound, even if it ends up less accurate than before since it's not necessarily just offsetting the non-linearities as a more precise EQ would.

If so, any recommendations on tube amps. Again would be great if it was a combo amp and dac but not 100% necessary. I just need usb input and optical input.

If you want to just get a lot of power for a high impedance headphone for not a lot of money to get the most of the dynamics when you crank it up, get an OTL amplifier. The Darkvoice DV336se trims the top end and boosts the midrange but not as badly as a Little Dot Mk2. Just note though that OTL amps make their power at high impedance so they're not really all that good for lower sensitivity, low impedance headphones that need more power not to mention the lower effective damping factor on those, and some high sensitivity low impedance headphones might have a lot of noise on them.

If you want a fair bit of power but has the imaging and air of a tube amp there are transformer-coupled amps that don't sacrifice performance for low impedance headphones, like the WooAudio WA6. It seems expensive compared to the DV336se but if you consider that the WooAudio WA3 is an OTL with less parts and only costs $100 less (making it an expensive OTL amp) and there are practically no good brand transformer coupled amps, the WA6 is kind of a bargain.

Again would be great if it was a combo amp and dac but not 100% necessary. I just need usb input and optical input.

It's kind of hard to jam a DAC into a tube amp since the tubes are relatively finicky about power supplies and what you hook up to those along with the tubes. OTLs tend to need one for all its tubes, with a few exceptions like the flagship LittleDot which runs like two of OTL amps running dual mono with one transformer on each set of driver tubes and one for the rectifier and other tube. Some transformer coupled amps can use just one power supply but the larger ones also have three like that flagship LD; the WA6se even comes in two separate chassis.

Most common DAC-HPamp with a tube only has a rectifier tube controlling the signal getting amplified by the solid state output stage, but usually they'll only have USB. The only one I know that has a tube and SPDIF only uses the tube as a buffer between the DAC circuit and the preamp circuit, the Maverick D1.

 

[jordannn15]

That depends on what you'd consider an improvement.

What exactly do you want to improve? Because many tube amps will deliberately change the sound, even if it ends up less accurate than before since it's not necessarily just offsetting the non-linearities as a more precise EQ would.

Ideally, an improved soundstage which is somewhat larger and more natural than the 3 blob stage. And if possible, extend bass extension so that the sub bass is a bit more present.

If you want to just get a lot of power for a high impedance headphone for not a lot of money to get the most of the dynamics when you crank it up, get an OTL amplifier. The Darkvoice DV336se trims the top end and boosts the midrange but not as badly as a Little Dot Mk2. Just note though that OTL amps make their power at high impedance so they're not really all that good for lower sensitivity, low impedance headphones that need more power not to mention the lower effective damping factor on those, and some high sensitivity low impedance headphones might have a lot of noise on them.

If you want a fair bit of power but has the imaging and air of a tube amp there are transformer-coupled amps that don't sacrifice performance for low impedance headphones, like the WooAudio WA6. It seems expensive compared to the DV336se but if you consider that the WooAudio WA3 is an OTL with less parts and only costs $100 less (making it an expensive OTL amp) and there are practically no good brand transformer coupled amps, the WA6 is kind of a bargain.

Which type is going to have more of the sound I am looking for? OTL’s or transformer coupled amps?

It's kind of hard to jam a DAC into a tube amp since the tubes are relatively finicky about power supplies and what you hook up to those along with the tubes. OTLs tend to need one for all its tubes, with a few exceptions like the flagship LittleDot which runs like two of OTL amps running dual mono with one transformer on each set of driver tubes and one for the rectifier and other tube. Some transformer coupled amps can use just one power supply but the larger ones also have three like that flagship LD; the WA6se even comes in two separate chassis.

Most common DAC-HPamp with a tube only has a rectifier tube controlling the signal getting amplified by the solid state output stage, but usually they'll only have USB. The only one I know that has a tube and SPDIF only uses the tube as a buffer between the DAC circuit and the preamp circuit, the Maverick D1.

I wondered why I don’t see many tube amp/dac combos. Appreciate the information!

Is the Bottlehead Crack still one of the top recommendations for the 6XX? I have been reading a decent amount of older forums and a ton of people recommend the Crack.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Ideally, an improved soundstage which is somewhat larger and more natural than the 3 blob stage. And if possible, extend bass extension so that the sub bass is a bit more present.

Which type is going to have more of the sound I am looking for? OTL’s or transformer coupled amps?

Neither. That's not something that depends as much as you think on the amplifier but is an inherent problem of "not hearing both drivers with both ears," coupled with "firing straight into the ear canals" ie you don't see speaker set ups where people put the speakers right to the direct left and right of the seat.*

If your only solution is an amplifier, then you need to get a Meier Jazz FF and run Crossfeed on it. Or use the Meier DACcord, run the various Crossfeed settings on that, and feed that signal to an amp of your choice, maybe even an OTL amp.*

If you're willing to use software some player apps have it.*

Problem with Crossfeed though is it reduces the extreme width with blank spots and lack of depth but the soundstage "narrows." Really what it does is make the positioning more proportional, but everyone calls it "narrows" and everyone already thinks not imaging the cymbals too far out to the flanks means the HD600 soundstage is "narrow" so I'll just use the same terms assuming you're more likely to agree with everybody else anyway but basically the bottomline is you might as well replace your entire system altogether including the headphones. Eitehr switch to speakers and not have to deal with "one ear, one driver hearing" altogether or get an AKG K702 and have a lot of allowance for "narrowing" when you apply Crossfeed through say the Jazz FF.

*I mitigate that problem through the following methods:
1. The HD600, since it's not a(n old) Grado.
2. Angled earpads on the HD600, which moves the cymbals to the center and to the back a little.
3. Crossfeed.

Set up:
a. FLAC: Android phone running Neutron custom settings on parametric EQ and Crossfeed >> Meier Cantate.2 >> HD600 with angled earpads, pushed forward so rear of earpads push up against earlobes (putting drivers farther forward relative to ear canals)
b. Spotify: Android phone running Spotify >> Meier Cantate.2 with Crossfeed enabled >> HD600 with angled earpads, , pushed forward so rear of earpads push up against earlobes (putting drivers farther forward relative to ear canals)

Is the Bottlehead Crack still one of the top recommendations for the 6XX? I have been reading a decent amount of older forums and a ton of people recommend the Crack.

Not for when the inherent problem is "left ear hears only left driver while right ear hears only right driver."

 

[PurpleAngel]

Okay so based on Protege’s reply, if I were to go with DX7s, it would be balanced whether I was using the optical in (ps4) or usb in (macbook pro) because it has a balanced dac not only an amp section. Is that correct?
And since it is an all in one, no XLR cables would be needed besides the balanced headphone cable?

The Topping DX7s does come with two ES9038 DAC chips, so the S/PDIF (optical/coaxial) or USB digital inputs have the right and left signals separate, before getting to the analog section.
To me "balanced" headphone refers to the analog part of the signal.

 

[jordannn15]

The Topping DX7s does come with two ES9038 DAC chips, so the S/PDIF (optical/coaxial) or USB digital inputs have the right and left signals separate, before getting to the analog section.
To me "balanced" headphone refers to the analog part of the signal.

I see you have the DX7s and NFB-11.28. Do you like one or the other better? I know the NFB is class A but I couldn’t figure out whether the DX7s is. The DX7s puts out more power at 300 ohms from its balanced than the NFB does (I know its single ended only).

I was looking into the Aune X7s as well since it puts out a whole watt at 300 ohms from its balanced output. You have any experience with it?

 

[buke9]

I have a couple of balanced amps and a balanced dac and still think the Bottlehead Crack is still the best I’ve heard the 6xx’s (650’s) from by quite a bit. Yes just my opinion but just such a great union that I have not heard anything better for the 6xx’s and have heard quite a few.

 

[jordannn15]

I have a couple of balanced amps and a balanced dac and still think the Bottlehead Crack is still the best I’ve heard the 6xx’s (650’s) from by quite a bit. Yes just my opinion but just such a great union that I have not heard anything better for the 6xx’s and have heard quite a few.

Do you use the stock tubes? I feel everyone always has a recommendation about different tubes. How does it color the sound? Do different tubes really change the sound a lot? Do you like the one with or without speedball better?