AVOID the Apple store like the plague!!
Nov 8, 2005 at 3:13 AM Post #31 of 78
Anything written on the receipt is not valid since the customer would only be able to know this after the sale is made.
 
Nov 8, 2005 at 3:36 AM Post #32 of 78
Quote:

Originally Posted by warchua
Anything written on the receipt is not valid since the customer would only be able to know this after the sale is made.



Basic law of contract ! I don't know about the law in teh states but it is certainly true of the law in England and wales. Unless it is stated on the contrary, like a sign, or you are a previous regular (this is subjective as to how regular is regular) customer. The principle is that you should be notify of the Terms and conditions of sale PRIOR to the exchange of contract.
 
Nov 8, 2005 at 3:41 AM Post #33 of 78
With best buy it does, as im sure it does with Apple, and most other manufacturers. At least here in canada. Best buys and Futureshops have "open Item" stickers on'em and a discounted price. Best Buys in canada dont do restocking fees, and im surprised to hear that its otherwise in the States, considering they've got a standard operation platform for everything.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjcha
I'd be pissed if I bought a "new" unit from Apple and found out it had been opened, swapped, and resealed. Your returned item should go straight to the "refurbished" or "returns" bin.

Best regards,

-Jason


 
Nov 8, 2005 at 3:43 AM Post #34 of 78
Quote:

Originally Posted by warchua
Anything written on the receipt is not valid since the customer would only be able to know this after the sale is made.


Not true...they can return the product without opening it.
 
Nov 8, 2005 at 3:49 AM Post #35 of 78
Quote:

Originally Posted by Blitzula
Not true...they can return the product without opening it.



No, the point being the T&C on the reciept is given out after the completion of contract. And basic contract law (and logic) tells you that is incorrect. How can you add on a condition after you agree on something?
 
Nov 8, 2005 at 4:06 AM Post #37 of 78
Quote:

Originally Posted by Blitzula
Very easily, the condition can be nullified by just giving them the product back. Or, by your logic, they can just decide not to accept a return at all.


How can the condition be nullified by returning it? by returning it, you are subject to their condition, and if those conditions were not stated in the original contract in the first place, it does not exist. It is call the mirror principle.

And they can decide not accept return at all, if that is their policy and T&C and the consumer knows full well about it before the completion of contract.

by your logic, lets say you come to buy a chocolate bar and i am a shop owner. And you paid for your chocolate, lets say $1, and on the way out of the store, but just as you leave, I stop you and tell you that you own me $1 million.

That would be your logic, as I have just amended the condition of the sale of the from $1 to $1 million without telling you.

Would that be valid? Of course not, T&C has to be agree between the parties prior to the exchange of contract. Even a simple chocolate bar transaction is a contract.
 
Nov 8, 2005 at 4:09 AM Post #38 of 78
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicola O
How can the condition be nullified by returning it? by returning it, you are subject to their condition, and if those conditions were not stated in the original contract in the first place, it does not exist. It is call the mirror principle.


If you don't open the product, there isn't a restocking fee. That's the whole point. It's not really a condition of the contract, it's a term clearly spelled out on the receipt. I can't recall if it's posted in the store also or not.
 
Nov 8, 2005 at 4:09 AM Post #39 of 78
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicola O
Basic law of contract ! I don't know about the law in teh states but it is certainly true of the law in England and wales. Unless it is stated on the contrary, like a sign, or you are a previous regular (this is subjective as to how regular is regular) customer. The principle is that you should be notify of the Terms and conditions of sale PRIOR to the exchange of contract.


I can tell you're not a lawyer. What you're saying is true of contract law, but this is not a contract or a license. It's a sale of goods.
 
Nov 8, 2005 at 4:11 AM Post #40 of 78
Quote:

Originally Posted by Blitzula
If you don't open the product, there isn't a restocking fee. That's the whole point. It's not really a condition of the contract, it's a term clearly spelled out on the receipt. I can't recall if it's posted in the store also or not.


opening or not is not the point, the point is T&C came AFTER the contract was compeleted.

We are debating on totally different subjects here.
 
Nov 8, 2005 at 4:11 AM Post #41 of 78
Quote:

Originally Posted by AlanY
I can tell you're not a lawyer. What you're saying is true of contract law, but this is not a contract or a license. It's a sale of goods.


Sales of good IS contract, i can tell that you are not a lawyer either.
 
Nov 8, 2005 at 4:15 AM Post #42 of 78
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nicola O
opening or not is not the point, the point is T&C came AFTER the contract was compeleted.

We are debating on totally different subjects here.


Opening or not is completely the point. You're trying to categorize when the terms of a return were communicated as something that invalidated the initial sale or made the return terms invalid. You're incorrect on whichever count you're trying to argue. If you don't believe me, I'm sure a lawyer on this site can set you straight.
 
Nov 8, 2005 at 4:18 AM Post #43 of 78
Quote:

Originally Posted by Blitzula
Opening or not is completely the point. You're trying to categorize when the terms of a return were communicated as something that invalidated the initial sale or made the return terms invalid. You're incorrect on whichever count you're trying to argue. If you don't believe me, I'm sure a lawyer on this site can set you straight.



Well, since i am in law school. I better hope i am right !

or my law lecturer and all the books i have read is wrong !

I am not debating the point of return was communicate, my point comes down to 1 point. You cannot amend a contract after it's completion. Period. Mirror principle.
 
Nov 8, 2005 at 4:24 AM Post #45 of 78
Quote:

Originally Posted by Blitzula
So you agree that if a sign was posted, the return policy Apple dicates would apply?


yes, since the sign would be a way of telling customers's their T&C of sale prior money and goods changed hands.

however, T&C was on the reciept. At that point, money/goods already changed hands and contract formed. The T&C on the reciept should not apply.
 
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