[mobbaddict]

I've been going back and forth comparing the Avantone Planar with the LCD-X and it's crazy how similar they are but the Avantone Planar is for me, the grown up and matured LCD-X. The LCD-X is a great headphone, but only has a few things that it can bring to the fight. Firstly build. Build is superior on the LCD-X. No questions asked, its simple. LCD-X wins. Secondly is the low end impact and slam. If you want bass kick, the LCD-X gives it. But that is it. The Planar for me does everything else better for me. Low end quality I already can say a few of us agree is stellar on the Planar, some of the best low end. The detail and texturing pops. The mid range is much more accurate, natural, detailed and clearer on the Planar. The treble is smoother, more accurate on the Planar while the LCD-X gets a little boost on the higher frequencies which can give some nice energy but also make things feel a bit unnatural. Imaging, instrument separation and soundstage goes to the Planar. Price to performance also goes to the Planar. With eq, same story, Planar is the pick for me. This just makes me more curious to try out some new earpads. And I also do feel that the more use, the drivers do tighten up and become cleaner. I'm not going to get into this burn in topic. Some do believe and some don't. From my experience, yes " driver/tranducer burn in" is a thing. But also our own ears and brain getting used to a sound signature is a thing as well. But from day one to now with the Planar, so a few months now, yes I have heard slight changes. I actually like listening to it without EQ now. But I still do use eq as well. What impresses me most is the price to performance of this headphone. You can read about the LCD-X vs Focal Clear, Ananda/Arya and a few other headphones and the LCD-X always puts a massive fight. For me to find the Planar to be a better technical performer and also have better tonality is crazy. But its true for me. Already a bunch of people prefer the Planar to all these higher end headphones. Do I need to list them? Nah, you guys already know which headphones. Avantone has made a very special gem here. Yes it has its flaws. Not perfect. But if Avantome were to up their game and make a MKII, with better pads and also replaceable optional pads. Better cable and choice to be used balanced. Better build quality. And somehow make the overall tuning even better. For all around the same price. It could be an end-game for some. My experience with the Planar has been nothing short of stellar. I love it more and more. I'll hopefully be ordering some new earpads soon. Still deciding what type. Most like velour or Alcantara, Alcantara really has my interest.

I will also add my final opinion on the Avantone versus the Quad Era-1 as well. I've been comparing them extensively, using the same earpads on both of them (mostly the Brainwavz but also found a way to use the Dekonis on both). To my ears they sound super close. It's funny how most tuning differences actually come from the stock earpads, rather than from the transducers which are extremely similar.

Not much to say except for this: the Quad is a hair faster than the Avantone, and you have to go back and forth between the two to find this out. But both can compete with entry-level electrostats so I will say this is more than satisfying to me.
On other hand, the Avantone has a slight edge in terms of balance and soundstage. It just sounds a little more natural (smoother) and open, making for a more lifelike experience, despite the slightly slower transients. Ideally I would have to get custom earpads for both headphones to decide which one I should keep, but I feel like taking a leap of faith with the Avantone, it's just closer to my ideal headphone.

I feel like a higher-end version of the Planar with faster transients would be like a giant killer. I mean, how many high-end headphones have this kind of tuning?

 

[HardstyleLoco96]

Thanks @HardstyleLoco96 ! You‘re not aiming to do so, but these kinds of posts cure any upgraditus I might come up with. Will try out some different pads at some point though.

I don't think upgrading will be needed but a headphone with different tonality would be awesome. I am looking at a few other headphones that I may get. Not because I want to upgrade, but because each headphone is unique and used for difderent music or purpose. My Avantone Planar is my clean, analytical headphone. My Ultrasone Edition 11 is my fun dynamic, my Audeze Sine DX is my portable/transportable, etc. Headphones for different days, different sounds. There will never be one headphone that can do all . I wouldn't look for an upgrade but instead, sidegrades. Something just as good, but very different

 

[HardstyleLoco96]

Is there any measurement of the same headphone before and after the alleged "burn in" period? That seems like the most obvious test to do on this topic. I think I've seen some for dynamic headphones but not sure about planars.
Edit: found a good one here
https://www.rtings.com/headphones/learn/break-in


I was thinking about the right earpads for you and like you said maybe the hybrid would be a good match since you like a little bit of sparkle in your top end. I don't think I've heard any alcantara earpads but I'm curious about it as well. Looks like a compromise between leather and velour in terms of frequency response. My empirical view on this is that most high-end headphones go for leather, I would instinctually try to get similar material. Stax headphones for instance use leather and have both fantastic speed and timbre.

Leather was my first choice but then I saw they have Alcantara which is what Focal use. Alcantara is also very comfortable and breathes better than leather. I could maybe do a fenestrated Alcantara pad as it retains the low end.

 

[HardstyleLoco96]

I will also add my final opinion on the Avantone versus the Quad Era-1 as well. I've been comparing them extensively, using the same earpads on both of them (mostly the Brainwavz but also found a way to use the Dekonis on both). To my ears they sound super close. It's funny how most tuning differences actually come from the stock earpads, rather than from the transducers which are extremely similar.

Not much to say except for this: the Quad is a hair faster than the Avantone, and you have to go back and forth between the two to find this out. But both can compete with entry-level electrostats so I will say this is more than satisfying to me.
On other hand, the Avantone has a slight edge in terms of balance and soundstage. It just sounds a little more natural (smoother) and open, making for a more lifelike experience, despite the slightly slower transients. Ideally I would have to get custom earpads for both headphones to decide which one I should keep, but I feel like taking a leap of faith with the Avantone, it's just closer to my ideal headphone.

I feel like a higher-end version of the Planar with faster transients would be like a giant killer. I mean, how many high-end headphones have this kind of tuning?

I agree with alot you say. But from my experience, I feel the Planar is one of the fastest drivers I've heard on a headphone. I remember the Quad even though it has been a while since I've listened to them. But from my experience I feel the Planar would be faster than the Quad. Could it be the amp pairing? I'm not sure. But the Planar is fast, very fast. Faster than any Audeze, faster than the Focal Clear, high up there with the Arya in terms of transients. I do believe and feel the Planar do tighten up and clean up a good amount with more power into them. But the Quad is no slouch either. But I can 100% say the Planar is faster than a Meze Empyrean. While I love the Empyrean for what it is. And visually one of my most favourite headphones (sexier than the Utopia & LCD-4) the tuning on the Empyrean is very smooth and laidback while it presents alot of detail. It's a high end headphone for sure. Maybe one day I will get myself one as I do love it. But I do feel the Planar beats it out in terms of tonality and transients. The Planar for me is a faster headphone. So in terms of speed/transients. The Planar is high up their.

 

[mobbaddict]

I agree with alot you say. But from my experience, I feel the Planar is one of the fastest drivers I've heard on a headphone. I remember the Quad even though it has been a while since I've listened to them. But from my experience I feel the Planar would be faster than the Quad. Could it be the amp pairing?

It could be the amp pairing yes. Honestly I don't hear a big difference between amps with the Avantone, I compared the K5 pro with the portable E5 for instance and the latter fares better than I expected. But I'm tempted to try a THX amp to see how far it can go in terms of detail retrieval.
I haven't heard a TOTL planar for a long time now but I find it impressive that you rate the Avantone higher than the Empyrean.

 

[smorgar]

I've said it before but the Avantone Planar and the Acmee MF-01 DAP is the best pairing I have come across. Not only for the Planars but anything I have ever listened to.
I honestly prefer this combo over my RME ADI-2 DAC FS. Must be the Muses02 OpAmp preamp inside the MF-01 that delivers the magic.
Its clear, punchy and very smooth and vivid. Super detailed but yet smooth with massive authority.
If you ever get the chance to listen to this DAP bring your Planars!

 

[HardstyleLoco96]

It could be the amp pairing yes. Honestly I don't hear a big difference between amps with the Avantone, I compared the K5 pro with the portable E5 for instance and the latter fares better than I expected. But I'm tempted to try a THX amp to see how far it can go in terms of detail retrieval.
I haven't heard a TOTL planar for a long time now but I find it impressive that you rate the Avantone higher than the Empyrean.

No, I wouldn't rate it higher as I do feel the Empyrean does do some things a little bit better. But when it comes to price to performance, the Planar is amazing at that and the Planar can put up a fight. You have been saying that you may end up selling either the Quad or Planar. But why not just keep both? They both are great headphones

 

[mobbaddict]

No, I wouldn't rate it higher as I do feel the Empyrean does do some things a little bit better. But when it comes to price to performance, the Planar is amazing at that and the Planar can put up a fight. You have been saying that you may end up selling either the Quad or Planar. But why not just keep both? They both are great headphones

Yeah but I would have expected the Empyrean to be faster than that! I don't see the point naming these TOTL if they don't do any better technically than mid-priced headphones.

Regarding the Quads no I need to sell them, I'm a one headphone guy lol I keep the others mostly for the sake of comparing, which in the end is not a very sane behavior. But the Avantone works with 100% of the music I listen to and for my tastes so I need to be realistic. I could get a better amp instead (the Avantone does sound more transparent with the k5 so with a THX hmm...).

 

[mobbaddict]

Guys, what is your best song choice for judging detail retrieval? I'm doing blind tests between the k5 pro and the E5 and I'm completely lost been the two There's just no point getting a THX amp if I mistake it with a 20$ portable amp. The Avantone sounds great with both.

 

[KCXT]

Guys, what is your best song choice for judging detail retrieval? I'm doing blind tests between the k5 pro and the E5 and I'm completely lost been the two There's just no point getting a THX amp if I mistake it with a 20$ portable amp. The Avantone sounds great with both.

IMO detail retrieval is always best done using tracks that you're intimately familiar with so that you can really gauge what is there and what isn't. I also personally feel that detail dovetails with imaging/resolution, so that may differ from how others think of detail.

With that said some of my go-tos include:

• "Wicked Ones" by Adam Jensen - tons of fluttering/layering, background vocals, and high/low tones all throughout the song
• "Forever" by Kid Rock - for this one, it's specifically the very quiet high hats in the background at the start.
• "American Boy" by Estelle w/ Kanye - the bass octaves and jumps/falls show me how well the headphones can handle quick bass moves and tease out the nuance, and there is a lot of echo/reverb on her voice that doesn't always come through on lesser-resolving headphones
• "BFG Division" by Mick Gordon - a busy electronic metal instrumental with a ton going on, but everything has its own space and place and there is good panning left and right. Can a headphone pull it all out without turning into a jumbled mess?

 

[mobbaddict]

IMO detail retrieval is always best done using tracks that you're intimately familiar with so that you can really gauge what is there and what isn't. I also personally feel that detail dovetails with imaging/resolution, so that may differ from how others think of detail.

With that said some of my go-tos include:

• "Wicked Ones" by Adam Jensen - tons of fluttering/layering, background vocals, and high/low tones all throughout the song
• "Forever" by Kid Rock - for this one, it's specifically the very quiet high hats in the background at the start.
• "American Boy" by Estelle w/ Kanye - the bass octaves and jumps/falls show me how well the headphones can handle quick bass moves and tease out the nuance, and there is a lot of echo/reverb on her voice that doesn't always come through on lesser-resolving headphones
• "BFG Division" by Mick Gordon - a busy electronic metal instrumental with a ton going on, but everything has its own space and place and there is good panning left and right. Can a headphone pull it all out without turning into a jumbled mess?

Thanks, will try these tonight Yesterday I tested mostly acoustic recordings (classical, pop, bossa nova) as I think these usually have very fine details.

 

[HardstyleLoco96]

Yeah but I would have expected the Empyrean to be faster than that! I don't see the point naming these TOTL if they don't do any better technically than mid-priced headphones.

Regarding the Quads no I need to sell them, I'm a one headphone guy lol I keep the others mostly for the sake of comparing, which in the end is not a very sane behavior. But the Avantone works with 100% of the music I listen to and for my tastes so I need to be realistic. I could get a better amp instead (the Avantone does sound more transparent with the k5 so with a THX hmm...).

I think the reason why you may not be hearing much difference could be your DAC. Usually what I find is the better the DAC, a better AMP will be more revealing of that DAC. From my experience with the Planar, its very revealing of the DAC and AMP being used. From my Fiio Q5S I do hear noticeably less soundstage, detail and transients slows down a bit. Same as my M500 vs SH9 and SH9 vs other amps. But I have come across where cheaper devices have sounded better than more expensive devices, example being the E1DA 9038D vs Fiio Q5S. Usually I like the Fiio Q5S more most of the time but with the Planar, I liked the 9038D a bit more. I sounded that little bit smoother. So at the end of the day, ultimate judge is your eyes. Is there any way maybe you could go to an audio store and try out different dacs and amps?

 

[mobbaddict]

I think the reason why you may not be hearing much difference could be your DAC. Usually what I find is the better the DAC, a better AMP will be more revealing of that DAC. From my experience with the Planar, its very revealing of the DAC and AMP being used. From my Fiio Q5S I do hear noticeably less soundstage, detail and transients slows down a bit. Same as my M500 vs SH9 and SH9 vs other amps. But I have come across where cheaper devices have sounded better than more expensive devices, example being the E1DA 9038D vs Fiio Q5S. Usually I like the Fiio Q5S more most of the time but with the Planar, I liked the 9038D a bit more. I sounded that little bit smoother. So at the end of the day, ultimate judge is your eyes. Is there any way maybe you could go to an audio store and try out different dacs and amps?

I don't think the issue is the DAC itself because I have headphones that resolve a little bit more detail with the same source. The Quad is a hair more resolving and my underpowered Stax SR-007 is even more resolving. You'd be surprised how much detail we can pull out from even a cheap dac like the Chromecast audio. Also I got the K5 pro because I wanted to experience a proper "audiophile" dac (I know it's an entry-level dac) and the fact is I can't really tell the difference from the Chromecast audio. Actually subjectively I prefer the latter. Have you ever tried blind testing your gear? You could be surprised

Regarding amps I've been reading lots of stuff about THX lately but also about the RNHP which some people rave out for a more natural sound. Maybe it's all just placebo but I'm curious. I'm considering trying this from Thomann with their 30 day return policy. I think that's a pretty fair deal.

 

[mobbaddict]

Dang so I got a feedback from Vesper Audio and they don't do perforations on real leather, only on synthetic leather. I don't know what to do, my Brainwavz pads are made of synthetic leather and I believe the timbre is worse than real leather. I could order non perforated pads but I'm a bit wary of bloated bass performance. Maybe hybrid is the solution.

Apparently they had a few orders from other Avantone owners besides @Heldaeus , guys please share your feedbacks

 

[Heldaeus]

Dang so I got a feedback from Vesper Audio and they don't do perforations on real leather, only on synthetic leather. I don't know what to do, my Brainwavz pads are made of synthetic leather and I believe the timbre is worse than real leather. I could order non perforated pads but I'm a bit wary of bloated bass performance. Maybe hybrid is the solution.

Apparently they had a few orders from other Avantone owners besides @Heldaeus , guys please share your feedbacks

The real leather they use is not very thick and I imagine it’s similar to synthetic but my leather pads are not perforated and they definitely bloat the bass. I might mod the leather pads further and add my own perforations.