Sponsor: EarMen | HeadAmpMember of the Trade: Bricasti DesignFormerly known as Mshenay
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So I just got my Hifiman HM 901 and ironically enough, on the same day I got it I found my old Gen3iPod Nano 4GB which is about 7 years old now. And despite the need to push a little harder it still works just fine!
So I asked my self... what is the differance between my old set up and my new?
Total cost for both is listed in italics if your curious
Stage 1 is OLD Rig vs New
The review Stage 1 not so much Gear vs Gear, but "thoughts n Habbits VS Thoughts n Habbits" Stage 1 pits how I used to think again'st how I now think.
The old mind set is represented by the iPod Rig, 256 V0 Mp3s and headphone out of the iPod into a low Fi Can
The New Mind Set is represented by the HM901 Rig, all Lossless LINE out into the PB2 n W1000X
For the First Part of the Experiment, I'll be listening with my
Allesandro MS1i {Black Walt Nut Cups} right out of the iPods Headphone Jack. No EQ, Running MP3 V0 [$300ish]
VS
Hifiman HM901 Line out iBasso PB2 [LME 49990OPAmps DummyBuffers] Balanced Out to Modded ATH W1000X [$2000ish]
I'll be using the following Album, I feel it features a great mix elements and is just an excellent album!
As a world music band, there is a mix of both male n Female Vocals, pounding drums, a little bass guitar here and there, with a touch of shouting and some Throat Singing! Really a whole gambit of musical sounds to enjoy.
My hm901 has Lossless Flacs, my iPod has MP3 V0 Transcodes from said Flacs
Stage 2 DAC vs DAC
Running Line out of Each Unit into the iBasso PB2 with LME 49990 OP Amps, also each player will be running lossless. ALAC on the iPod and FLAC on the hm901
Going to Change up the Music a little more, get a nice 7 Song Play list for each rig. In Addition Stage 2 Will feature multiple headphones, for the time being the W1000x will be the main headphone used. My Senn Grado Impressions [balanced out] will be added when it arrives. The Same will be said for my LA D5k as well.
In addition each set up is volume matched, I'm using a Shure Dynamic Transducer microphone and monitoring input levels via Audacity.
Stage 3
Will include the NFB10ES2 [Line Out Dac] into the mix, using the same Tracks.
Line Level Matching Rig
This is my Level Matching Rig, the drivers of each Headphone sit about an inch from the center of the Mic, again I'm using Audacity to monitor the input Levels and matching them accordingly.
Stick Around for my Impressions! And feel free to comment, I figured this might be the most effective way for my to gauge if the thousands of dollars I've spent over the last few years are really worth it, and something worth reading for some of our new members who are curious about "whats so great about that," that of course being Hi Fidelity Music
Stages 1 and Stage Two Impression will have their own posts
I'm also going to add UI and Build Quality to the Stage 1 Impression Post
Sponsor: EarMen | HeadAmpMember of the Trade: Bricasti DesignFormerly known as Mshenay
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Stage 1 Impressions
The review Stage 1 not so much Gear vs Gear, but "thoughts n Habbits VS Thoughts n Habbits" Stage 1 pits how I used to think again'st how I now think.
The old mind set is represented by the iPod Rig, 256 V0 Mp3s and headphone out of the iPod into a low Fi Can
The New Mind Set is represented by the HM901 Rig, all Lossless LINE out into the PB2 n W1000X
Tracked used are DaiQuing Tana & Haya Band: Migration
I started with one hour on Rig 1,
To start with my music sounds pretty dead... I spent about an hour listening to Rig one and it was... sufficient really. The music was pretty Flat, dynamics where kinda meh. There was no magical moments, no "WOW" moments for me just a lot of meh. That an I could hear a touch of grain on the top end, maybe not grain... maybe static... just a little noisy at the top. Over all very meh, not to much texture either, that and there was little sense of emotion.
Then one Hour on Rig 2
Ahh, there's some life back in the music! Additionally, there's a nice touch of textures and dynamics, loud sounds LOUD and soft sounds are quiet, not to mention even though I'm using a closed back, the sound is much more open and spacious. There's also a really nice sense of left to right movement, not only is the sound stage it self bigger but there's a greater sense of movement within it. In addition there's movement in the depth as well, some of the songs are very playful and you can get a sense of that through the movement within the track!
User Interface
User interface is where the iPod and hm901 are pretty evenly matched, with the iPod offering a simpler UI
And it even has games too!
The HM901 also has a nice interface, in fact I prefer it as I think it's a little simpler, though not as easy to learn. I'm using the new Taichi 2.0 UI
UI is a little more cut an dry but just as easy to use. Though some Features aren't as obvious to figure out.
Build Quality
[size=small]Sadly for Build Quality, the iPod is clearly step above. I mean that in terms of durability, my iPod is 7 years old and has held up amazingly well, still feels great and buttons are very responsive, my HM901 is a week old and the scroll wheel still isn't as smooth an responsive as the old iPod...[/size]
[size=small]Battery Life[/size]
[size=small]The iPod even Line out Takes the cake here, it's got a great battery life! The HM901 on the other hand... your lucky to get 5 hours out of it! Sadly though, neither of them Can Charge AND run Line out at the same time [/size]
[size=small]So sound aside, I feel the iPod does a really great job of offering a simple to use UI and great battery life on top of a rock solid Build Quality. Though it should be noted that Hifiman has plans for a HM901s in which they plan to offer a free upgrade to HM901 Owners. The new S unit promises to bring a re designed shell to the HM 901, so we will see what Hifiman does! Let's hope they learned a thing or two from companies like Apple, who offer gorgeously well built and simple products. [/size]
Sponsor: EarMen | HeadAmpMember of the Trade: Bricasti DesignFormerly known as Mshenay
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1 Michigan & Smiley- Sugar Daddy: Sugar Daddy
Reggae tune, has a nice male vocal n smooth bass 2 Skream - Pass the Red Stripe
Dub Step Tune, deep Waves of Textured Sub Bass
3 DaiQing Tana & Haya Band - Migration : Gayatri
Overall Balance of Sound, strong Female Vocals
4 Animals As Leaders - The Joy Of Motion: The Woven Web
Metal, emphasis on Speed and overall balance.
5 Various Artists - Tales of Symphonia OST : Deepest Woods
Orchestral OST, amazing track for gentle, subtle tactile mids
Stage Two Impressions
Stage Two is a more critical look at the iPod Nano and Hifiman HM901 as DAP, each unit will be ran Line Out into my iBasso PB2 Amp and w1000X/ LA D5k
Track 1 Impressions
W1000X
I was a little suprised by this switch up, the HM 901 has an immediate increase in space, it has a much more open sound. But compared to the iPod the HM901 Vocals are a touch taken back. The iPod had a simpler presentation with the Vocals right up front, the HM901 interjects a greater sense of space but also brings the Bass forward and the mids back a touch, though the more spacious sound makes neither the bass over whelming nor the Mids sounding "sucked out."
Again, the iPod shows a warm "intimate" sound, as opposed to the dark and spacious HM901
LA D5k
Hmm this is a hard one to call, the HM 901 is again more spacious, has better decay throughout and is darker... but for Reggae the warmer intimate sound of the iPod is a little more enjoyable over the HM901 Dark an spacious sound. It's the addition of the sound stage that leaves the Vocals feeling a touch distant on the LA D5k with the HM 901, though I think for this track. For Reggae it's going to be a matter of personal taste. Some may like the dark and spacious sound of the HM901 with the LA D5k, others may like the iPods more warm an intimate tone.
Track 2 Impressions
LA D5k
I'll be honest, I was half tempted not to even listen to the iPod. Dark and Spacious is how I like my DubStep. My bias aside, the iPod really can't compare to the HM901. The HM901 bass is faster, tighter, has a touch more aggression to it and is just... well better. The iPod is a little loose n sloppy compared to the HM 901.
No contest here unless you like your bass a loose sloppy mess.
W1000X
Now here, for this tracks it's a bit of a reverse! Out of the HM901 the W1000X had a very lack luster sound with this track. Mostly due to the W1000Xs rolled off sub bass and mild mid bass hump [and it's overall lack of decay in general] So here, with a much drier and cleaner headphone I do slightly prefer the sloppy mess that is the iPods bass response combined with the super lean W1000X
Track 3 Impression
W1000X
Really no contest here, the HM 901 is cleaner, has better dynamics and spacial presentation. Not to mention the bass is much cleaner and the overall sound is more balanced. Mirco details are also better with the HM901, each of the little intricate parts of the song is more apparent and present with the HM 901, you lose a lot of emotion and personality in this track with the iPod.
LA D5k
I'm leaning more towards the HM901 across the board here, while I like the touch of intimacy the iPod adds to this track with the LA D5K, the iPod can also sound a little to closed in, where as the HM 901 can be a tad to distant... it still remains very lovely personal feel with the song. Though out of either player, the LA D5ks bass overshadows any of the intricacy of the track.
Track 4 Impressions
W1000x
So, again words like "well layered" and "clean" are going to define the HM 901, with the warmth and intimacy of the iPod bring nothing worth while to the table for this track. The HM 901 proves it self better also in it's speed, the metal guitar riffs, the bass drum and guitar, everything just has more bite out of the HM 901 a little more attack and less decay. Not to mention the HM901 is again more spacious and better layered.
LA D5k
Not sure if it's the sheer fact that I've been listening to this song for like an hour now... but the two units sound very simmilar with the LA D5k, for sure the HM901 doesn't have the guitars as forward as the iPod does, but the iPods not quiet as quick nor does it have the nice crunch that the HM901 has. I'm going to give this track to the HM 901 as well. It's bring just a little more needed energy to the LA D5k over the iPod.
Track 5 Impressions
W1000X
Once again, the iPod shows it self to be a little bit warmer and having more decay. The low notes sound very bloated, not to mention the dynamics and sound stage are lacking. Where as the HM901 [line out Level Matched] is spacious, with a delicate sound. The iPod is flatter and warmer, it's not as dramatic either in dynamics. "squashed" is the right word to describe how the iPod Line Out Sounds.
So the iPod is really showing it self to be some what warm and intimate in comparison to the HM 901
LA D5k
Again the LA D5k isn't the most reavealing headphone on the face of this planet, one thing I did notice was the HM 901 had a bit more texture in the mids. Though for this quiet and slow piece both DAPS did an excellent job with the LA D5k
[size=medium]Stage 2 Results[/size]
All in all, I found that with transparent headphones or some of the brighter and more revealing headphones the HM 901 proves to be a great dac for these units, over whelming the iPod in many circumstances.
In addition, when it comes to dynamic changes and imaging the HM 901 takes the cake.
Though the two each have a different tone, the HM 901 being, dark spacious and very energetic. The HM 901 brings a great level of detail, space and speed to the classic "fun" Hifiman Sound. It is the perfection of the Hifiman Sound I came to love in my old HM 601 and HM 801 units!
With the iPod being more laid back, a little smooth and a touch intimate.
All in all I'm pleased with the results, and I'm happy to admit that the DAC unit in the iPod is better than I thought it once was. While it still lacks the sound stage and imaging of DAPS like the Hm 801 and 901, it does still offer a good quality of sound! Of course, there is better!
Track 4 Initial Impressions The iPod is rather closed in, in comparison to the NFB10ES2 Line out, not only that but the low mids and bass are really freaking forward, in comparison to the NFB10ES2. I think it's the some what warmer sound of the iPod that really closes up the sound stage. It's also some what loose in the bass as well, where as the NFB10ES2 [Line Out] is much cleaner and a little quicker. There is just a LOT of body and un needed decay in the sound, which causes you to lose a lot of texture and micro detail.
Overall, the iPod is showing it self as a very warm and some what flat source. For this metal track, the low mids and upper bass are much to forward for the track.
The NFB10ES2 has a much cleaner, sound to it. In short the iPod is Warm, where as the NFB10ES2 is dark.
Track 5
Once again, the iPod shows it self to be a little bit warmer and having more decay. The low notes sound very bloated, not to mention the dynamics and sound stage are lacking. Where as the NFB10ES 2 [line out Level Matched] is spacious, with a delicate sound. The iPod is flatter and warmer, it's not as dramatic either in dynamics. "squashed" is the right word to describe how the iPod Line Out Sounds.
The above stands, the iPod is warm and not nearly as spacious as the, Dark and well layered NFB10ES2
Last Note
I'm now comparing the NFB10ES2 [Line Out] to the HM901 Line Out and you know what sounds different?
The Bass of the HM901 has a touch more body n Decay.
An the NFB10ES2 has a touch more aggression. Most likely due to the reduced Bass Decay in comparison to the HM901
That's it. Sound stage width, and depth is neck n neck. Mids are the same, in attack and decay. The Top end is the same to, the only difference is the HM901 has a smidge more body in it's bass.
An the reason I mention this is because, both the HM901 and NFB10ES2 use the same ESS Sabre 9018 Dac Unit. Now the implementation of each unit into the circuit does change the sound, with the NFB10ES2 [A Balanced Dac mind you] Having a cleaner bass and just a lil more aggression.
Now Both units are being run into my iBasso PB2, and the last thing I have to note is the NFB10ES2 cost me like $650, the HM901 and iBasso PB2 ran me around $1300 You can draw your own conclusions there.
A far more effective test would be to use the same headphone, and let the two DAPs go head-to-head with no other amplification. For this I'd suggest using the MS1i as they are easiest to drive. The problem with your set up at the moment is that you're changing every component - so you can't isolate where the improvements are.
A far more effective test would be to use the same headphone, and let the two DAPs go head-to-head with no other amplification. For this I'd suggest using the MS1i as they are easiest to drive. The problem with your set up at the moment is that you're changing every component - so you can't isolate where the improvements are.
lol... yea, if you use different headphones & one is amped vs non-amped... that is already a big set of confounding variables that makes it difficult to talk about the relative performance of the two DAPs. Stage 1 experiment isn't really set-up in a way to conclude anything about the specific differences in performance of the two DAPs.
A far more effective test would be to use the same headphone, and let the two DAPs go head-to-head with no other amplification. For this I'd suggest using the MS1i as they are easiest to drive. The problem with your set up at the moment is that you're changing every component - so you can't isolate where the improvements are.
A far more effective test would be to use the same headphone, and let the two DAPs go head-to-head with no other amplification. For this I'd suggest using the MS1i as they are easiest to drive. The problem with your set up at the moment is that you're changing every component - so you can't isolate where the improvements are.
Now this is also a some what valid point, except that the MS1i isn't too reavealing, an you've missed the pourpose of Stage 1. My first rig was my iPod and a Koss TD 75, which sounds a lot like the MS1i [you need a picture of the headphone or are we going to argue that point as well] I was curious... how does that compare the new new TOTL Rig? What did I gain by coming to head fi and spending all this money. Thus Stage 1's pourpose is to compare the entry level I used to listen to back in the day, to the TOTL that I now listen to
Oh and for level matching, I got my self a Dynamic transducer Microphone and I use Audacity to monitor the DB levels as it generates an average for input level, once the input level is matched I begin my listening.
The more objective impressions are within the second listening stage, which I may start today, if my LOD Cable arrives on time
I appreciate that, Brooko has some valid points. I need to clean up the original post a little more and some better details into the Stage one Impressions. I'm also going to review my Alessandro Music Series MS1i [Walnut Cups] so that we can have a more subjective understanding of the two headphones in each rig.
But thanks, glad the idea is getting across. Just need to organize my findings a little better!
Like I said - no agro intended, and was genuinely curious on where you were going. I still see little point if you're not comparing with the same headphones though - as there will be more difference between them than any other single factor (amps/source).
Not my review though - so I will await the updates with interest!
Like I said - no agro intended, and was genuinely curious on where you were going. I still see little point if you're not comparing with the same headphones though - as there will be more difference between them than any other single factor (amps/source).
Not my review though - so I will await the updates with interest!
Well Brooko the issue is we've had dozens of conversations like this. I've come to have an understanding of your tone when your write, now others who follow behind your thinking may assume your taking an agressive tone and they follow. You speak your mind, I understand and accecpt that, there fore we move forward together and are the better for it. That Big freaking Mic... that is Brookos Influance on me :3, I used to use a Cell Phone, but now I have a MIC
To which I thank Brooko, each time he takes the time to speak his mind and give me some relevant tips
to the others who have this attitude, I have no need or want for your input, or rather your insults. Your welcome to read and comment as you like but keep your baseless insults to yourself
Is this a joke? Seriously? I mean.. Geez.. I have nothing to add on what Brooko has said.
I feel bad for the people who takes your findings seriously.
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Well the hm901 was left on for the last 4 hours and it Died :/
so I just jumped ahead and started my Stage 3 Impressions
They are listed in the orignal post as well as here.
Track 4 Initial Impressions The iPod is rather closed in, in comparison to the NFB10ES2 Line out, not only that but the low mids and bass are really freaking forward, in comparison to the NFB10ES2. I think it's the some what warmer sound of the iPod that really closes up the sound stage. It's also some what loose in the bass as well, where as the NFB10ES2 [Line Out] is much cleaner and a little quicker. There is just a LOT of body and un needed decay in the sound, which causes you to lose a lot of texture and mirco detail.
Overall, the iPod is showing it self as a very warm and some what flat source. For this metal track, the low mids and upper bass are much to forward for the track.
The NFB10ES2 has a much cleaner, sound to it. In short the iPod is Warm, where as the NFB10ES2 is dark.
Track 5
Once again, the iPod shows it self to be a little bit warmer and having more decay. The low notes sound very bloated, not to mention the dynamics and sound stage are lacking. Where as the NFB10ES 2 [line out Level Matched] is spacious, with a delicate sound. The iPod is flatter and warmer, it's not as dramatic either in dynamics. "squashed" is the right word to describe how the iPod Line Out Sounds.
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