[GoRedwings19]

hey dudes thanks for all the advice. I live in the UK and the parts are usually more expensive not to mention we are kicking butt in the £/$ ratio so it makes sense that I would get more value of money in a kind of ironic sense.

 

[JWFokker]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMOS For your question on which video card... These days it depends more on which games you play, which engines they use, and who they are aligned with. ATI and nVidia now play favourites with the game producers. If you play Half Life 2 and its eventual derivatives, ATI is the best FPS (not that nVidia is a slouch). The opposite holds true for Doom3. I expect these types of shenanigans to continue indefinetely...

In my opinion, there's no question whether to get Nvidia or ATI. As much as I like ATI products and dislike Doom 3 and it's derivatives, Nvidia has SLI and ATI doesn't. Who knows when multirendering will see the light of day? And then you've got PS 3.0 to consider. Since he's not willing to wait another few months for the newest batch of graphics hardware, of which ATI may or may not support PS 3.0 still, I think the only option for high end hardware is the 6800 GT. There's no real benefit to the Ultra since the GTs overclock to within a few Mhz. The GT is definitely the way to go in my eyes. And SLI'd GTs will handle Source engined games quite handily so there's no worries there.

 

[JWFokker]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMOS For monitor, I'd really suggest a Dell LCD, as much as it pains me to say so. They really are the best deals around. You should be able to pull together some rebates... what country are you in exactly? The 20" widescreen Dell is quite nice. I'm somewhat impatiently waiting for the 24" one...

Dells are just repackaged Samsungs if you take them apart. Check out their 1000:1 contrast ratio monitors. They're all 910T's.

But I guess it should be noted that sometimes Dell runs good deals on their monitors and you could potentially get one for less than it would cost you to buy a Samsung.

 

[ajt976]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gsferrari Support plan? what support plan? most of their desktops are shipped without HDD screws...wires flailing about...DOA laptops and desktops.

OMG, so freakin true. I used to work at Best Buy, and at one time we did sell Alienware products. Best Buy Inc. eventually stopped doing business with them though because of their LACK of customer support. We got all kinds of horror stories of the kinds of things that happened to peoples computers. One guy had his desktop shipped only to have nothing come on the screen...the morons somehow snapped his $600 PCI-E graphics card in half. Another more frustrating experience was when we had a guy who ordered a laptop from them, big mistake. You know how they have all those metallic colors? His was supposed to be blue, and the top of it was. But, they had forgotten to paint the bottom of his computer!!! All the parts were different colors and such, grey battery here, black plastic there, and all of it was supposed to be blue. What a nightmare, personally I wouldn't deal with them.

 

[GoRedwings19]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JWFokker In my opinion, there's no question whether to get Nvidia or ATI. As much as I like ATI products and dislike Doom 3 and it's derivatives, Nvidia has SLI and ATI doesn't. Who knows when multirendering will see the light of day? And then you've got PS 3.0 to consider. Since he's not willing to wait another few months for the newest batch of graphics hardware, of which ATI may or may not support PS 3.0 still, I think the only option for high end hardware is the 6800 GT. There's no real benefit to the Ultra since the GTs overclock to within a few Mhz. The GT is definitely the way to go in my eyes. And SLI'd GTs will handle Source engined games quite handily so there's no worries there.

It's not a question of I am not willing to wait. But I don't know how much life is left in my laptop. If I had to guesstimate it I reckon about two-three months. The monitor of the laptop might be another month. I could pick up a cheap and nasty monitor I suppose to tide me over. I am in the dark about computers so I need the common sense advice of you dudes. If you feel that it might be worth waiting a little longer than I suppose I could if pushed.

 

[uzziah]

good take your time......figure out what you really want, what's good for YOU

things i doubt you'll change:
1. athlon64 venice or sandiego socket 939
2. 6800gt (leadtek is also excellent and has massive heatsink)

questionables
1. ram ( i suggest 2x512mb of gskill cas 2 ram if you overclock)
2. hdd's
3. case of course

blah blah

 

[erickoh]

If the HTPC is going to be used a lot for critical listening via your hifi system, then a quiet PC is really important. In fact, make it one of your top priorities.

I'm still regretting the amount of fan noise emitting from my HTPC

 

[Distroyed]

In regards to mobo's: Nearly all the Nforce 4 boards have a fan on the northbridge. And they're LOUD. 8000rpm, extremely annoying, high pitched sound. If you go the expensive, powerful route, you'll have to do some modding to quite the northbridge. I recommend a Zalman heatsync and throw a fan nearby since the heatsync's get pretty hot on these new boards (the FB123 is usually pretty nice). I got both the aforementioned products for a total of $16.

 

[DMOS]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JWFokker But I guess it should be noted that sometimes Dell runs good deals on their monitors and you could potentially get one for less than it would cost you to buy a Samsung.

You just made my point for me. The 20" widescreen is nearly the exact same as the gorgeous Apple 20incher, on differences coming in the backlight, controls, and obviously the material construction. Oh, and it costs like half of the Apple Studio model. With rebates.. man it gets even cheaper. If you need a monitor... this is something to look into. See what kind of rebates you can pull off from Dell UK for an LCD.

As for anything worth waiting for... nope. Now that Venice is here there's not much reason to wait. By the time you can get a dual core chip... there's still not going to be any real solid software to make use of it unless you are into serious content creation. All the current (and probably ones in development now) aren't multi-cpu friendly. As I said before, the next generation of cards isn't going to make the SLI-CPU power discrepancy go away, it's only going to make the gap larger. When a top end 2.6GHz A64 is holding back your frame rate... you might as well get in on the best deal of today (6800GT) and think that when the next ones come out it makes picking up that second 6800GT cheaper. Are you planning on playing games through your plasma, and what resolution is it? Depending on that, you might not need SLI anyway. If its a 1024x720 one a single card will handle that like nothing. 1920x1024 on the other hand, you'll need SLI if you want to turn on all the eye candy. There are also a limited number of games that support these "widescreen" resolutions. Many modern ones do, but older games certainly not.

 

[GoRedwings19]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMOS You just made my point for me. The 20" widescreen is nearly the exact same as the gorgeous Apple 20incher, on differences coming in the backlight, controls, and obviously the material construction. Oh, and it costs like half of the Apple Studio model. With rebates.. man it gets even cheaper. If you need a monitor... this is something to look into. See what kind of rebates you can pull off from Dell UK for an LCD. As for anything worth waiting for... nope. Now that Venice is here there's not much reason to wait. By the time you can get a dual core chip... there's still not going to be any real solid software to make use of it unless you are into serious content creation. All the current (and probably ones in development now) aren't multi-cpu friendly. As I said before, the next generation of cards isn't going to make the SLI-CPU power discrepancy go away, it's only going to make the gap larger. When a top end 2.6GHz A64 is holding back your frame rate... you might as well get in on the best deal of today (6800GT) and think that when the next ones come out it makes picking up that second 6800GT cheaper. Are you planning on playing games through your plasma, and what resolution is it? Depending on that, you might not need SLI anyway. If its a 1024x720 one a single card will handle that like nothing. 1920x1024 on the other hand, you'll need SLI if you want to turn on all the eye candy. There are also a limited number of games that support these "widescreen" resolutions. Many modern ones do, but older games certainly not.

Hey Dmos dude, thanks for all the advice as well as other headfiers. The plasma display will be watching movies via the PC. The games will most be played on a monitor.

I am not so sure on the soundcard bit though as I would like great sound quality for streaming music to my ML dac but I would still like sound from games.

I will do some reading up on PC's and stuff and then I will run some suggestions by you dudes and you can give me an opinion. Although I have looked at a coolermaster case. Is water cooling expensive?

 

[DMOS]

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoRedwings19 I am not so sure on the soundcard bit though as I would like great sound quality for streaming music to my ML dac but I would still like sound from games.

That's why I suggested two sound cards earlier in this thread. An Audigy2 for gaming (provides EAX effects in hardware) and is a good choice if you have a surround sound speaker setup. Then you keep a cheap Chaintech AV-710 as a transport for audio. If you are planning on using the outboard DAC for gaming as well with 2 channels, the audigy is kinda a waste.


Quote:

Originally Posted by GoRedwings19 Is water cooling expensive?

Yes and no. Crappy water cooling is cheap, probably moreso than a really good heatsink/fan. I built my excellent water cooling for around $200 canadian. You can also spend a lot more on that, it's just like audio. 90% of the best performance comes at decent cost, after that you can spend enormous amounts to get the last few % (silver waterblock, dual pumps, dual rads, peltier, chiller, etc). ~$220 US is around the best price/performance point of entry (copper block, quality pump, 120mm rad, resevoir, tubing), pretty much the cost of a Swiftech kit or Koolance Exos. Going cheaper means raiding the auto parts graveyard like I did, and milling your own block.

 

[dwin902]

Quote:

Originally Posted by XxATOLxX Another downside to buying Alienwares is there is no overclocking or modding capabilities, its basically like having a computer governor that doesnt let you do things to your bios where the true potential of a custom computer lies. They try to make up by giving you tech support and making you pay extra for an "extended warranty" Not to mention that they also jack up the prices like hell, that Aurora 7500 probably has extremely cheap ram and is slow. They also try to impress you by offering 2 gigs which is actually slower than 1 gig for gaming purposes.

I take issue with this. I've been using an Area 51 for 1.5 years now with no problems. Most of the components in the system are off-the-shelf, making all this nonsense about "slow" RAM ridiculous. How could Alienware market itself as a gaming-oriented manufacturer if it couldn't deliver top performance? Granted, they charge a premium over DIY, but you won't be getting extra performance with DIY. Alienware knows its market and it knows how to build gaming systems. They use top-grade components, and you pay (dearly, sometimes) for them, but in the end it's worked out very well for me. Their tech support is first-rate, answering obscure tech questions quickly and professionally. I can see why some might be put off by the high prices, but there is absolutely nothing that causes me to doubt that Alienware delivers to its customers where it matters: performance and support.

EDIT (I forgot about overclocking): My system was built with an off-the-shelf motherboard (Asus P4C800-E) and has many features for overclocking, as many as most overclockers will ever need. I'm sure Alienware considers their audience when including features in their own motherboards as well. No, overclocking is certainly not a problem with an Alienware machine (this isn't Dell, you know).

http://www.tribute.ca/QTTrailers/rent_lg.mov

 

[GokieKS]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMOS Dual core/cpu at the moment does nothing for games. The software side of things is way behind. Music and DVD playback require next to nothing for hardware requirements, any reasonably modern system can handle this. Even using directshow filters to clean up video, and any plugins you'll find for foobar etc. Using any nForce4 socket 939 board will allow you to put in any high end A64 now, and have the ability to upgrade later to a dual core model if that does suit your desires later. So far our tests for compatibilty are encouraging. The only thing I was really worried about was power requirements of dual core on the motherboard (PSUs have excess power to donate at the high end).

I wouldn't say it means "nothing" for game. How many of us actually play games in a completely single-task environment? By which I mean you close every other application running on your computer before you start the game? I even have a second computer whose primary purpose is to play games on, and I don't. And if I ever gamed on my primary system, I certainly wouldn't close the "always-on" programs (foobar2000/iTunes, Trillian, Firefox, Anti-Virus, etc) every time I want to play something. And in these "real-world" situations, dual-core will help - immensely (see AnandTech's review of the A64 X2s, under the "Gaming Multitasking Scenario" section). Same goes for non-game applications - you're even more likely to be multitasking. Some people (content creators) more than others, but it's a definite tangible benefit. I personally would buy a 4200+ X2 the day it drops to around $350 or so.

And we don't need *every* program to be designed to take advantage of multi-threaded system - just an OS that can do a good job of organising and assigning the programs to different processing threads. WinXP already does, to a limited extent, and I imagine that Longhorn will certainly do a better job of it, with the introduction of dual-core CPUs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JWFokker Dells are just repackaged Samsungs if you take them apart. Check out their 1000:1 contrast ratio monitors. They're all 910T's.

The Dell 1905LP uses a Samsung panel, but not all Dells use Samsung panels. Both of the 20" models (2001FP and 2005FPW) use LG.Philips panels.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JWFokker In my opinion, there's no question whether to get Nvidia or ATI. As much as I like ATI products and dislike Doom 3 and it's derivatives, Nvidia has SLI and ATI doesn't. Who knows when multirendering will see the light of day? And then you've got PS 3.0 to consider. Since he's not willing to wait another few months for the newest batch of graphics hardware, of which ATI may or may not support PS 3.0 still, I think the only option for high end hardware is the 6800 GT. There's no real benefit to the Ultra since the GTs overclock to within a few Mhz. The GT is definitely the way to go in my eyes. And SLI'd GTs will handle Source engined games quite handily so there's no worries there.

SLi is nice - if the only thing you do on the computer is play games. But even then, there are issues - widescreen gaming, especially, has been noted. And the inability to use multiple monitors with SLi is just a complete deal-breaker for me. And although ATI's next VPU has not been officially "confirmed" to support PS3.0, most sources indicate that it will, and I'd bet almost anything that it does.

 

[S_Dedalus]

Goredwings19, I suggest you head over to Xtremesystems.org. There's an incredible amount of information about all of the potential cooling/overclocking/tweaking options.
My own kneejerk reaction is to say "Wait till the end of next month." Unfortunately the way computer industry works, the R520 cards, even if released a month from now, might end up in stores in August.
If you want the latest and greatest, wait till the new ati dual pci-e boards show up. If you really just want a decent gaming machine, a 3700+ san diego, dfi nforce4 board, a couple of sticks of OCZ VX ram, a Radeon x800xl, and a pair of big seagate drives would keep you happy until ati's multi-vpu boards arrive, and both ati and nvidia release their new generation of cards. It'll probably be next year before any games will really take advantage of the new technology, and no, the 6xxx series from nvidia, while it supports PS3.0, does not really qualify. Just look at its craptastic performance with Splinter Cell chaos theory when using PS3.0. Its a lot like the way the FX series performed in PS2.0 games.

 

[Nandro]

I think that buying alienware isnt for me but I do use their configurator to check for parts that I would use to make my own. I believe the verdict is still out on ATI's MC system. Its going to be mute anyhow by year end, ati and NV will release their next gen cards. Not sure what ati's is (fudo?), and NV's G70? but they will supposidly again double performance. What a time to be in the market huh? Also as far as forums go www.overclockers.com is great as well. I gave up waiting on new stuff and go with the best current bargains and overclock. Thats what OC'ing used to be about. Not having the fastest, but the fastest for the money. I think video card wise the 6800 NU with 4 unlocked pixel pipes and 1 vertex oc'ed is probably best bang for the buck. As with anything this is my opinion and others will vary greatly.