[mfprez]

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[Solduios]

  So I've been researching headphones the past week and decided to go with the DT880's 250ohm (Pro HT version) after finding a good deal, and deciding they matched my needs best (music production & general listening).
They arrived earlier. I was expecting to be blown away as they are my first pair of high-end headphones after coming from the Sony MDR7506.

Initial impression is that I thought they sounded good, but I wasn't blown away. There is a lot I like about them, but the main problem I have is that the bass sounds slow & muddy, which for me, doesn't help with general clarity / instrument seperation across the range, making it sound 'drowned out' and the articulation in the higher frequencies not 'crisp'.

I listen to a lot of music from the 60s/70s, rock, jazz and world music. When I put on some more modern electronic music from the last decade they sounded much more at home, but again had problems with bass with some old school hip-hop.

Perhaps I'm looking for something a little less honest with more energy. They definitely lack energy, to my ears. But despite being honest, thus good for mixing, this muddy bass would put me off from mixing with them.

It is a shame because they are great in every other way - incredible comfort and have heard good things about durability.

I'm tempted to stick them out for a little while to see if I get more used to the sound signature, but thought I'd value some opinions on what to do.

Any recommendations of good alternatives?

Are you using an amp? Because if just using them straight off a computer or something similar they will not sound great due to being 250ohms they are fairly hard to drive.
 
Also what is your price range and do you want open or closed cans?

 

[Music Alchemist]

Yeah, be sure to use a decent amp and also experiment with EQ using the guides in my signature.
 
Some headphones I like more than the DT 880 (I owned the Edition/Premium 600 ohms version):
 
open: STAX SR-207, HIFIMAN HE400i, Sennheiser HD 650, Sennheiser HD 700
 
semi-open: Koss KTXPRO1
 
closed: Yamaha HPH-MT220, Focal Spirit Professional

 

[mfprez]

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[mfprez]

  Yeah, be sure to use a decent amp and also experiment with EQ using the guides in my signature.
 
Some headphones I like more than the DT 880 (I owned the Edition/Premium 600 ohms version):
 
open: STAX SR-207, HIFIMAN HE400i, Sennheiser HD 650, Sennheiser HD 700
 
semi-open: Koss KTXPRO1
 
closed: Yamaha HPH-MT220, Focal Spirit Professional

I'd prefer a headphone that sounds good without EQ as I'll be mixing with them. Do any of those headphones match with my description?

 

[Music Alchemist]

  Yes they are amped. I have a sound interface for music production which has a good headphone amp onboard, and at about 1/2 volume I'd consider it too loud. Also play with FLACs.

I got a good deal and bought them new in the price range of the ATH-M50X (which is my max). But I can consider more expensive headphones as I may find them cheap somewhere.

 
Okay, if ~$130 is your max and you want an open-back, I would recommend trying the Philips SHP9500 and this modification.
 
If you want a closed-back, the Audio-Technica ATH-M40x is decent. (More neutral than the M50x.)
 
If you are willing to buy used, your possibilities open up. I once got a vintage STAX system (which sounds more transparent to me than any non-electrostatic/electret headphone, though it's inferior in other ways) for under $100, for example.
 
Since you're into music production, EQ is a must. You might dislike a headphone stock, but then love it when equalized.
 

  I'd prefer a headphone that sounds good without EQ as I'll be mixing with them. Do any of those headphones match with my description?

 
Well...I did mention I liked them, so they all sound good in various ways...but most of those are out of your price range.
 
But for studio purposes, you need EQ for any headphone, man.

 

 

[amigomatt]

You could try the DT990 PRO.  They're not flat or good for mixing but have that extra treble/bass/excitement/wow factor.  The NAD VISO HP50 also have great thickness, texture and impact.  They are a little smooth in the treble, but they expertly manage to retain bags of detail whilst being completely non-fatiguing.  I love them.

 

[mfprez]

   
Okay, if ~$130 is your max and you want an open-back, I would recommend trying the Philips SHP9500 and this modification.
 
If you are willing to buy used, your possibilities open up. I once got a vintage STAX system (which sounds more transparent to me than any non-electrostatic/electret headphone, though it's inferior in other ways) for under $100, for example.
 
Since you're into music production, EQ is a must. You might dislike a headphone stock, but then love it when equalized.

Thanks for the Phillips recommendation I will do some research on them. I consider used if the deal is right, yes. You make a good point about EQ.. I guess as the truly flat headphone does not exist, some EQ in the right area will not taint 'accuracy', but infact help it. Thank you for the change of perspective, I will give it a try and listen to the changes.

 

[amigomatt]

 

  Yes they are amped. I have a sound interface for music production which has a good headphone amp onboard, and at about 1/2 volume I'd consider it too loud. Also play with FLACs.

I got a good deal and bought them new in the price range of the ATH-M50X (which is my max). But I can consider more expensive headphones as I may find them cheap somewhere.

 
Okay, if ~$130 is your max and you want an open-back, I would recommend trying the Philips SHP9500 and this modification.
 
If you want a closed-back, the Audio-Technica ATH-M40x is decent. (More neutral than the M50x.)
 
If you are willing to buy used, your possibilities open up. I once got a vintage STAX system (which sounds more transparent to me than any non-electrostatic/electret headphone, though it's inferior in other ways) for under $100, for example.
 
Since you're into music production, EQ is a must. You might dislike a headphone stock, but then love it when equalized.
 

  I'd prefer a headphone that sounds good without EQ as I'll be mixing with them. Do any of those headphones match with my description?

 
Well...most of those are out of your price range.
 
But you need EQ for any headphone, man.

 

I can vouch for this too.  I used to think I was a so called 'purist' until I used Equalizer APO to transform a handful of my headphones from cans I couldn't live with to cans I can't live without.

 

[mfprez]

  You could try the DT990 PRO.  They're not flat or good for mixing but have that extra treble/bass/excitement/wow factor.  The NAD VISO HP50 also have great thickness, texture and impact.  They are a little smooth in the treble, but they expertly manage to retain bags of detail whilst being completely non-fatiguing.  I love them.

Thank you for the recommendations. I haven't read much about the NADs, I'll look into them. I considered the DT990 for some time, but decided it against them due to the inaccuracy you describe, though after picking up a supposedly very accurate headphone and feeling a little underwhelmed, maybe I would like them. Have you tryed the DT880?

 

[amigomatt]

 

  You could try the DT990 PRO.  They're not flat or good for mixing but have that extra treble/bass/excitement/wow factor.  The NAD VISO HP50 also have great thickness, texture and impact.  They are a little smooth in the treble, but they expertly manage to retain bags of detail whilst being completely non-fatiguing.  I love them.

Thank you for the recommendations. I haven't read much about the NADs, I'll look into them. I considered the DT990 for some time, but decided it against them due to the inaccuracy you describe, though after picking up a supposedly very accurate headphone and feeling a little underwhelmed, maybe I would like them. Have you tryed the DT880?

No, I've not tried the DT880 but they were on my radar for a while as I was after a more neutral set of cans than my collection had at the time.  I too am a musician and producer.  In the end, rather than investing in another mid range can, I took the plunge a step up and went for the HifiMan HE560 after seeing a great used ad on here.  I've not regretted it and since then (about 18 months ago), I haven't felt the need to upgrade!  For now, anyway.....
 
The DT990s don't sound unnatural though, they just have extra energy in the treble and bass.  I found them for £65 used on ebay too and they are quite possibly the best audio deal ever.  They are mighty exciting to listen to but I admit to EQing the treble down to really enjoy them.  They are very open, detailed and dynamic though.  They have the WOW factor.

 

[Music Alchemist]

  Thanks for the Phillips recommendation I will do some research on them. I consider used if the deal is right, yes. You make a good point about EQ.. I guess as the truly flat headphone does not exist, some EQ in the right area will not taint 'accuracy', but infact help it. Thank you for the change of perspective, I will give it a try and listen to the changes.

 
If you want a closed headphone that reproduces the energy in music well and has awesome, impactful and tuneful bass, the Yamaha HPH-MT220 is my favorite for that. It can be had used for ~$150 or even less. To my ears, it blows away other closed headphones and even many open ones. (Lots of info in the main thread.) The bass is somewhat boosted, the mids are engaging, and the treble is fairly accurate, but slightly bright. For enjoying music, listening to it without EQ is great, but if you want accuracy, EQ is mandatory, not optional.
 
Yes, be sure to follow the EQ guides in my signature for better results. If you approach EQ casually, it's more likely to just sound awful.
 

  I can vouch for this too.  I used to think I was a so called 'purist' until I used Equalizer APO to transform a handful of my headphones from cans I couldn't live with to cans I can't live without.

 

 
Yup, a good percentage of the criticisms of headphones are only about the tonal balance of the stock configuration.
 
Of course, the more skewed the FR is in the first place, the more difficult it is to properly equalize.
 

  Thank you for the recommendations. I haven't read much about the NADs, I'll look into them. I considered the DT990 for some time, but decided it against them due to the inaccuracy you describe, though after picking up a supposedly very accurate headphone and feeling a little underwhelmed, maybe I would like them. Have you tryed the DT880?

 
There's a lot more to sound than frequency response / tonal balance. Keep in mind that the reasons you dislike it may involve other factors.
 
Although the DT 880 is for the most part neutral, I thought it was too smooth and polite to really be accurate.
 
I should also mention that I think the DT 880 is better than the SHP9500 (though I owned the "best" version of the DT 880), but the latter may be more engaging. However, the MT220 is far more engaging to me than either, and with the right amp, the Koss KTXPRO1 (which is only ~$15!) is the most exciting headphone I've heard.

 

[mfprez]

Thanks everyone for the advice, it is much appreciated. I've decided to follow Music Alchemist's suggestion of the Yamaha MT220 after finding a deal that was too good to refuse, so I will report back soon with my findings.

 

[alynx]

If u find the 880 not engaging enough, they are actually doing something right. ^^ I heard the 990 and m50 before the 880, and boii, compared to those the 880 is really boring and anything but exciting, which for music production is a good thing, imho.

 

[mfprez]

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