[mhcarlos]

I hae the second gen and I only use a Mac at home nowadays for graphics and photography (My PC is too old, otherwise I'd consider one of the iRivers or the Karma to play FLAC).

So will the 4th gen iPod with lossless support and either headphone-out or line-out a worthy upgrade from my old 2nd Gen iPod, or is it just Apple fluff. I like and use Apple products. I just think they tend to hype their products.

Would appreciate your feedback. Thanks in advance!

-Marvin

 

[Aman]

Just so you know, you can use the Rio Karma on a mac. They have a Java version of their software which allows any user of Java to transfer files.

As much as I love the 4th gen iPods, I cannot stress enough that they are a complete rip-off compared to the rest of the competition.

 

[zachary80]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mhcarlos I hae the second gen and I only use a Mac at home nowadays for graphics and photography (My PC is too old, otherwise I'd consider one of the iRivers or the Karma to play FLAC). So will the 4th gen iPod with lossless support and either headphone-out or line-out a worthy upgrade from my old 2nd Gen iPod, or is it just Apple fluff. I like and use Apple products. I just think they tend to hype their products. Would appreciate your feedback. Thanks in advance! -Marvin

Not sure if you have had a chance to compare one in person or even care, but the 4G is much smaller than the 2.

Personally I don't think lossless or lineouts really matter for a portable.

 

[Chef Medeski]

You would be much better off with the third generation actually. I mean there isn't much diff. between 3 &4; 1 &2. So, you would save abunch load of money to get the 3rd gen. Yet, if money isn't an issue. The upgrade is definetley worth it. Bigger internal size, smaller extenal size, better battery, and great wheel. Plus, the only thing that is cool is the newest iPod. So, if you really wanted to be chic you could get the photo one with a color screen. now, that is what I call an improvement. Lossless sucks. I don't know what you would use an line out for. I mean its not like the quality is good enough to hook up to a stereo.

 

[JohnnyLightOn]

I think you should go 4th G. Like Chef said, better battery and the scroll wheel. But Lindrone and several others on this site have also remarked about the noticeable improvement in the 4th G's headphone out. That alone should make the decision for you.

But I disagree with Chef that lossless sucks. With lossless and a line out, connected to an amp like the SR-71, you have a very nice source, that's also portable!

 

[stryker]

I think the lossless sounds great given the constraints of this player. I A/B'd a few songs against my L3+ Music Hall player and was impressed by what it achieved. I'm still amazed by its size and features but maybe I'm getting to be an old fart.

 

[Blitzula]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aman As much as I love the 4th gen iPods, I cannot stress enough that they are a complete rip-off compared to the rest of the competition.

Complete rip-off? C'mon now...that's just silly.

 

[mhcarlos]

Thanks for all the replies!

Aman, zachary80, Chef Medeski, JohnnyLightOn, stryker:

-- yes i guess it's overpriced, but i'm a sucker for presentation i guess. The only thing with the Karma is it doesn't look sturdy, and I haven't been able to find a store to test it. And I'm used to the iPod's UI.

-- I personally didn't like the 3rd gen because it lacked tactile feedback. I actually like the 2nd gen in terms of UI because of the audible click. The 4th gen is a return to an interface that's similar.

-- SR-71 -- too expensive for me for now. Just got the Porta Corda through the group buy

-- I don't have a home set-up. I guess I'm trying to squeeze as much quality as I can from a portable set-up.

-- I looked up the site quite a bit and lossless seems to have a lot off fans.

I suppose I'm trying to convince myself to upgrade. (My girlfriend's not goiing to like this. The 2nd gen was her xmas gift to me before )

Is iPod photo worth it?

I'm actually into photography, but I heard you can't really view photos you store there, and I wish you won't need a third party card reader.

Thanks,
Marvin

 

[immtbiker]

If you can still get a 3G, it is worth it, because you get a dock, and a remote. A lot of people with 4G's are looking to by remotes, from 3G owners, because the cost, is around $45. So you save money one way, and get more gigs, but lose another way.

 

[chumley]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aman Just so you know, you can use the Rio Karma on a mac. They have a Java version of their software which allows any user of Java to transfer files. As much as I love the 4th gen iPods, I cannot stress enough that they are a complete rip-off compared to the rest of the competition.

Thou doth stress too much thine nonsense...

4G iPod>Apple Lossless>L/O>Sik Din>(insert decent amp here) or even just straight up Headphone Out= better sound than RK, MUCH better build quality (no 'plastic pillow'/'grip strengthener', unpocketable shape here), iTunes support (not really valuable, IMO, for the mediocre 128k AAC files on the iTunes Store, but CRUCIAL for the great iPod/iTunes integration tools available when using any Mac+4G iPod+iTunes 4.7.x).

As a computer consultant (PC, Mac, Unix/Linux/OS X/Windows) and an instructor/consultant in Professional Audio and Video, I get to play with ALL the new and classic DAPs, from everywhere, routinely including stuff not even sold here (Ginza district, Tokyo, etc.)... iRiver HP320 or Zen Touch beat the chubby 'lil Karma (SQ and BQ, for starters), and the 4G iPod beats all of 'em, soundwise as well as ease-of use wise. Value, not cost, is what it's about, in the long run.

BTW, 'compared to the rest of the competition', several of which I own, including the Rio Karma (in addition to my 4G 40GB iPod), and all of which I've heard, the iPod is at the top of the heap- in both SQ and BQ, IMO. I give props where props are due, however, to 'the competition'... the 4G iPod's only * real * competition, in both sound quality and build quality, are the iRiver 320/340, the Zen Touch and the (in SQ only), Karma, IMO.

Aman, I'm curious- is this just another partisan, 'I hate Apple' post, or do you actually have anything useful to add to this thread in the form of accurate info? Characterizing the 4G iPod (which sounds markedly better due to the new Wolfson DAC, and has much better battery life, etc., than my older 1G and 2G iPods, great though they were) as a 'complete rip-off' reeks of 'ad hominum attack-itus', Aman. As well as being demonstrably untrue...

 

[mhcarlos]

immtbiker -- Thanks for the suggestion. I went ahead and got the 4G iPod photo. I visited a couple of places and plugged in my ER4P into the headphone out of both my 2G iPod and the 4G and I did find the sound better. Maybe it's the placebo effect I read about here, but aside from perceived sound quality at the time, I rationalized my purchase with the battery life, the improved UI (the photo version), and the ability to have lossless compression (but too bad it's only proprietary Apple lossless) for my most "important" music.

chumley -- Thanks for the info/advice. Nice job you have there.

I'd actually want to own or at least try the Karma and iRiver h320. Or at least the Karma, since my PC is too old. I must admit I like Apple products for the minimalistic design, but had to check sound quality first. I dislike the fact that Apple doesn't support other lossless formats like FLAC and Vorbis -- not that I heard any of them for comparison so I really shouldn't care. It's just that people like having options. I don't have albums that require gapless playback, and I really like the fact that the iPod integrates seamlessly with Macs (none of the PC problems I heard) so In the end I stuck with the iPod.

I'm excited about the iPod photo. I think I'll be getting it in the mail by tomorrow. I take photos and I wish the photo version was a photographer's tool, but still at least I can put my favorite shots in there to remind me of my other passion

, albeit in low resolution (but decent enough). I mainly like the screen and that defect fix to actually scroll long song titles (wonder why they didn't think of that before).

-marvin

 

[aeriyn]

*dons flame suit*

Oi, no iRiver player can touch the iPod or Karma for SQ. Sound flavor, however, is a completely different ballgame. Personally though, I can do without the Sony/iRiver "oomph-oomph-oomph-bad-car-stereo-with-too-many-subs" sound.

I do wish the iPod had a line out on the main unit though. >.>;

 

[mhcarlos]

Really? I haven't heard the iRiver, or the Karma for that matter. Only heard about them. I physically saw them but I couldn't find a way to test them (one more reason to stick with an iPod). I thought the iRiver looked cool though (but not as clean and simple as the iPods, which I like) and I could transfer photos directly from the camera via USB. But music is the main point and other features were secondary and the new 4G iPod sounded to my non-audiophile ears.

BTW, I think I should have posted this in the portables forum. I just noticed I put it in dedicated source components. Apologies...

-marvin