[vanillawafer]

Ok, this might be a dumb question, but here goes anyway. I have a 1212m hooked up to my CMOY at this point, but will be my PPX3 once it gets here today. My question is with all the different volume options (Patchmix Input Level, Patchmix Mix Level, Patchmix Monitor Level, and Headphone Amp), what volumes should stay put, and which volume control should be used to control the volume? What confuses me a little bit here is that if the outputs on the 1212m are true line level outputs why do the volume settings in patch mix affect the output level heard?

EDIT:
Just read one of Lan's posts where he talks about adding a send to ouput control in the strip. I did this and it apears that it bypasses The vollume controls depending on where you put it in the strip. Now then, does the 1212m have an internal amp? I'm guessing yes or the volume would do nothing. Is it advisable to bypass the internals of the 1212m when hooking to a quality external amp like the PPX3?

 

[EasyRaider]

I know very little about the EMUs, but it is possible to attenuate digitally, before the DAC gets the signal.

 

[vanillawafer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by EasyRaider I know very little about the EMUs, but it is possible to attenuate digitally, before the DAC gets the signal.

I'm guessing digital attenuation will not degrade quality, is that what you are saying? In which case the volume controls on patchmix would not alter the bits in any way.

 

[lan]

If you are using a volume control you are changing the bits. Inserting a SEND at the top of the strip will of course bypass everything below/after it. These volumes are part of the mixer. It's not really an amp.

 

[vanillawafer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lan If you are using a volume control you are changing the bits. Inserting a SEND at the top of the strip will of course bypass everything below/after it. These volumes are part of the mixer. It's not really an amp.

So do you recomend by-passing the mixer when connecting to a high quality amp? Currently I have a trim pot set to -5.36 (to get rid of clipping) and then a Send to output in the strip. Is this ideal?

 

[lan]

Well if you're having clipping, you want to reduce the volume somewhere. What music player are you using?

 

[vanillawafer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lan Well if you're having clipping, you want to reduce the volume somewhere. What music player are you using?

I'm using foobar. I rip all of my stuff using EAC and lame 3.9.3 at --alt-preset insane and some albums clip so I use a trim pot to prevent any clipping that might make it through

 

[EasyRaider]

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanillawafer I'm guessing digital attenuation will not degrade quality, is that what you are saying? In which case the volume controls on patchmix would not alter the bits in any way.

I was just saying that having volume control does not mean that the card has an internal amp.

 

[lan]

Have you tried using replaygain? It should prevent clipping also.

 

[vanillawafer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lan Have you tried using replaygain? It should prevent clipping also.

Yes, but I found it easier to just use a trim pot as that way I didn't have to scan all my files just to prevent clipping. Is one method better than the other? Am I going to gain (oops pun

) anything by using replay gain over a trim pot?

 

[lan]

I use the trim pot also but as a volume control since I'm not going straight from the emu to my power amps. There's nothing wrong with it. Just use whatever is most convenient for you but just one thing if you're going to use lossy files and the emu mixer as volume, use 32bit output in foobar instead of 24bit padded to 32bit. Since you'd be changing the bits anyway via volume, might as well give the mixer all the 32bits. It sounds a little bit better to me this way.

edit: or you could use foobars volume control.

 

[JeffL]

You shouldn't have to adjust trim OR volume, in the mixer, at all, for music listening.

The ASIO input should stay at 0db, the monitor and main mix should stay at 0db. Clipping is a result of a bad recording, and replaygaining will NOT remove the clipping. It only lowers the gain of the already clipped data, which will not unclip the track.

Lowering the volumes in the mixer raises the stereo seperation and noise floor.

Also, make sure you are using a -10dB output, not +4, as I have seen recommended on the forums (unless you are using a truley balanced output). This will overdrive your amp and causes gain issues in other places as well.

 

[vanillawafer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeffL You shouldn't have to adjust trim OR volume, in the mixer, at all, for music listening. The ASIO input should stay at 0db, the monitor and main mix should stay at 0db. Clipping is a result of a bad recording, and replaygaining will NOT remove the clipping. It only lowers the gain of the already clipped data, which will not unclip the track. Lowering the volumes in the mixer raises the stereo seperation and noise floor. Also, make sure you are using a -10dB output, not +4, as I have seen recommended on the forums (unless you are using a truley balanced output). This will overdrive your amp and causes gain issues in other places as well.

Wow, then I have a lot of badly recorded albums because a lot of my stuff hits the red and triggers the MAX lights if I don't do some sort of attenuation. I'm using the -10db output as I don't have a ballenced amp and If I don't use a trim pot then I "hear" the clipping (distortion)... why would most of my stuff be recorded this hot?

 

[ooheadsoo]

+4 is the standard with pro gear. -10 is the standard for consumer gear. I don't think will overdrive your amp unless it's built for really low signal levels. You might play with it as you see fit, see which one you think sounds better.

 

[lan]

Well if your stuff was clipping or very near before lossy compression like MP3, during decode stage you can reclip again. So to not clip again, you reduce the volume/gain.