Cayin N8ii

Intro.​

Similar yet different
As a portable player featuring vacuum tubes, the N8ii, as the successor to the N8, shares some similarities while also introducing some differences.

Similarities include the use of KORG vacuum tubes, but this time, there are two, as it implements balanced tube amplification. However, unlike the rich and warm tube sound of the N8, the N8ii's tube mode tuning approach is surprisingly closer to the C9 rather than the N8, offering a more neutral and accurate sound. The N8 first generation is noticeably warmer in tonality, partly due to the AKM4497 chip, while the N8ii this time employs Rohm's BD34301EKV. The new circuit architecture brings about a different tuning, making the N8ii sound cleaner, clearer, and more direct.


In addition, the iconic golden triangle smiley face was abandoned to accommodate the touchscreen. This makes it less 'characteristic' compared to the previous generation. However, if I were to choose, honestly, I think I would still prefer the touchscreen because of its practicality.

Switching to a healthier diet?
The N8ii aims for transparency and neutrality, with a slight warmth in tuning. Some believe this symbolises the 'loss of spirit of vacuum tubes,' which is also one of the controversial points about the N8ii.

In my opinion, the 'flavour' in the N8ii's tube mode is indeed reduced compared to the N8, but the rest were significantly improved. The N8ii's tube mode becomes more delicate, more detailed, striking a good balance between sound flavour, resolution, and dynamics.

Its flavour is akin to adopting a healthier diet, becoming much milder. This is a point that can be seen as either good or bad, depending on personal preference.

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Settings
The settings I used for review: Solid-state, Class AB , P power mode.
And I used the 64 Audio Noir and tia forte, as well as a LCD-4z for review.

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Sound​

Class A/AB
When it comes to the Class A/AB mode, it's the first noteworthy feature of the N8ii, the newly designed switchable Class A/AB amplification circuit. The entire amplification circuit delivers astonishing dynamics and detail in AB amplification mode; however, in Class A amplification mode, there's a slight loss in dynamic, especially noticeable in concerto, symphony, and rock tracks that require large dynamic swings. Nonetheless, the difference is less distinct in pop and vocal performances.

Bass
Firstly, the bass is finely tuned, exceptionally clean and cohesive, with moderate weight and energy concentrated at mid bass. There's noticeable elasticity without a sluggish rebound thanks to its fast speed. In the tube mode, the bass is slightly softer, slower, with less emphasis on texture and impact, and a slightly reduce in quantity compared to the solid-state mode.

Overall, it's a bass that's impactful, with excellent depth and emphasis on texture and rebound speed. I really appreciate this balance because it's just right, if it were to emphasise bass impact a bit more, it might appear too dry and hard.

Vocal
The vocals are also finely tuned for transparency, without any obvious bias. They exhibit high density with moderate thickness, emphasizing clarity in articulation and precise positioning of vocal sources. Additionally, unlike the previous generation N8, which tended to soften vocals, the N8ii doesn't apply too much smoothing to vocals. Sibilance doesn't disappear completely, aiming to preserve the natural texture of female vocals, again, this is a point that can be seen as either good or bad, depending on personal preference.

As a result, vocals sound clear and bright without being overly stimulating, demonstrating a well-balanced tuning.

Treble
Then onto the treble. Clean, natural, and transparent, with smooth and excellent extension. Though clean, it doesn't appear palm; though extends quite high, you don't feel harshness or fatigue; the treble is well refined.

In the tube mode, the imaging of vocals is brighter and clearer. And speak of brightness, in my opinion, it is moderate on N8ii, it doesn't artificially enhance the highs to make it sounds 'brighter', instead, the N8ii maintained smoothness while emphasised the good extension. The appropriate brightness also ensures listenability, I mean, you won't feel fatigued even when paired with iem with a rather offensive treble like the tia forte, of which has a quite offensive treble peak and could appear a bit too bright sometimes. However, on N8ii, the highs of the tia forte is well controlled in various scenarios.

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Personally, I prefer using the tube with the P+ power mode for solo or sonata pieces. Although it may not deliver the same level of resolution as the solid-state mode, the overall performance of instruments, including the layered bass of drums and the airiness of string instruments, are just excellent. Another suitable direction for the N8ii is metal rock, in the tube mode, the bass remain tight and clean. Additionally, the brightness, clarity, and energy of the treble are better than solid-state mode imo.

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Could be better?
Actually, there are two points I feel could be improved.

Firstly, the thickness. The N82's thickness reaches 2.5cm, and I don't know whether or not your pants have pockets that big, but at least mine don't. I remember years ago when Sony dominated the portable DAP market, I bought a ZX2, slipping it into my pocket and putting on a pair of headphones to wander around was a distant yet beautiful memory.
But today, it's hard to say that portable players can still be described as "portable".

Secondly, speaking of pocketing it, there's another issue: heat. If you're running the tube mode, Class A amplification, at P+ mode, and then use it in a non-ventilated environment like inside your pocket, what you'll probably get is a device that's really hot. Sometimes, when I use it as a desktop DAC/amp in my office, opting for USB input while powering it, it also generates a considerable amount of heat. Under certain circumstances, it may overheat, triggering protection mode and stopping the charging process.

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Epilogue​

The N8ii tube mode indeed sounds more like what you'd expect from a solid-state mode. Well it's like in the era of film cameras, we would commend a photographer's skill by saying, "It's so clear as if you shot it with a digital camera."

In conclusion, the N8ii does indeed has a much lighter flavour compared to the N8. But if we set aside the inherent impression of the warm tuning of the N8, we would find the sound becomes more mellow, delicate, and airy. This fresh tuning really strikes a fine balance between the accuracy and pleasing of the tube sound.

I have a problem.

I want to live in a world without compromises, where my every audio wish is fulfilled… but without the guilt of a massive hole in my wallet. No doubt you can see the dilemma.

This hobby is a game and how you choose to play it is up to you. You can spend big and suck up the sticker shock, or refrain and learn to live with less.

The real problem is that ultimate fulfillment isn’t merely a question of dollars and cents. More often it comes down to physics. Let me explain.


For years I’ve watched the dimensions of flagship digital audio players balloon, following the trend of mobile phones. Every year they seem to get bigger, heavier & more expensive.

Performance has gone up too – there’s no denying that.

Are they still worth it though? Not just in dollars, but in weight, size & heat. I wonder.


The DAP question of “how big do I go” is one you’ve probably confronted. Your answer may be tied to your wallet, or it may not.

In any case it’s a topic I think you’ll agree is worth exploring, so I plan to do exactly that by comparing two DAPs currently in my possession – the Cayin N8ii and the Shanling M6U.

So do you REALLY need a flagship DAP or will a smaller mid-range model do the job? Read on and see.

Tech Specs​

First the boring stuff. Tech specs. Actually you know what? Let’s skip them.

Do we really care how much RAM these gadgets have or which Android version they use? I personally wouldn’t notice much difference in day-to-day use & won’t own them long enough that they cease to run the apps I need. (Apple Music & Neutron Player)

So what DOES really matter?

Weight. Ergonomics. Battery life. Sound, obviously. Not a lot else to me, except price.

Let’s go through each of those one by one and see how these DAPs stack up.

Ergonomics​

The USD $3500 Cayin N8ii weighs 442g and feels like a brick.

The volume wheel lies at the top of the player, which feels less intuitive than on the side.

The power button is directly next to the FF/PLAY/REW buttons, which has caused me to push it accidentally on numerous occasions. There’s also very little space between the other three, so pressing the right one without looking is often a matter of luck.

The N8ii has a gorgeously bright & vivid screen with terrific off-angle viewing, which is nice.




The USD $919 Shanling M6U feels virtually half as heavy as the N8ii because at 263g it is. It’s also roughly half as thick and not as tall, so reaching the volume wheel & control buttons whilst keeping it balanced in one hand is much easier.

Speaking of buttons all three FF/PLAY/REW are on the opposite side of the volume wheel which also functions as the power button – by far the best arrangement in my humble opinion. The control buttons are also wide enough & far enough apart it’s a lot harder to be confused which is which by feel.

A difference I’m not fond of is the M6U’s 4.4mm & 3.5mm output jacks being located on top of the player. This is great when the device is in your pocket, but inconvenient when you’re sitting at a desk or in bed. I much prefer the N8ii’s bottom-placed jacks, but of course it’s a matter of personal preference.

Although the M6U’s screen is the same size as the N8ii’s at 5”, colors are more washed out, contrast isn’t as high and it’s noticeably dimmer at max brightness. It’s entirely acceptable, but not spectacularly impressive like the N8ii’s.

I do notice the M6U feels slightly slower in regular use than the N8ii. Though I wouldn’t call it sluggish, it lacks the N8ii’s terrific snappiness. The N8ii’s internal modem also downloads songs via wifi noticeably faster. Both players feature double-tap to wake, a wonderful little feature that’s easy to love.




To sum it up the N8ii feels & looks like a premium device that also happens to be heavy & cumbersome. Perhaps I need more bicep curls in the gym (would it help if I started going?) but am conscious of the N8ii’s weight whenever I pick it up so it quite never “disappears” in the experience of using it.

That’s nice if you like being reminded you’re holding something expensive others may struggle to afford, but ergonomically I much prefer the M6U which is easier to use without thinking.

Its’ volume wheel also feels more solid than the N8ii’s which is somewhat loose, whereas the M6U wheel is just large enough to turn easily without protruding excessively. If only Shanling had placed those output jacks on the bottom instead.

Battery Life & Heat​

Put simply both players perform poorly in these two areas. I’ll discuss heat first.

In the N8ii’s case there’s a valid excuse: It contains fully-balanced Nutube output, the first DAP to do so. So naturally running in tube mode is going to result in heat levels going up, especially if you decide to charge the DAP while listening, which Cayin actually advises against. In fact some users have reported their units temporarily shutting-down in such circumstances due to the protection circuit kicking in.

In regular operation outside tube mode the N8ii gets warm, but not excessively so. Beyond what might be considered the norm for other flagship DAPs? Possibly, though if another brand can challenge Cayin in the heat-heat stakes it’s Shanling!

If anything the M6U heats up even more than the N8ii but without any tube mode excuse. Though I haven’t felt it get scorching hot to the touch it isn’t terribly far away, particularly when kept in a jacket pocket while playing for half an hour or so. Heat doesn’t particularly bother me (having lived happily with an ALO Continental Dual Mono) but others may be less tolerant of this.


Battery life is more my concern. No, I haven’t run forensic tests or performed scientific experiments to determine precisely how many hours these DAPs deliver.

Anecdotally though? Let’s just say on hi-gain via 4.4mm both Cayin & Shanling quote 9 hours for each of these players, but in my experience when you factor in a decent amount of streaming & screen-on time those numbers feel very optimistic.

I work from home and have the luxury of listening throughout the day, and neither DAP feels like it’ll last a full day without a top-up at some point, particularly if I listen in the evening after work as well.

That’s disappointing, but perhaps a sign of the times given power output numbers have shot up in recent years – indeed both players will output up to 720mW at 32 ohms. Sony’s WM1M2 may have better battery life but caps output at 250mW at 16 ohms, and I definitely prefer the option of more power on tap.

The N8ii has a few more audio settings than the M6U in the form of tube mode, A/AB and P+ modes (which I’ll talk about later) which can be switched off to conserve power, but in my experience the N8ii drains about as fast as the Shanling with all of them disabled – turned on, it will run out of juice even faster.

To make matters worse at 10000 mAh the N8ii’s battery is almost double the size of the M6U’s 5650 mAh, meaning it takes MUCH longer to charge. Both players support Quick Charge which helps, but with the much larger battery and those extra power-draining modes the N8ii definitely felt more difficult to keep topped-up enough to last a full day.

Sound Comparison​

At last we come to the meat of the sandwich, how do they sound?

In short both are terrific, a testament to how much quality sound manufacturers can squeeze into one hand these days. However the differences between them are noteworthy.

M6U Sound Performance​

First a confession – as you may have already guessed I went into this review wanting to like the M6U enough that it would supplant the N8ii for my needs. So I was delighted to find there’s much to love about the Shanling’s sound.

The M6U’s resolution is top notch and it never gives the impression any detail is missing. The N8ii may have the slightest edge here but they’re very hard to separate. Perhaps this is no surprise given the M6U uses no less than four AKM AK4493SEQ DACs, which I’d have never dreamt was possible for such a petit form factor.

The Shanling DAP’s soundstage is also very broad, occasionally feeling wider than the N8ii’s, perhaps due to it being considerably flatter than the N8ii’s and thus width is more perceptible.

The M6U’s AKM DACs also render notes’ attack with slightly more bite than the N8ii, which suits electronic & classical music especially well. I find high notes in particular jump out more on the M6U, as if they’re slightly brighter without delivering any more actual information, but allowing themselves to be detached from the rest of the performance more easily.


I’d love to conclude things there (remember I admitted to M6U bias) but the larger truth is less positive.

Where the M6U lags behind the N8ii is in naturalness. Everything feels slightly more artificial and less organic. My brain needs to work that little bit harder with the M6U to sort out what I’m hearing and over time that adds fatigue.

It probably doesn’t help that the M6U leans more aggressive so I perceive being very close to the stage itself, though that does give the illusion sounds in the wings are coming from further to my left or right. The overall character of the presentation is definitely dryer than the N8ii, and dynamics are not quite as strong either. Bass on occasion leans a trifle one-note as well.

N8ii Sound Performance​

Continuing with my unabashed bias, the N8ii’s dual ROHM BD34301EKV DACs have a strange tendency of making notes feel somewhat rounder and softer than I’d like, without ever giving the impression important detail is being obscured. There’s a certain diffuseness here, leading me to wonder if I simply prefer the AKM house sound instead.

After saying that, sonically the N8ii is superior to the M6U in almost every other respect and boasts greater flexibility to boot.

Let’s begin with the two greatest points of differentiation – stage and ease.

The N8ii’s soundstage is far deeper and more three-dimensional than the M6Us. Imaging is also stronger, with individual notes being spotlit in their position more starkly. This is the first change I notice when swapping between the two players.

Following closely behind is the way the N8ii renders everything with a delightfully smooth articulation that the M6U lacks. Everything feels calmer and less nervous, yet resolution may actually be slightly higher and there’s definitely less harshness.

The N8ii also has a slightly V-shaped tendency where sub bass and upper treble are tastefully accentuated. A noticeable consequence is improved bass texture over the M6U, something the Impacts in particular greatly benefit from. Indeed I’d go so far as to say I find the Impacts’ bass performance somewhat lacking on the M6U, but satisfying on the N8ii.


I typically run the N8ii with high-gain activated, in AB mode with P+ turned on, and the tubes turned off. Actually I run every DAP in the highest gain available, since doing so generally improves dynamics which are crucial to my musical enjoyment.

Of all the N8ii’s tweakable audio settings, P+ mode makes the biggest difference to my ears. It substantially boost bottom-end oomph, improves dynamics, creates the illusion of being slightly closer to the stage, and even improves midrange clarity. Perfect for creating a more exciting presentation, so I leave it permanently engaged which means the amp must stay in class AB mode since class A can only be activated with P+ off. Luckily I hear no difference going from class AB to A on this particular DAP.

Tube mode I’m more on the fence about. It creates a slightly more three-dimensional stage with a more rounded and lush sound that’s slightly more organic with perhaps better note weight, similar to what you’d expect from a real tube amp. Solid state feels more accurate with slightly more impactful bass and a flatter stage, with more perceptible upper midrange and a firmer, harder sound. I go back & forth between them depending on mood & genre, but wouldn’t purchase the N8ii solely on the back of its’ nutube capability.

Conclusion​

I’ve silently dreaded writing this section.

My goal as a reviewer should be to arrive at a definitive position, articulated with firm authority and backed by unshakeable logic.

Unfortunately, the reality is quite different.

They’re both wonderful players in their own right, and my decision to choose between them has been torturous. It’s true the N8ii outshines the M6U sonically in most areas, but I much prefer the M6U’s ergonomics and value.

In fact the more aggressive character of the AKM-fuelled M6U lies dearer to my heart, but that sound hasn’t been as flawlessly executed as the N8ii’s ROHM interpretation, no doubt due to size & cost restrictions.

With the N8ii I become enveloped in its’ effortlessness delivery, whereas the M6U leaves me musing how much I enjoy the sound but wishing for that missing touch of refinement one quickly grows accustomed to. The N8ii feels snappier scrolling through menus on its’ beautiful screen, but the M6U is more comfortably gripped & operated with one hand.

I will say this – to my ears mid-level players like the M6U & DX240 have reached a point where they deliver almost all the resolution of cost-no-object DAPs like the N8ii. The real difference comes in the effortless reproduction of that resolution, with greater absence of grit or glare and slightly improved technicalities.

On the face of it that’s a heavy financial trade-off for performance gains some might consider slight, but the funny thing about audio is even tiny changes can have a profound effect on our emotional response to what we hear.

Neither player will likely disappoint.

Long overdue, but as promised my N8II review!

As I've always done with DAPs, I will be reviewing sound and portability. I've run Tidal and SD cards on the N8II. I don't really use any of the fancy features and options, I buy the brick, put the tube hybrid option on, and get to listening. For convenience sake, the review will be split into sound and usability. Usability mainly concerns how convient it is to use at home and on the go, including battery life, charging and so on.

1. Sound

This is what has made the N8II obscenely popular Imo. Tube DAPs and amplifiers tend to include too much coloring for my preference. That isn't necessarily a bad thing, but I personally much prefer that the IEMs introduce the coloration, while the DAP simply enables them to perform at their best and adds a small touch of its own.

The N8II is exactly that. If you are buying it for the tube sound, and hope for a WARM "filter" for your IEMs, you might as well skip this one. Both the SP2000T and the OG N8 do that better. Or well, better isn't the word, since the N8II flat out refuses to do that, it isn't even competing for that sound

In terms of signature, I'd personally classify it as neutral-bright. It provides a small treble boost, as well as a tighter, and faster bass response, in a shape that I'd classify as a U or very mild V. Its speed and technical ability are the defining qualities, with a massive, deep and holographic staging, dynamics like no other and surgical separation.

The "tube" component, to me, is expressed in the dynamics and timber/texture. While the sound is anything but thick, the texture it provides is incredible. The bass and midrange are able to almost "tickle" your ears with how rounded and detailed they are, and the pitch-black background only helps them stand out more.

The beauty of what the N8II does Imo, is in that it gives you full freedom. The SP2000T for example takes a bright IEM, and forces it to be warm. It takes a warm IEM, and forces it to be even warmer. The N8II lets the IEM make the decision of whether it will be bright or warm - it simply makes it better.

I personally like more neutral signatures, so for the most part I take slightly warm IEMs, and pair them with the N8II to get back to neutral. The Kr5 and Xe6 both absolutely excelled with it, as did everything else I plugged into it, but those two really stood out.

2. Usability

My own rating of 4/5 of the N8II almost feels unfair to me considering I am yet to hear a DAP sound this good, but here is the justification for it - if you are looking to get something that is borderline portable, the N8II is an awful choice. I'm not looking to do extreme sports with the N8II by my side, but if a DAP drives me crazy while taking it for a simple walk, something's off.

The first and foremost problem is the plugs being on the bottom. I believe the justification for that is that people mostly use it on their desks - even then though, I don't see the point of the N8II having the plugs on the bottom. To me that feels like one of those really clunky laptops that put the 3.5 jack at the back and you have to get up and go on an exploration just to find where to plug it in. It feels even worse when you're digging through the depths of your pocket and you're trying to adjust the sound - more than a few people have thought I'm feeling myself up as I'm walking around.

The second that I wasn't a big fan of is the battery charging. Battery life is okay, around 9 hours would be a rough estimate without activating all the GIGA BOOSTS - just regular power mode aimed at driving easy IEMs. The charging however - it is just stupid slow. I've tried a variety of chargers and plugs I had at home, including my laptop's charger, but the fast charging seems to require some very specific ones. I didn't bother finding any on Amazon, I guess that's also my mistake.

WIthout fast charging it takes ages, I basically had to leave it overnight to charge it to full.

On a less resolvable issue, the heat. I guess that just comes with tubes, is the heat. It's basically unusable in summer outside. Trust me I tried and I'm pretty sure I burned my leg in the process.

Power is great, you can drive just about anything in it, including stuff like the Meze Elite. For obvious reasons, I haven't tried something like the 1266TC since that just nopes out of anything even remotely portable.

3. A comparison and a conclusion

I think one comparison is particularly relevant to the N8II - the LPGT. They are both similarly neutral, similar battery lives, but with the key differences being that the N8II pulls ahead on sound, and the LPGT pulls ahead a bit on convenience.

I'd personally classify the N8II as a direct upgrade on the LPGT, and a great middle ground between the tonality of the LPGT and the LPGT Ti.



All in all, I can't not recommend the N8II. It simply sounds too good to pass up if you're willing to spend the money. I'd only really note that you should consider it "transportable" much more so than actually portable. It isn't the most convenient brick out there.