[Andrew_WOT]

Really?
UAC1 and UAC2 use USB in isochronous mode. That is simply the standard.
When they started with USB audio around 2000 they used the frame rate for synchronization. A pretty jittery solution.
Later (2005?) adaptive mode implementations become popular.
From 2009 on, async become popular.

Today almost all USB audio is USB Audio Class 2 so the bus will be run in isochrone mode with asynchrone synchronization.
If you look at measurements you will see that USB in general outperforms the classic protocols like SPDIF in the jitter departement.

There could be semantics of terminology. Traditional isochronous was unstable mess due to clock derived from the packets, what they refer to as asynchronous nowadays is what you describe with external clock on DAC side. It was quite a revolutionary breakthrough when new gen USB DACs started getting equipped with these new receivers. I remember using that external USB dongle from iFiAudio with my Chord DAC to bypass its inferior isochronous receiver, before I upgraded to more modern one (Auralic) that had new type of the receiver onboard.

But latency aside, streamers are the cleanest way to get audio out of PC.

Great whitepaper to learn about USB Audio and its history.
https://www.thewelltemperedcomputer.com/KB/USB.html

 

[chesebert]

That is not correct, it simply depends on implementation. Unison USB is superior to S/PDIF according to Schiit, and borne out by my experience with a Modius.

Either USB or S/PDIF can be better in a particular DAC, but that's because not everyone does USB correctly. SPDIF is technologically compromised due to the embedded clock signal.
https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/...rters-shootout/?do=findComment&comment=489519
(Barrows works with Sonore)

S/PDIF is a worse turd than USB for getting audio from PC.

 

[Twenty-One Twelve]

HDMI to a multi-channel DAC in an AVR, like a Denon or a Marantz. First, it only makes sense to have a smart head-end. Two, multi-channel (as in more than 2). Three, ready-made network control, like in the attached pic. In the end, very cost effective: smarts/total control at your finger tips, great DAC, multi-channel, power amps, all in one. I think there's a tuner and some internet radio stuff in many of these, too.

 

[hakunamakaka]

Don't see how AES67 (Real time audio over IP) will help you.
What is wrong with using the USB input of the Qutest?

The sound is noticeably leaner and more aggressive in presentation, especially in treble. It was very obvious with headphones like utopia, even the bass slam was slightly better with DDC in chain.

I'm left curious if it was some sort of trickery done by DDC or that was the result of switching between usb & optical interface. Some advised that it may be the cause of groundloop, but when I replaced my laptop with DAP it made no difference to the sound

 

[audiobomber]

S/PDIF is a worse turd than USB for getting audio from PC.

What other option is there? I2S is not technically superior to USB. PC does not allow I2S connection without extra gear and expense. You can massage USB (or S/PDIF) as well. All methods entail compromise, and most DAC's cannot handle I2S.

 

[Roseval]

trickery done by DDC or that was the result of switching between usb & optical interface.

Bit weird. IMHO a well designed DAC shouldn't sound different when using different inputs.
Anyway, you might try a DDC like USB to optical.
A couple of examples: https://www.thewelltemperedcomputer.com/HW/USB_SPDIF.htm

 

[hakunamakaka]

Bit weird. IMHO a well designed DAC shouldn't sound different when using different inputs.
Anyway, you might try a DDC like USB to optical.
A couple of examples: https://www.thewelltemperedcomputer.com/HW/USB_SPDIF.htm

I’ve got no idea if it was due to different input on DAC or an impact of DDC in chain. People claim to spot audible differences between DDC’s, but not sure how real is it. I would prefer to stick on budget option if I could gain same improvements.

 

[chesebert]

What other option is there? I2S is not technically superior to USB. PC does not allow I2S connection without extra gear and expense. You can massage USB (or S/PDIF) as well. All methods entail compromise, and most DAC's cannot handle I2S.

Ethernet, but only if there is no further conversion to USB or S/PDIF. Otherwise you run into shortcomings of USB and S/PDIF. I do note that units that are designed to work together may be able to engineer around some of the issues. One example is Mojo + Poly, which sounded better than Mojo by itself even if Mojo was supplied with USB signals that have been conditioned, cleaned and isolated.

 

[audiobomber]

Ethernet, but only if there is no further conversion to USB or S/PDIF. Otherwise you run into shortcomings of USB and S/PDIF. I do note that units that are designed to work together may be able to engineer around some of the issues. One example is Mojo + Poly, which sounded better than Mojo by itself even if Mojo was supplied with USB signals that have been conditioned, cleaned and isolated.

My exaSound PlayPoint and e32 Mk II are like that. The PlayPoint converts ethernet to USB for the DAC, but were designed to work together exclusively. I was cautioned by the designer not to put anything between them other than the cable, and not to use a common PSU, which could negate the intrinsic galvanic isolation.

 

[chesebert]

My exaSound PlayPoint and e32 Mk II are like that. The PlayPoint converts ethernet to USB for the DAC, but were designed to work together exclusively. I was cautioned by the designer not to put anything between them other than the cable, and not to use a common PSU, which could negate the intrinsic galvanic isolation.

Makes sense. 2 box solution can be tricky to implement with USB as the data protocol. It’s a reasonable design choice to provide more flexibility with a traditional USB dac. A one box solution or Ethernet only would be superior from a sound quality perspective assuming all other parameters are equal.

 

[ColSaulTigh]

I am running Windows 7 under Bootcamp on an iMac. I found the original iFi USB conditioner to make a difference with some DACs. Here is their latest offering…

https://ifi-audio.com/products/micro-iusb3-0/

Out of stock on Amazon - I just posted on their FB page to see if they're making more. I've got a "noisy" USB out on my Microsoft Surface Studio. The iPurifier3 didn't do anything to help the noise issue.

 

[Powermankw]

Ethernet, but only if there is no further conversion to USB or S/PDIF. Otherwise you run into shortcomings of USB and S/PDIF. I do note that units that are designed to work together may be able to engineer around some of the issues. One example is Mojo + Poly, which sounded better than Mojo by itself even if Mojo was supplied with USB signals that have been conditioned, cleaned and isolated.

So then I was just looking at Pi2AES. I like the idea of going ethernet to I2S as streamer with I2S out. So what other solutions are out there? Yes I have seen the more expensive ones, but don't feel like spending $1000 on basically a converter.

 

[chesebert]

So then I was just looking at Pi2AES. I like the idea of going ethernet to I2S as streamer with I2S out. So what other solutions are out there? Yes I have seen the more expensive ones, but don't feel like spending $1000 on basically a converter.

You may not like what I am going to suggest, but if I were you I would get whatever cheap streamer you can tolerate (RPI works fine) and save up for an Aurender, Playback Design or EMM Labs unit. If you can't wait that long, save up for an Auralic. Buy used if you must. Buy it nice or you will be stuck in FOTM hell.

 

[kumar402]

You may not like what I am going to suggest, but if I were you I would get whatever cheap streamer you can tolerate (RPI works fine) and save up for an Aurender, Playback Design or EMM Labs unit. If you can't wait that long, save up for an Auralic. Buy used if you must. Buy it nice or you will be stuck in FOTM hell.

I wouldn’t say Pi2AES as FOTM as it is on sale and a very good product that still has demand for 2.5 years now. If something is still in someone’s chain for 2.5 years then it can’t be FOTM.

 

[Powermankw]

You may not like what I am going to suggest, but if I were you I would get whatever cheap streamer you can tolerate (RPI works fine) and save up for an Aurender, Playback Design or EMM Labs unit. If you can't wait that long, save up for an Auralic. Buy used if you must. Buy it nice or you will be stuck in FOTM hell.

Well sure, maybe one day. I have yet to decide if I want to sink money back into another physical inventory with hi-res files. A server would make some sense. But that isn't today. I need something to feed a DAC. I can do what most do and use a DDC/USB chain... But I am willing to go I2S. Plus I really do not want to connect to PC since my ports are limited. I would much rather use modem, so for now, seems to be a good option.