[earfonia]

Is this with the undampened filters? I have heard the same with my pm4 with the undampened filters. But it gets better using the dampened filters. I can lend you my pm4 to try. I live in singapore as well.

Thanks! Do you know Zeppelin the headphone shop, i go there almost weekly. We can meet there. Tx!

 

[WhiteKnite]

BTW do you experience the issue in both channels or just one?  Did you try measuring both L and R and comparing you results (and those odd THD readings)?

 

[FUYU]

Comb filtering is a phase issue.  This could be could be related to reflections or differences in driver distance.  Check out this video if you are curious for a great description of comb filtering. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0NQwQuSMFk  We need someone with a good measurement setup to run a waterfall graph and see if that is what you guys are hearing.  

Thanks for clarification.
Totally dismissed the fact that phase is not only determined by the distance of the drivers.

 

[myemaildw]

I can't believe, either.
I'm in Japan and waiting for almost three weeks((

it's free post, two weeks from England to Ireland usually one week or five days, so to jp or South America is respectively farther than closest next country

more impressions basically worth the money I would put it next to flare r2a or better overall nice bass, pretty much best bass I used so far so for me even though it's not audeze lcd2 cleanness but so is cheaper too, does make me want to be jealous whoever is buying pm6 or hunter, I opted for noble x instead lol

 

[wes1099]

Take a tip you don't use, cut a piece off the core, slide over nozzle. Then put tip on and it will act as a spacer giving you a deeper insertion.

I haven't been able to make that work very well with the pm4 for some reason

 

[thatonenoob]

  I've ordered 2x PM4, and so far only received 1 unit. I'm not really sure if my unit is in good condition, because of my impressions so far, and also some of my friends' impressions that have tried my unit, are not very positive and quite different from the review that I've read.
 
I have no issue with the tonality, more bass or less bass, and treble, they are tunable with filters. But my main concern is the fuzziness in the midrange. The midrange sounds fuzzy, with rather average or below average instrument separation. Beside poor instrument separation, the soundstage is rather congested as well, smaller imaging than what I use to experience with my other IEMs. Doesn't matter which filter I use, which I've tried all, the fuzziness is still there. My friends (@thatonenoob, @audio123, and others) also heard the fuzziness in the midrange.
 
Anyway, I will hold my judgment for now, until I hear more units of PM4 in Singapore. Hopefully, it is only my 1st PM4 unit that has a fuzzy midrange, and others would sound fine.

Thanks to @earfonia, I did indeed have the opportunity to try his PM4.  I would like to share a few of my thoughts regarding the PM4.  
 
I would have pulled out my measurement rig and taken a look at the PM4, if it weren't for the fact that I am currently moving from one side of the Pacific to the other.  My earphone measurement coupler is not as refined as @earfonia's and is slightly different for that matter.  For verification purposes though, I think it would have sufficed.   Personally, I do have good confidence in his rig, and he has performed a wide variety of measurements successfully in the past.  Without divulging personal details, I would say that @earfonia is very qualified, and in fact it would be slightly ironic to doubt his skills.  It is very much possible that there could be interactions between the rig and earphones, and that this is leading to the "artifacts" seen.  However, context is required.
 
I had originally bugged @earfonia to share details regarding the distortion of these earphones because it sounded off to me.  In fact, my original encounter with the PM4 was rather unique.  I was listening to a pure vocal track, and the vocals seemed to dip in and out regularly.  At one moment, it would sound rather okay, and at the next, be completely off.  This is something I did not encounter with a more conventional tunable earphone like the FLC8S -or for that matter, any of my own earphones/ headphones.  With the Gmetal filter, bass had lots of reverb but also lacked body, coming across as being somewhat hollow.  Highs were weird, not quite articulate...switching through the filters only produced an odd emphasis that seemed out of place.  
 
It could be that this unit is simply broken -we will have to see when the second one arrives.

 

[WhiteKnite]

  Thanks to @earfonia, I did indeed have the opportunity to try his PM4.  I would like to share a few of my thoughts regarding the PM4.  
 
I would have pulled out my measurement rig and taken a look at the PM4, if it weren't for the fact that I am currently moving from one side of the Pacific to the other.  My earphone measurement coupler is not as refined as @earfonia's and is slightly different for that matter.  For verification purposes though, I think it would have sufficed.   Personally, I do have good confidence in his rig, and he has performed a wide variety of measurements successfully in the past.  Without divulging personal details, I would say that @earfonia is very qualified, and in fact it would be slightly ironic to doubt his skills.  It is very much possible that there could be interactions between the rig and earphones, and that this is leading to the "artifacts" seen.  However, context is required.
 
I had originally bugged @earfonia to share details regarding the distortion of these earphones because it sounded off to me.  In fact, my original encounter with the PM4 was rather unique.  I was listening to a pure vocal track, and the vocals seemed to dip in and out regularly.  At one moment, it would sound rather okay, and at the next, be completely off.  This is something I did not encounter with a more conventional tunable earphone like the FLC8S -or for that matter, any of my own earphones/ headphones.  With the Gmetal filter, bass had lots of reverb but also lacked body, coming across as being somewhat hollow.  Highs were weird, not quite articulate...switching through the filters only produced an odd emphasis that seemed out of place.  
 
It could be that this unit is simply broken -we will have to see when the second one arrives.

I have measured about 5 sets of iems with a very similar rig to what he described and I have always had THD readings in the normal, expected range.  It is definitely out of the ordinary.  Was that happening on both channels?  And what is the source?  Have you tried measuring from a different source?  I wonder if these issues could be related to output impedance.  

 

[peter123]

Thanks to @earfonia
, I did indeed have the opportunity to try his PM4.  I would like to share a few of my thoughts regarding the PM4.  

I would have pulled out my measurement rig and taken a look at the PM4, if it weren't for the fact that I am currently moving from one side of the Pacific to the other.  My earphone measurement coupler is not as refined as @earfonia
's and is slightly different for that matter.  For verification purposes though, I think it would have sufficed.   Personally, I do have good confidence in his rig, and he has performed a wide variety of measurements successfully in the past.  Without divulging personal details, I would say that @earfonia
 is very qualified, and in fact it would be slightly ironic to doubt his skills.  It is very much possible that there could be interactions between the rig and earphones, and that this is leading to the "artifacts" seen.  However, context is required.

I had originally bugged @earfonia
 to share details regarding the distortion of these earphones because it sounded off to me.  In fact, my original encounter with the PM4 was rather unique.  I was listening to a pure vocal track, and the vocals seemed to dip in and out regularly.  At one moment, it would sound rather okay, and at the next, be completely off.  This is something I did not encounter with a more conventional tunable earphone like the FLC8S -or for that matter, any of my own earphones/ headphones.  With the Gmetal filter, bass had lots of reverb but also lacked body, coming across as being somewhat hollow.  Highs were weird, not quite articulate...switching through the filters only produced an odd emphasis that seemed out of place.  

It could be that this unit is simply broken -we will have to see when the second one arrives.

My pair arrived today and this is exactly my impression as well upon initial listening. When I took them out of the ears to try different filters the left filter stayed in my ear and now I'm not able to fit any filter properly to the left earpiece. Needless to say I'm not impressed. I did get the SpinFit tips though lol.

Also, my package was posted two weeks ago not three as stated here....

 

[Hi-Fi'er]

Glad I got the PM6 not the PM4 if mids are an issue.

 

[Kundi]

Glad I got the PM6 not the PM4 if mids are an issue.

I as well got the PM6, but i am concerned about the issues with the PM4 with filters and getting a proper seal and whether this will be an issue for the PM6. That was the one thing i did not like about the Altas, although all the other iems i bought from Trinity did not have this problem. (Vyrus and Delta)

 

[Jackpot77]

I as well got the PM6, but i am concerned about the issues with the PM4 with filters and getting a proper seal and whether this will be an issue for the PM6. That was the one thing i did not like about the Altas, although all the other iems i bought from Trinity did not have this problem. (Vyrus and Delta)

If the PM6 has stayed the same in terms of shell design since Canjam London, I found it very ergonomic for my ears. I struggle to get a good fit with the Sabre due to the shape of my ear canals so I think the PM6 will be a more "universal" fit than the PM4.

 

[Hi-Fi'er]

I as well got the PM6, but i am concerned about the issues with the PM4 with filters and getting a proper seal and whether this will be an issue for the PM6. That was the one thing i did not like about the Altas, although all the other iems i bought from Trinity did not have this problem. (Vyrus and Delta)

Right. Seal can be fixed by different sized tips mostly. I am more concerned about the mid issue the PM4 maybe having? That won't be fixable. I hope the PM6's extra drivers corrects this mid issue (if there really is one) and or will be tuned differently. I have the original Atlas and it's very nice and enjoy them.

 

[Lurk650]

My pair arrived today and this is exactly my impression as well upon initial listening. When I took them out of the ears to try different filters the left filter stayed in my ear and now I'm not able to fit any filter properly to the left earpiece. Needless to say I'm not impressed. I did get the SpinFit tips though lol.

Also, my package was posted two weeks ago not three as stated here....

Well I called it with them actually shipping it later than they did. Both have an awful sound and in your case Peter the left housing is worthless bc nozzles don't really work. Even with all this time it seems things were rushed and QC is a big issue, which also seems to be a common thing with past Trinity products. Even with quick replacement of parts and even whole IEMs that doesn't necessarily make up for these issues.

I'm only stating my concerns as somebody who has the PM6 on preorder and is now on the verge of cancelling it. Low cost means corners had to be cut somewhere and it appears its QC

 

[Bobtrinity]

Well I called it with them actually shipping it later than they did. Both have an awful sound and in your case Peter the left housing is worthless bc nozzles don't really work. Even with all this time it seems things were rushed and QC is a big issue, which also seems to be a common thing with past Trinity products. Even with quick replacement of parts and even whole IEMs that doesn't necessarily make up for these issues.

I'm only stating my concerns as somebody who has the PM6 on preorder and is now on the verge of cancelling it. Low cost means corners had to be cut somewhere and it appears its QC

There is an announcement coming which will address any QC and what we are doing. 
 
We have had to make some MASSIVE changes recently and what we are doing should address any issues and will give you something to smile about. 
 
Sorry if its a little cryptic but we need to finalise all the details.

 

[peter123]

Well I called it with them actually shipping it later than they did. Both have an awful sound and in your case Peter the left housing is worthless bc nozzles don't really work. Even with all this time it seems things were rushed and QC is a big issue, which also seems to be a common thing with past Trinity products. Even with quick replacement of parts and even whole IEMs that doesn't necessarily make up for these issues.

I'm only stating my concerns as somebody who has the PM6 on preorder and is now on the verge of cancelling it. Low cost means corners had to be cut somewhere and it appears its QC

Yeah, I'm actually more disappointed than surprised. I'm sure I'll be taken care of but honestly I'd have preferred a working product to start with rather than relying on customer service, especially considering that I ordered my pair in May and was super hyped to finally hear them.

I've emailed (poor) Jake though so nuff said