[Yarbles]

Blank statements like that are going to get real old real fast around here. Just some friendly advice.

I appreciate the friendly advice. I'm brand new to this forum stuff & with something like this it feels like I'm walking on eggshells. I get it though & I appreciate the way you explained it.

 

[gLer]

But you're allowed to be an absolute gobshite and say things like 'most here don’t have to rely on their work history or background to be able to reinforce their opinion as more valid than others'???

Extremely rude & totally uncalled for.

Be careful your hands aren't dirty before you start pointing fingers.

One last time, if you're going to start calling out established members of this community with aggressive retort, you won't be welcome here much longer. That's the last I'll say on that matter. It's not too late, just learn some basic etiquette. Or, don't. Your call.

 

[warrenpchi]

But you're allowed to be an absolute gobshite

Our terms and rules tend to frown upon this as well:

1. Be polite. We encourage debating in the forums, but please avoid defamatory statements, personal attacks, racial slurs, name-calling, and cursing at others in the forums.

https://www.head-fi.org/articles/terms-of-service.6725/#etiquette

 

[Yarbles]

I rest my case

One last time, if you're going to start calling out established members of this community with aggressive retort, you won't be welcome here much longer. That's the last I'll say on that matter. It's not too late, just learn some basic etiquette. Or, don't. Your call.

I think you'll find he was extremely out of line. It's it's that cliquey that your 'established member' is allowed to sneer down his nose at me & that gets a pass, I'll see myself out.

 

[BS5711]

One last time, if you're going to start calling out established members of this community with aggressive retort, you won't be welcome here much longer. That's the last I'll say on that matter. It's not too late, just learn some basic etiquette. Or, don't. Your call.

Yarbles was venturing his opinion and he gets called out for that. Where is the basic etiquette for him ?

Is it only established users of this forum that are allowed an opinion that might not be in line with others and who justify etiquette ?

I have dealt with Yarbles elsewhere and while he has an abrupt nature he is obviously passionate about this hobby and music and frankly I personally find his approach a breath of fresh air because he doesn’t just follow the usual mindset present in most audio chat.

 

[DunninLA]

RE: Pressurizing the room / aka pressurizing your ear canal

I've noticed in watching loudspeaker reviews that a phrase has come up often with regard to using subwoofers in addition to speakers that already handle frequencies down to 30 Hz.... "pressurizing the room", as in "Sure I have the best speakers money can buy (usually referring to speakers, whether baffleless, horned, or 7' tall arrays that cost over $300k) , but I use subs because when I listen I want to be enveloped in the sound, and that includes pressurizing the entire room... and subs do that best"

With IEMs, I think that refers to an IEM's ability to adequately produce frequencies in the 25-35 Hz range. Anyway, what I have noticed using EQ on various IEMs but currently with my Canon 2, I find the stock bass switches 1up 1down to be too much, so I run them Down/Down. Yet, I still like to elevate 32Hz by 1.7db. I can feel a little THUMP in my ear canal. I think what I am doing is the equivalent of "pressurizing the room" that loudspeaker owners refer to. When I increase 64Hz, I don't feel that pressurization at all.

Any of you guys elevate just 32Hz for that reason?

 

[warrenpchi]

Yarbles was venturing his opinion and he gets called out for that. Where is the basic etiquette for him ?

Well, of course he can state his opinion. And to that end, I'd venture that it was entirely possible for him to state his opinion without dismissing somebody else's opinion. For example, the following - edited to remove his dismissive comment - would have been just fine:

This is proven nonsense. I know we're not supposed to be negative here - but this isn't negative, it's a total myth & as the other chap had suggested/as science has proven time & time again, the only thing that can possibly happen is that they will deteriorate in quality.

---

Is it only established users of this forum that are allowed an opinion that might not be in line with others and justify etiquette ?

Not at all. And in fact, it's because he's new here that I'm discussing this and treating it as a learning experience for everybody. Most (if not all) of the other moderators would have simply started deleting posts by now. But I remain hopeful that we can reach some clarity here, and move on productively.

 

[gLer]

Yarbles was venturing his opinion and he gets called out for that. Where is the basic etiquette for him ?

Is it only established users of this forum that are allowed an opinion that might not be in line with others and justify etiquette ?

I have dealt with Yarbles elsewhere and while he has an abrupt nature he is obviously passionate about this hobby and music and frankly I personally find his approach a breath of fresh air.

There's nothing wrong with sharing opinions, but there's a way to do it that doesn't get people riled up or come off as disrespectful and obnoxious. When people start calling out your abruptness, maybe take the hint instead of coming back with even more aggression? I get that this is a passionate hobby, but there's a line between passion and aggression in civil company that shouldn't be crossed and is generally frowned upon here. I'm not fussed either way, I recognised his passion, and realised he was new here, and was actually trying to help him chill out so he could feel more welcome. That didn't quite work out I guess.

 

[BS5711]

Well, of course he can state his opinion. And to that end, I'd venture that it was entirely possible for him to state his opinion without dismissing somebody else's opinion. For example, the following - edited to remove his dismissive comment - would have been just fine:

---

Not at all. And in fact, it's because he's new here that I'm discussing this and treating it as a learning experience for everybody. Most (if not all) of the other moderators would have simply started deleting posts by now. But I remain hopeful that we can reach some clarity here, and move on productively.

We have chatted before and I know you are a very reasonable guy and I totally understand and respect your comments above, genuinely.

I would like to think you took enough from our chat to understand I am a reasonable person also and I don’t say things just to stir. Like Yarbles I just don’t see the harm in venturing opinions if that is what I believe. He does take it a few steps further with the delivery of course

That said, having a different manner of communication isn’t the end of the world and some folks might do well to just look past it rather than confront him immediately because he isn’t following the usual approach to group banter here.

I don’t know if I should say this but I will for context. I got a smack on the hand for some comments here recently and the comment was made to me that what I critiqued was raised on a semi regular basis so it gets a bit old. I think that happens because there is a very distinct group think that happens in the WC and with the regular active users. That isn’t a welcoming mindset unless you also just slot tidily into the same approach. People are different and talk and communicate differently. Perhaps a little more acceptance of a more diverse approach would help alleviate some of the negative perceptions of what the WC is all about and which bring up critical comments intermittently.

Anyway, I have offered my different perspective and will leave it there.

 

[Tristy]

Same. For me I'd have paid $3000 for it. It was the biggest wow moment I've ever had with a piece of gear.

I've gone through all manner of daps, dacs/amps, dongles - you name it, even a couple of TOTL $4000-ish DAPs and they are not even close IMO.

I don't own a single other portable sound source & I'm not looking. I genuinely believe this to be perfection for personal audio when it comes to IEMs... and you can't beat perfection.

I prefer the sound of the Hiby R6 pro II by quite a margin… higher resolution to my ears.

 

[warrenpchi]

We have chatted before and I know you are a very reasonable guy and I totally understand and respect your comments above, genuinely.

I would like to think you took enough from our chat to understand I am a reasonable person also and I don’t say things just to stir.

Thanks, same here! In case you're wondering, I am in fact the "anonymous gent" that you referenced elsewhere.

He does take it a few steps further with the delivery of course

That's essentially the only issue for me. He just happened to take it a few steps further, in very specific directions that Head-Fi's terms don't allow for (which I cited/linked earlier). Other than that, I don't have any issue with how he feels about burn-in.

That said, having a different manner of communication isn’t the end of the world and some folks might do well to just look past it rather than confront him immediately because he isn’t following the usual approach to group banter here.

Hmm, perhaps, but it would be out of line for me - even as an admin - to suggest how others should behave as long as they are acting within our rules. And now that we've all had a moment's pause, maybe that could happen. I'm going to choose to be hopeful here.

I don’t know if I should say this but I will for context. I got a smack on the hand for some comments here recently and the comment was made to me that what I critiqued was raised on a semi regular basis so it gets a bit old. I think that happens because there is a very distinct group think that happens in the WC and with the regular active users. That isn’t a welcoming mindset unless you also just slot tidily into the same approach. People are different and talk and communicate differently. Perhaps a little more acceptance of a more diverse approach would help alleviate some of the negative perceptions of what the WC is all about and which bring up critical comments intermittently.

Anyway, I have offered my different perspective and will leave it there.

Thanks for that! And there's no need to stop, because now that you bring it up, there might be something we could all learn from this:

There are several long-running threads here on Head-Fi, that have developed their own subculture over time. It's unavoidable really. And as groups form, with our collective thoughts and actions guiding the evolution of these threads, I can see how it would be quite daunting for newcomers to hop in. At the very least, I can see how venturing into an established thread like this would be more fraught with the chance of mishaps?

So that said, it might not be a bad idea to learn how newcomers see this thread, and what their initial concerns were in posting here. Knowing @Rockwell75 as I do, I would say that's exactly the kind of discussion he wouldn't mind us having, so as to be more welcoming to new Watercooler members.

 

[RTodd]

I appreciate the friendly advice. I'm brand new to this forum stuff & with something like this it feels like I'm walking on eggshells. I get it though & I appreciate the way you explained it.

We learn from each other, that is part of the fun.
As long as you do not shut the door on subjects that we have debated for years now on this forum, and others, though I do believe we have reached a bit of a consensus on burn-in here. This is not the battle ground anyone should wish to die on. The combined years of listening and experience here outweighs that of any individual no matter how advanced they believe their experience or opinions are.

A better way to say you think burn-in is not real, is just that, no need to add color, just that we know which camp you are in.

Forgive me for trying to set this back on a positive course the debate is just not valuable.

 

[BS5711]

Thanks, same here! In case you're wondering, I am in fact the "anonymous gent" that you referenced elsewhere.



That's essentially the only issue for me. He just happened to take it a few steps further, in very specific directions that Head-Fi's terms don't allow for (which I cited/linked earlier). Other than that, I don't have any issue with how he feels about burn-in.



Hmm, perhaps, but it would be out of line for me - even as an admin - to suggest how others should behave as long as they are acting within our rules. And now that we've all had a moment's pause, maybe that could happen. I'm going to choose to be hopeful here.



Thanks for that! And there's no need to stop, because now that you bring it up, there might be something we could all learn from this:

There are several long-running threads here on Head-Fi, that have developed their own subculture over time. It's unavoidable really. And as groups form, with our collective thoughts and actions guiding the evolution of these threads, I can see how it would be quite daunting for newcomers to hop in. At the very least, I can see how venturing into an established thread like this would be more fraught with the chance of mishaps?

So that said, it might not be a bad idea to learn how newcomers see this thread, and what their initial concerns were in posting here. Knowing @Rockwell75 as I do, I would say that's exactly the kind of discussion he wouldn't mind having, so as to be more welcoming to new Watercooler members.

Thank you.

And I assumed that may have been you, thanks for that also, appreciated.

I don’t want to get to involved because I know Rockwell75 took exception to me based on that earlier situation and as he is the originator of the WC I don’t to lessen his probably already low tolerance for me

I will say this since I was asked:

As I see it the WC isn’t welcoming unless one slots in line. I believe that isn’t my unique opinion since apparently critical comments are a semi regular occurrence. I think the ‘problem’ if it is even that is exactly what you said insofar as a subculture has developed based on the common interest of much of the user base, probably pushed along by Rockwell75s personal interest and enthusiasm for it. That has developed such that outsiders probably have a feeling of not having a place here unless they accurately fit the mould so to speak. Frankly I don’t know how you make it more inclusive feeling for others who aren’t as deeply immersed in high end IEM and associated gear without diluting the culture it has become and no regulars would want that.

I think if the current culture remains intact the outside perception will always be a byproduct of that. Not sure there is any way around that and I am not saying there needs to be.

That said, perhaps my comments might give some users cause to consider how others outside the WC perceive the personalities here. I know many won’t care and that is perfectly okay as well.

Please don’t crucify me, I provide the above because I was asked to and in good faith with best intent. Currently the WC isn’t a place for me despite what the title description states and I am good with that.

 

[Tanalasta]

Moving on … I wanted to thank Chang for taking the time to meet me in the hotel lobby with the only set of storm they have on hand.

His technical prowess, audio memory are astounding. We had great, technical chats on everything from IEM technology, crossovers to cable science (in a good way). He has spent a lot of time searching for the best in cable materials and intentional tuning.

Storm + 8 wire sovereign is obviously territory. Needs proper source and power to drive it to potential. I had to borrow his PB5 (which has the worst step volume implementation I’ve experienced for some time but sonically is a great amp).

Scaleable and would play well out of a headphone amp (with due care) with the flat impedance tech. Can very much get happily lost with its tuning and technical aspects. Much has been said about Storm.

The two wire Sovereign is somewhat underrated. It’s a flagship cable in its own right. Whilst it doesn’t have the weight or scale of the 4 wire sonically, there is plenty there without the risk of congestion with the wrong source. It sounded fabulous with Mest 3 and has that liquid, silky “musicality” in the timbre that i search for. Think Isabellae, Trailii with the “X factor”. Ergonomically lighter, pleasant and very well balanced. Something that could synergise well with many IEM without undue colouration. Probably right up the top of cables I had the privilege of listening to this week along with Ode to Laura.

Duality. Got to hear them prototype. I like it. The bass is intentionally tuned up. I’m no bass head so would have liked the option to tune it down. A neutral duality I wouldn’t mind seeing. But many of you would probably like it. A sharp bass shelf, accentuating sub bass.

 

[linux4ever]

I want to get rid of my Maestro SE & want a bass heavy replacement. Something modern sounding, ideally with EST's. I really don't care for that seismic sub effect whereby you can feel the sub through resin shells - I can take it or leave it. I actually use my Hype 4 (my 'going out' IEM) more for drum n bass now, even at home. The SE are so V uncomfortable.

With Eletech Raphael or Moon Audio Bronze dragon cables, Maestro SE sounded very balanced without losing the Sub-bass.

Unique Melody Multiverse Mentor (CIEM)

i will let it break in for 48 hours or so before trying them.

DAP:
iBasso 320 Max TI (3400$)
Cable:
Double Helix Mini Chimera Cable (3000$)

i am coming from 64 Audio A18s, A18t and i also tried Elysian Acoustics Annihilator 2023 (stock cable)

will post initial impressions sometime next week, and follow it up with a final review later.

Multiverse Mentor doesn't need any burn-in. I pair mine with PW Audio Orpheus Shielding and these two have very good synergy. Source is Sony WM1Z